Euston station "no longer in fit condition": how should this problem be resolved?

[yorkie]

Euston Station is no longer in fit condition, says rail minister

Lord Hendy said the terminus had deteriorated to the point where its marble columns are held together by bands.

www.bbc.co.uk

Euston Station in central London has deteriorated to the point where its marble columns are held together by bands because parts "would fall off without them", the rail minister has said.

"These inspections include the metal straps which were installed some years ago on the station’s external columns to keep the original 1960’s decorative marble cladding secure," they said.

How could these problems be resolved?

Note that to avoid duplication of discussion, please note that we do already have several threads regarding other matters pertaining Euston, such as:

Euston Boarding Changes - pros and cons

At the risk of duplicating something buried in the megathread in the Stations section. I wanted to ask if anyone has any insight about this? Changes seem to have been demanded by the government after a media swirl, but there must be reasons why it was done that way in the first place. Have...

www.railforums.co.uk

How to improve Euston station

I'd like to see the precinct outside covered over, which could be done tastefully and would create a pleasant space for people to wait in. Currently it's a haze of cigarette and vape smoke, and as detailed in the news article, not nice to use in the rain. It always feels slightly threatening...

www.railforums.co.uk

How to make the boarding experience at Euston safer and more pleasant

Moderator note: Split from https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/dangerous-boarding-procedures-at-euston.259871/ The whole of Euston's buildings should be quickly removed and fully rebuilt, not waiting for HS2 or the Armageddon. Should be two large sets of barriers for 1-10, and one for 11-16+...

www.railforums.co.uk

Rooftop park proposal for Euston

This week's Camden New Journal reports on a presentation last Monday (February 12th) at the Architectural Association School of Architecture in Bloomsbury that proposes putting a 'forest park' on top of Euston station, with - if I read it correctly - a linear park running from it, all the way to...

www.railforums.co.uk

Euston overcrowding

I've commuted into and out of Euston for 20+ years and tonight was the worst management I've ever seen and pretty dangerous. I'm usually pretty laid back and disruption and crowds happen but tonight was so bad I wanted to share my experience. I arrived about 1730 and came up through the...

www.railforums.co.uk

UK rail minister got engineer sacked for raising safety concerns

The U.K. government’s new transport minister got an award-winning railway engineer sacked for speaking to the media about safety concerns at one of Britain’s busiest stations, POLITICO can reveal. In his previous role running government-owned infrastructure manager Network Rail, Peter Hendy...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[HSTEd]

Well the conceptually simplest way is to remove the existing buildings.

Columns can't be falling apart if there are no columns.

 

[Halifaxlad]

Well the conceptually simplest way is to remove the existing buildings.

Columns can't be falling apart if there are no columns.

Perhaps a new station could be built to the West then either all or partially services temporarily transfered over whilst this station is rebuilt ?

The large site to the West makes a perfect opportunity.

 

[Nottingham59]

How could these problems be resolved?

Remove the marble cladding from the columns. It's only decorative

 

[Russel]

I looked out for the banding on Thursday after reading about it in the news, there's a considerable amount holding things together!

 

[edwin_m]

I'd have thought it would be easy enough in principle to re-fix or replace the marble cladding around the columns one by one, although not helped by having to cordon off part of a very crowded space.

 

[Vespa]

Much easier to demolish the carbuncle and start afresh, the brutalist design is no longer viable in modern traffic requirement and it replaced an historic station in its turn.

 

[The Planner]

Much easier to demolish the carbuncle and start afresh, the brutalist design is no longer viable in modern traffic requirement and it replaced an historic station in its turn.

Historic station that also wasnt fit for purpose?

 

[Bartsimho]

It needs a complete rebuild and redesign to improve flows to make it safe but to also make it just generally more hospitable. Especially as completely rebuilding it could make it have better Bus/Taxi connections and a more integrated HS2 building as well at least in terms of flow from one building to the other.

Also some money could be made from building upwards and offering dual usage. Have some business units in there as well as a hotel and it can be making money from other functions as well.

You'd want a large and light trainshed roof as that promotes a better, calmer atmosphere. I think in general high ceilings and more natural light is to be encouraged taking a large chunk of design ideas from Paddington station although I also think Cardington Street should be removed completely to make it a large pedestrian space between the Mainline and HS2 platforms. I'm unsure how deep the tube tunnels are but you could move it underground and have it for Busses and Taxis only

 

[AlastairFraser]

Demolish and rebuild with sale of large very high value office space on top to fund it. Give a DBFO contract for the project, and then transfer to NR for a peppercorn price, once the sale of office space is completed.

 

[urbophile]

Remove the marble cladding from the columns. It's only decorative

'Only' decorative! So removing the cladding would turn an arguably respectable modernist building -admittedly not fit for purpose - into something that is neither use nor ornament.

