Excessing the return portion - is this possible?

[RailwayDan]

I hold the return portion of a London Terminals - Liverpool Stations ticket (priced £49 with a 16-25 railcard)

I was wondering whether the following itinerary was possible:

Manchester Piccadilly to East Midlands Parkway on a Friday evening, break of journey, and resume from East Midlands Parkway to London St. Pancras on a Sunday evening.

I'm aware that a London Terminals - Manchester Stations ticket is valid via Chesterfield and the MML, so would I be able to get an excess to change the origin of the return to Manchester? and would this be a zero excess as the tickets are priced the same?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Flamingo]

I'm not familiar with the route, but as a general rule a change of route excess should be possible on anything except for Advance tickets, and if no cash needs to change hands, then a zero-fares excess should be appropriate to prove you had the conversation with somebody in authority.

Should be able to sort it out at a booking office, if I was on-board and an excess was required i would do it, but I couldn't vouch for everybody.

Lets see what someone familiar with the route says.

 

[yorkie]

The routeing guide is here: http://www.atoc.org/about-atoc/rail-settlement-plan/routeing-guide

Liverpool & London are both Routeing Points so it's an easy calculation...

As you can see in the yellow pages London Group to Liverpool Group is permitted on the following maps:

CS
CS+CC
GC+CC
LC
LC+CH
LC+ML
MA+ML
MA+NL
TV+ME

Unfortunately this isn't valid via Manchester & East Midlands Parkway

So you need to find somewhere that permits travel via Liverpool and also permits travel via Manchester and East Midlands Parkway, you can then excess the ticket if you can identify such a destination.

 

[SickyNicky]

So you need to find somewhere that permits travel via Liverpool and also permits travel via Manchester and East Midlands Parkway, you can then excess the ticket if you can identify such a destination.

And there's nothing obvious - none of the routeing points around there seem to allow it.

 

[yorkie]

If the original ticket was London - Manchester, it could have been zero excessed to Liverpool for the outward journey (this is because London - Liverpool is valid via Manchester so is definitely a legitimate excess) and would have been valid for the requested itinerary on the return. But it's too late now!

Liverpool - London and Manchester - London are the same fare, so should be valid via each other (as with Leeds/York - London) however, for some unknown reason, while Liverpool - London is valid via Manchester, Manchester - London isn't valid via Liverpool.

Manchester - London is valid via the Midland Mainline.
Liverpool - London is not.

 

[kieron]

Try Kirkdale-London. This costs the same as Liverpool-London, and is valid via Liverpool, and also via Wigan on maps PS and MM.

I haven't checked the easements, but I think an excess to Manchester-London would also be possible. London-Manchester via Liverpool could go London-Sheffield on MM, then Sheffield-Stockport-Manchester Picadilly-Warrington-Hunts Cross-Moorfields-Liverpool Lime Street-Earlestown-Manchester Victoria on PS.

An excess to Kirkdale may be easier to explain, though.

 

[RailwayDan]

Thanks for all the advice.

I went to the Manchester Piccadilly ticket office, where I presented my ticket and was told when I asked to get an excess to travel from Manchester, that is was already valid to travel from Manchester through to London (100% correct) - however when I asked that the reason for it was so I could travel via Sheffield and the MML, she told me that now that I was in Manchester I could use Any Permitted route from Manchester to London... Not sure on that one.

So I decided to leave it, and travelled from Piccadilly to Liverpool on the EMT service (XX.38) and spoke to the guard who said that (and I quote) 'Liverpool to London without a doubt valid via Manchester, Sheffield, Leicester and London as your ticket says Any Permitted route'

Will shop around for the ticket change