Elon Musk - the world's "greatest" spiv?

[Cloud Strife]

Tesla was vastly (and still is) overpriced, and I do wonder if they will still be around in 10 years time once their innovations start being the norm.

But I will say that I'm completely unbothered by Musk owning Twitter. I find the mess fascinating, and it's entertaining watching him send Twitter to the bottom, but something will replace it. I can easily see Meta creating a Twitter clone with integration into Facebook, Instagram and Whatsapp, and such a thing will demolish what remains of Twitter.

I see that Musk is now selling off huge amounts of stuff from the Twitter offices, even down to coffee machines. Morale there must be at rock bottom!

 

[birchesgreen]

I see that Musk is now selling off huge amounts of stuff from the Twitter offices, even down to coffee machines. Morale there must be at rock bottom!

That hard up for cash?

 

[jon0844]

If people are being told to sleep at work, why get rid of the coffee machines?

What exactly does Tesla still do that other manufacturers haven't also managed to do? Auto pilot is still way off being the level that Elon keeps promising is coming soon, and the other manufacturers probably never had panel gap issues to begin with.

The concept of OTA updates and enabling/disabling features via software is also being copied, sadly with the likes of BMW and Mercedes now taking the **** with subscription features.

So, again, what makes a Tesla so special? I always thought they looked bland inside and out, and that was before I discovered just how awful Elon Musk is.

 

[birchesgreen]

I think they can make fart noises. My Dacia can't do that.

 

[pdeaves]

I think they can make fart noises. My Dacia can't do that.

Depends on how roughly you drive, surely

 

[brad465]

I see that Musk is now selling off huge amounts of stuff from the Twitter offices, even down to coffee machines. Morale there must be at rock bottom!

It's worse than that, there are reports HQ and other office rents have not been paid for weeks:

Musk's Twitter reportedly hasn't paid rent on its office spaces for weeks

Elon Musk has recently taken drastic steps to cut costs and gear up for possible legal battles at Twitter, according to a report from The New York Times.

www.cnbc.com

In an effort to cut costs following Elon Musk’s chaotic $44 billion acquisition of Twitter, the social media company has stopped paying rent, according to a report from The New York Times.

Twitter has not paid rent for its global offices or San Francisco headquarters in weeks, the report said, as Musk’s team has been trying to renegotiate the terms of the company’s lease. As a result, Twitter has received complaints from real estate firms like Shorenstein, which owns Twitter’s San Francisco buildings.

Representatives for Shorenstein and Musk did not immediately respond to requests for comment. Twitter no longer has a communications department.

Musk said Twitter suffered a “massive drop in revenue” in the days following his $44 billion acquisition of the company. Without providing any figures or evidence, he claimed in a tweet that the revenue drop was the result of activist groups putting pressure on advertisers.

Though many companies did pause advertising on Twitter, some major advertising giants like Apple and Amazon have resumed spending on the platform.

Musk has also revamped Twitter’s subscription service, Twitter Blue, with the hope of generating fresh revenue for the company. The service launched Monday after Musk pulled and delayed the launch in November.

Twitter Blue costs $8 a month for web users and $11 a month for iOS users who purchase it through Apple’s App Store. The $3 iOS price difference reflects Musk’s recent gripes about Apple’s 30% cut of all digital sales made through apps.

Subscribers with a verified phone number will receive a blue checkmark once their account is reviewed and approved, Twitter said in a tweet Saturday. Blue users will also be able to edit tweets and get early access to new features. The company says Blue subscribers will “soon” see fewer ads, have the option to post longer videos and will appear at the top of replies and mentions.

Musk has been a vocal critic of Twitter’s previous system, which granted verification to notable users like politicians, executives, members of the press and organizations to signal their legitimacy. He said the new verification system will be “the great leveler” and give “power to the people.”

 

[JohnMcL7]

So, again, what makes a Tesla so special? I always thought they looked bland inside and out, and that was before I discovered just how awful Elon Musk is.