The original 'Great Hall' was undoubtedly beautiful. People have told me that it couldn't be saved because it was win the way of platform expansion. I'd have thought that decent architects could have managed to do both, but be that as it may. The present concourse, in its original design, is a beautiful minimalist space – it is spoilt by overcrowding and too many extraneous structures. If shop and restaurants etc were relocated to additional concourse west of the present one, it would relieve the overcrowding and allow the present one to regain its original purpose as an uncluttered assembly space.

 

[Vespa]

Historic station that also wasnt fit for purpose?

I've not been inside the old Euston so cannot compare.

I will say St Pancras and King's Cross have adapted for modern passenger flows with little issue, I recall the Euston scramble every time and it's dangerous if you have mobility difficulties and getting knocked over.

 

[Hadders]

As I understand it, high rise development above Euston station is a essentially a non-starter due to the Protected View of St Paul's Cathereral from Primrose Hill.

 

[Bletchleyite]

As I understand it, high rise development above Euston station is a essentially a non-starter due to the Protected View of St Paul's Cathereral from Primrose Hill.

At some point, with the housing crisis, we will have to decide if London is a serious world class city or a museum. It can't be both.

Protected views are an utter nonsense.

 

[Hadders]

Protected views are an utter nonsense.

They're really not. But we risk taking this thread off topic by discussing it here.

 

[Class15]

Protected views are an utter nonsense.

I disagree strongly and that’s your opinion not fact.

 

[AlastairFraser]

As I understand it, high rise development above Euston station is a essentially a non-starter due to the Protected View of St Paul's Cathereral from Primrose Hill.

How high can you go without obstructing the view? It's a large site to build on in probably some of the best areas in the country for high-quality office space, so any development would only need a few stories to offer a massive amount of space.

 

[Hadders]

How high can you go without obstructing the view? It's a large site to build on in probably some of the best areas in the country for high-quality office space, so any development would only need a few stories to offer a massive amount of space.

@Bald Rick said this back in 2017:

40 Melton St (the old Railtrack House) is outside the protected view corridor; looking at St Pauls from Primrose Hill, 40 Melton St (14 stories) is well off to the right and out of the way. It is limited to this height as although it is out of the main protected view corridor, it is in the 'wider setting' corridor and must be therefore appear to be no higher than the top of St Pauls' main dome. As an aside I regard the view from the south east corner of the 13th or 14th floor as just about the best view of central London available, as there is nothing in the way to St Pauls and the city. (Guess where the CEOs office was).

1 Eversholt St is however just to the left of St Pauls, and in the corridor. It is just clear of the main dome, however to make this tower subservient to St Pauls it is restricted to 10 stories and is lower than the bottom of the main dome. The top of the block is also level with the horizon behind, which is Blackheath. Interestingly, there is a protected view from this other direction diametrically opposite and means nothing can be built that would appear to be behind St Pauls from Blackheath.

Then there is Evergreen House (160 Euston Road). Although you can communicate from the higher floors of this building to the top floors of 1 Eversholt St by morse code (it's less than 100metres away), from Primrose Hill it is again well out of the way. It is still, however limited in height for the same reasons as 40 Melton St.

The whole subject is one that is testing the re-developers of Euston. Expect some very interesting building!

 

[Nottingham59]

It's a large site to build on in probably some of the best areas in the country for high-quality office space, so any development would only need a few stories to offer a massive amount of space.

Euston is a small footprint compared to say the Kings Cross redevelopment, and really isn't that attractive to developers.

Why blighted Euston station risks reopening the HS2 money pit

Labour must battle local scepticism and secure private cash to deliver a King’s Cross-style renaissance

www.telegraph.co.uk

Sceptics say that at 60 acres, the footprint of Euston is ultimately too small to attract the levels of investment being sought, with scope for development limited to the area immediately above the existing station, together with a handful of side streets.

That’s in contrast to nearby King’s Cross, once notorious for crime, urban decay and prostitution, but now the poster child for UK station renewal, where a far larger area of sprawling former railway yards and brownfield plots were picked for construction.

 

[Bartsimho]

Euston is a small footprint compared to say the Kings Cross redevelopment, and really isn't that attractive to developers.

With the land value though it could really be used to reimburse the cost of the rebuild as it looks like it'll have to be done anyway so why not try and get some money back. I think it's like 200 metres across the front of the site and 4 stories is usually classified as 12-15 metres. I'd also say you'd want to keep the trainshed having nothing above it for safety but also to improve station experience

 

[bramling]

Euston is a small footprint compared to say the Kings Cross redevelopment, and really isn't that attractive to developers.