Their Supercharger network is a big plus for Tesla owners when a lot of other charging infrastructure is lacking although that's changing at the moment with it being opened up to non-Tesla owners. The drivetrain and battery system have also attracted a lot of praise and in the US many seem to like the self driving system although it's much more limited in Europe.

On the other hand I think a lot of it is hype and I've been shocked not just how poor the reliability of some of the Teslas but how Tesla owners will actually praise Tesla service in the case of major failures even though it shouldn't have failed in the first place. One person was explaining how they wouldn't buy anything other than a Tesla as their service had been so good when his car had suffered a catastrophic suspension failure and stuck where it had failed which I found bizarre because I'd be furious if my less than year old £90,000 car had failed in such a way in the first place. I know someone's Tesla that had to be towed back to the dealer four times in the first 18 months from new and in one case a lack of parts meant it was off the road for three months, looking at reliability surveys Tesla really don't fare well.

There are some Musk die hards whatever he does but there seems to be a fair number of more left leaning people who have bought a Tesla and not at all happy with Musk's current attitude putting them off Tesla cars. I agree about the cars being very bland and I think if you debadged a Kia EV6, Hyundai Ioniq6 and a Tesla Model 3 and asked people to pick out the Hyundai, Kia and the exciting new electric car company revolutionising the car market you'd think the model 3 is the Hyundai or Kia and the EV6 or Ioniq6 were the Tesla. The Tesla designs remind me of the Hyundais and Kias back about ten to twenty years ago.

 

[GusB]

It's worse than that, there are reports HQ and other office rents have not been paid for weeks:

Musk's Twitter reportedly hasn't paid rent on its office spaces for weeks

Elon Musk has recently taken drastic steps to cut costs and gear up for possible legal battles at Twitter, according to a report from The New York Times.

www.cnbc.com

So Twitter's employees may end up working from home again, because there is no office to go to. You really couldn't make this up!

 

[pdeaves]

It's worse than that, there are reports HQ and other office rents have not been paid for weeks:

How do you get obscenely rich? Apparently, steal!

 

[birchesgreen]

How do you get obscenely rich? Apparently, steal!

Well yes basically.

 

[takno]

How do you get obscenely rich? Apparently, steal!

He's just sticking it to the man. Although of course he is also the man.

 

[tbtc]

I think he was interesting a few years ago, when he first started SpaceX and Tesla. But increasingly I'm of the view that he doesn't realise that he got lucky with PayPal, making the right thing at the right time, and instead has started to believe those who see him as some sort of visionary. I feel it's particularly appealing to those on the right in America, who love fawning at the "self-made millionaire" vibe, hence why he's ended up in/constructed an echo-chamber of such types.

Ultimately, if we rewound the universe a 100 times, and replayed Elons life with some normal variations. I think we would find his success was just a fluke.

Those are very good points

Certain people were in the right place at the right time to benefit from the heady days of Internet boom - there was a clear need to create stable/ trustworthy online payments (PayPal) - and a clear need for a site like eBay to embrace this technology (because, by buying PayPal, they were ensuring a reliable way for individuals to send money to other individuals - especially crucial in the early days of the auction site when people were nervous of online transactions and before eBay became dominated by dedicated businesses)…

…so whoever came up with (or, rather, invested in) PayPal looks like they were backing a winner in hindsight - but how do you replicate that in today’s mature market? The “gaps in the market” all look to be filled.

If you’re the “genius” who took a punt on PayPal, it’s going to be hard to accept that this was probably a one-off - so you get evangelical about the magic future of, erm, building tunnels or colonising Mars, because it sounds like a sexy future, and some people want to believe in optimism - he doesn’t seem to be able to replicate the earlier success though - Tesla had some “first mover advantage” but will get overtaken/ ignored over time - it must be hard to accept that you just happened to win the lottery once rather than being a “Born Winner”

 

[thenorthern]

Elon Musk was always the lovable billionaire, he was only seen as doing good things such as saving the environment. Rather like how in the 2000s Richard Branson was the lovable billionaire when we had "Virginmania" and Virgin everything such as train, planes, cola, mobiles, radio and a lot more. However things such as the Virgin Care venture, the tax status of Virgin group & Sir Richard Branson as well as the demands for a government bailout for Virgin Atlantic all really tarnished the Virgin Group name.