Why blighted Euston station risks reopening the HS2 money pit

Labour must battle local scepticism and secure private cash to deliver a King’s Cross-style renaissance

www.telegraph.co.uk

I’d imagine Euston would also be quite an awkward site as the platforms are at the same level as the neighbouring streets (unlike for example Liverpool Street) and also tight up close. Any development would end up being a very complex, and therefore risky, project.

As regards King’s Cross, there’s still some rather dodgy streets in the area. It isn’t a complete utopia by any means, even if it is somewhat better than a couple of generations ago.

 

[Joe Paxton]

Euston Station is no longer in fit condition, says rail minister

Lord Hendy said the terminus had deteriorated to the point where its marble columns are held together by bands.

www.bbc.co.uk

How could these problems be resolved?

In the short term, the immediate problem - the marble cladding - has been ameliorated. As an aside, I can't help but think of the number of public buildings around the country that have similar (though often far more severe) issues of deterioration accompanied by a variety of temporary fixes.

The longer term picture is obviously that of a significant redevelopment of Euston station, in conjunction with the arrival of HS2. And this I presume is what lays behind Peter Hendy's comments here - ensuring that such a redevelopment stays on the agenda and doesn't get forgotten about.

 

[urbophile]

Is it in this thread or somewhere else that the idea of a linear park above the tracks into Euston was mentioned? If property developers aren't that interested in building there, this would be an excellent use of the space (indeed, it would be even if they were). It's a particularly dusty and grey area of London which needs more green sites. Check out Gare Montparnasse in Paris for ideas (but this could be a lot larger.)

 

[AlastairFraser]

@Bald Rick said this back in 2017:

So it seems ten stories is the answer! Even with a Euston station including 2 floors of concourse and retail area above the platforms, that would still allow you 7 stories of office development on top.

Euston is a small footprint compared to say the Kings Cross redevelopment, and really isn't that attractive to developers.

Why blighted Euston station risks reopening the HS2 money pit

Labour must battle local scepticism and secure private cash to deliver a King’s Cross-style renaissance

www.telegraph.co.uk

I'd take anything the Telegraph say with a pinch of salt, as they clearly don't believe in public investment into the rebuilding of railway infrastructure. I don't think the size of the area will be a huge issue, given the location is incredibly valuable.

With the land value though it could really be used to reimburse the cost of the rebuild as it looks like it'll have to be done anyway so why not try and get some money back. I think it's like 200 metres across the front of the site and 4 stories is usually classified as 12-15 metres. I'd also say you'd want to keep the trainshed having nothing above it for safety but also to improve station experience

The trainshed is most of the area of the station site, so you'd need to build on that to get any sort of significant contribution towards the rebuild from sale or leasing of office space (perhaps not the HS2 station, but the classic station only).

The current Liverpool Street station isn't a particularly unpleasant station to wait for or board a train in, and as Bramling mentioned, Liverpool St platforms are not at street level - whereas Euston's are and so potentially floor-ceiling windows could be installed to let natural light in that way.

 

[poffle]

Article from BBC London based on leaked report about Euston Underground Station. Euston Tube stations need urgent upgrade report says. ( Not clear who produced report, presumably some party interested in Euston redevelopment. )

Euston Tube stations need urgent upgrade report by engineers says

The report also reveals the design of Euston Square does not comply with current fire regulations.

www.bbc.com

Euston Tube stations need urgent upgrade report says
2 hours ago
Tom Edwards
Transport correspondent, London•@BBCTomEdwards