In the United States Elon Musk was worshiped by Bernie Sanders supporters because of his eco credentials at Tesla and he was seen as the man who would save the planet. Going into the 2020 election there was hope amongst Bernie Sanders supporters that Elon musk would endose Bernie. However in the end Elon Musk started making a lot of negative comments about Bernie Sanders and his policies which isn't really a surprise as Elon Musk is a billionaire businessman who doesn't want to pay high taxes and have a lot of government regulation. Bernie Sanders supporters then felt betrayed by Elon and that is where we have ended up since then.

 

[Cloud Strife]

the tax status of Virgin group & Sir Richard Branson

In Branson's defence, he actually does seem to be genuinely non-resident, unlike a lot of the others. I remember reading an interview with him a few years back, and he was very clear that Necker Island gave him a far superior quality of life over living in the UK. I seem to remember that the press looked at his tax affairs, and most of what he was doing was giving speeches/public appearances in exchange for large donations to charity.

He did make some wrong moves, but I don't think he fits into the conventional 'rich tax dodger' category simply because he prefers to live most of his life on Necker Island.

It's worse than that, there are reports HQ and other office rents have not been paid for weeks:

You have to wonder just how bad the finances really are. I wouldn't be shocked to discover at this point that Apple and Amazon were offered free (or very low cost) advertising simply so Twitter could keep them as clients.

 

[thenorthern]

In Branson's defence, he actually does seem to be genuinely non-resident, unlike a lot of the others. I remember reading an interview with him a few years back, and he was very clear that Necker Island gave him a far superior quality of life over living in the UK. I seem to remember that the press looked at his tax affairs, and most of what he was doing was giving speeches/public appearances in exchange for large donations to charity.

He did make some wrong moves, but I don't think he fits into the conventional 'rich tax dodger' category simply because he prefers to live most of his life on Necker Island.

It's more when he was asking for taxpayer bailouts for Virgin Atlantic despite the fact that both he and the ultimate Virgin Group are domiciled in the British Virgin Islands. Also when Hurricane Irma hit the British Virgin Islands he was asking for aid from the British government to rebuild the British Virgin Islands which again is controversial given the islands status as a tax haven.

 

[AlterEgo]

He’s suspended the @elonjet account which tweeted his aircraft’s movements and carbon emissions, as well as the creator of that account. Just running things as a personal fiefdom.

He’s a small man with credulous fans.

 

[birchesgreen]

He’s suspended the @elonjet account which tweeted his aircraft’s movements and carbon emissions, as well as the creator of that account. Just running things as a personal fiefdom.

He’s a small man with credulous fans.

But but but free speech?

 

[GatwickDepress]

He’s suspended the @elonjet account which tweeted his aircraft’s movements and carbon emissions, as well as the creator of that account. Just running things as a personal fiefdom.

He’s a small man with credulous fans.

Now he's taking legal action againt Jack Sweeney, the account's creator. I can imagine the Electronic Frontier Foundation are salivating at the chance to represent Mr. Sweeney, as everything he posted was publicly available information.

 

[jon0844]

Besides selling off office furniture and kitchen equipment to save money (even though you asked staff back to work and to sleep in the office), the latest idea is just stop paying rent. Full stop. Every office around the world.

And don't pay severance either. I mean, if you don't want to then you don't have to, right?

Again, this channel is left leaning so you may just put this down to bias and there's a perfectly good explanation of why Elon is actually a genius.

 

[Cloud Strife]

the latest idea is just stop paying rent. Full stop. Every office around the world.

I am actually convinced at this moment that Twitter are deep, deep in financial trouble. While this might be some sort of "look at me, Billy big-balls" move, it seems much more likely that he's desperately trying to slash costs to the bone so that the company can post a profit on paper. Not paying rent will mean that they get evicted, which will let them get rid of all the non-US staff.

He’s suspended the @elonjet account which tweeted his aircraft’s movements and carbon emissions, as well as the creator of that account.

And yet he's just posted a video of some guy that was heckling him, along with the guy's number plate.

He's also just sold off more Tesla shares, which suggests that he's in need of some finance...

 

[brad465]

Musk has banned Twitter's Mastodon account, along with several journalists. Free speech my...

 

[AlterEgo]

Musk has banned Twitter's Mastodon account, along with several journalists. Free speech my...

Important to add those journalists were very critical of him.

 

[birchesgreen]

Typical far-right "free speech" hypocrite then.

 

[jon0844]

Typical far-right "free speech" hypocrite then.

Now he's saying the bans are just for seven days apparently.

He's literally making things up as he goes, just as I expect he does at Tesla, SpaceX and more.

Why do people want to work for him?

 

[birchesgreen]

Now he's saying the bans are just for seven days apparently.

He's literally making things up as he goes, just as I expect he does at Tesla, SpaceX and more.

Why do people want to work for him?

Well i guess in the cases of SpaceX and Tesla the overall end result might be worth the nonsense to get there, with Twitter though... hmm

 

[RichJF]

Well i guess in the cases of SpaceX and Tesla the overall end result might be worth the nonsense to get there, with Twitter though... hmm

The son of a family friend works for Tesla. He's high up in the design team.

In his words "Musk is a pr**k but the salary was so life-changing it was hard to turn down".

 

[tbtc]

The worrying thing is that the incels are so invested in him that they won’t see the hypocrisy here; he’s reached that Trump stage where the vast majority of his supporters are so far down the rabbit hole that it no longer matters that his actions are clearly the opposite of his rhetoric

Someone RT’d an old Elon tweet from 25 April 2022 into my timeline this morning, where he was banging on about free speech:

“I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means”

No mention of “I support free speech BUT with seven day blocks and shadow bans and other random moderation depending on my mood”, but it doesn’t matter any more, he’s got to the “Four Legs Good, Two Legs BETTER” state of the revolution and his acolytes are too far gone to realise the hypocrisy

I could understand the desire to get various alt-right accounts unbanned, since Twitter’s business model must involve an element of attracting far-out comments to engage and enrage people into interacting - I’m no fan of Trump but I can see the logic in Musk courting him to try to make Twitter something that everyone is talking about. Banning Tech journalists just looks weak and petty though, there’s no rational justification (other than “the guy who banned any accounts that made fun of him now has hurty feelings about people who scrutinise him and question the quality of the new clothes that the emperor is wearing”)

 

[jon0844]

He's also got certain posts mentioning Mastodon flagged as misleading. It seems the flagging depends on the author, so perhaps it is for (original) verified members of the press.

 

[MikeWM]

As I said a few days ago, Musk's actions are provoking some interesting debates about free speech, that we really do need to have. The current trend to call for the censorship of 'anything I don't agree with' is deeply troubling *whoever* does it. I've seen this from both left and right for some years now, being delighted when somebody from the other 'tribe' gets de-platformed but outraged when it is one of their own, and far too many people on all sides don't see that we need freedom of speech for *everyone*.

Admittedly I can't resist a little bit of a satisfied smirk when those who spend much of their time calling for censorship of others end up being censored themselves. 'First they came for...', after all.

That said, of course I oppose Musk wielding arbitrary power and suppressing speech in this way, just as much as I opposed pre-Musk twitter doing much the same. I hope these bans are reversed and we don't see any more of them.

 

[Dent]

The current trend to call for the censorship of 'anything I don't agree with' is deeply troubling *whoever* does it.

Does such a trend really exist, or is that just strawman?

I have never seen anyone actually saying that anything should be censored purely on the grounds of personally disagreeing with something, I have however seen many people being falsely accused of saying that when they actually said was that something should be removed because it is misleading or demonstrably harmful.