Euston and Euston Square underground stations need to be urgently upgraded or will "both cease to function as reliable stations in peak hours" due to overcrowding, according to a leaked report sent to BBC London.
It went on to say that the gatelines - the rows of ticket turnstiles - at both stations regularly need to close to remain safe.
Not only this "there is no clear direction" to resolve these issues and that Euston Square does not meet fire regulations, the report added.
Transport for London (Tfl) has said it "would never allow a situation where a TfL-run station was unsafe".
The report, Euston London Underground Way Forward, was written in March 2024 by engineers with "a combined experience of over 10 years managing design for London Underground and Crossrail 2 scopes at Euston".
It summarises the problems at both stations and lists Camden Council, Transport for London (TfL) and Network Rail as stakeholders.
Euston is not in fit condition, says rail minister
The report also reveals the design of the Euston Square station wouldn't comply with current fire regulations and was only allowed to operate as it was an old design covered under what are called "grandfather rights".
It outlines a serious safety concern that "if an incident occurs where... there is a small fire on a train, it will pull into the station to detrain and evacuate passengers on board to enable staff and emergency services to deal with the incident".
It added: "Passengers on the platform should be warned to evacuate before the train arrives. However, the incident may prevent safe egress (exit) for passengers on the 'dead end' side of the incident (either those waiting or those detraining) 'trapping' them in an enclosed space with no safe means of egress.
"This configuration would not be permitted as part of a new build station."
Euston and Euston Square stations were meant to be upgraded and expanded when HS2 rebuilt the mainline station for high-speed services. Work on HS2 Euston was paused by the then Conservative Government in 2023.
At one point a tunnel was proposed between HS2 Euston and Euston Square underground stations.
Go-ahead for the tunnelling between Old Oak Common in northwest London and Euston was confirmed in the Budget, but it’s not clear yet what the new HS2 Euston station design will look like or how it will be funded. It's also not clear how Euston and Euston Square underground stations will be funded.
Recently the Euston mainline rail station was criticised by the watchdog London Travelwatch for overcrowding and being potentially unsafe for passengers.
Procedures have been changed at the station to stop the "Euston rush" including giving passengers more time to get to their trains.
'The real challenge ... is Euston station'
Sir John Armitt chairs the National Infrastructure Commission.
Commenting on the decision to fund the HS2 tunnels to Euston, he told the Rail Industry Association’s annual conference in central London recently: "What was very welcome news was the announcement that they would fund the completion of the tunnels through to Euston.
"That's the relatively straightforward bit.
"The real challenge, as everyone in this room knows of course, is Euston station, which will take longer to do than it will to drive the tunnels.
"So what’s really needed is to find a solution to dealing with Euston station."
Euston London Underground Way Forward report makes it clear both underground stations would need upgrading even without HS2 due to increasing passenger numbers.
The report also said: "Solutions for the capacity upgrade is made chronically challenging by lack of a clear strategy. TfL, HS2 and Network Rail all sit under Department for Transport but their aspirations are misaligned, and there remains no clear approach to business case and funding."
The report also reveals that one proposal not to include Step Free Access "looks to challenge the Disability Discrimination Act 1995".
In conclusion, the report said Tfl needed to recognise there was a "finite" budget and improvements would not bring the stations into full compliance with current safety standards.
It also said Tfl should apply for concessions so it does not have to meet current standards before the carrying out the detailed design.
Tfl has said it did not produce or commission the report.
A TfL spokesperson said: "We are working with Department for Transport, HS2 and other partners to ensure Euston and Euston Square Underground stations can accommodate forecast demand and continue to provide safe, accessible and efficient facilities for everyone."
Copyright 2024 BBC. All rights reserved.

 

[Russel]

Article from BBC London based on leaked TFL report about Euston Underground Station. Euston Tube stations need urgent upgrade report says.

Euston Tube stations need urgent upgrade report by engineers says

The report also reveals the design of Euston Square does not comply with current fire regulations.

www.bbc.com

Regarding fire safety at Euston Square, those concerns could also cover many other underground stations, wouldn't they?

Given TfL's financial position and resulting lack of money to do anything about it, is highlighting this issue publicly a rabbit hole they really want to go down?

Edit, just spotted at the bottom of the page that it's not a TfL report.

 

[poffle]

Regarding fire safety at Euston Square, those concerns could also cover many other underground stations, wouldn't they?

Given TfL's financial position and resulting lack of money to do anything about it, is highlighting this issue publicly a rabbit hole they really want to go down?

Edit, just spotted at the bottom of the page that it's not a TfL report.

Thanks for that spot. I've revised the original post to say it wasn't TFL. There doesn't seem to be any mention of who commissioned it. Presumably some of the parties involved with Euston redevelopment.

There is always an element of follow the money with these consultant reports so who is funding it would be pretty important information.

 

[Russel]

Thanks for that spot. I've revised the original post to say it wasn't TFL. There doesn't seem to be any mention of who commissioned it. Presumably some of the parties involved with Euston redevelopment.

There is always an element of follow the money with these consultant reports so who is funding it would be pretty important information.

Indeed.

In regards to Euston underground station, it does need improving, though how that could be realistically done is the question...

The walking routes between platforms and ticket hall always seem odd to me, it seems whichever way you're going, you end up cutting across a flow of people going a different way.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Indeed.

In regards to Euston underground station, it does need improving, though how that could be realistically done is the question...

The walking routes between platforms and ticket hall always seem odd to me, it seems whichever way you're going, you end up cutting across a flow of people going a different way.

You could largely sort that by changing the layout of the gateline. It's because there are two entrances.

 

[AF91]

You could largely sort that by changing the layout of the gateline. It's because there are two entrances.

If money were no object I'd try to put another concourse in and either separate them by entrance and exit or switch the existing one to be purely serving the suburban platform entrance.

Not sure how you'd get additional escalators in to serve a new concourse though as the circulation spaces are quite compact.