Expired 16-25 railcard... but had application form completed, and with me.

[EmDav]

Hello, I would hugely appreciate any help with the below matter which is causing me a huge amount of stress and anxiety.

On Dec 20th I was stopped at Stevenage station with an expired 16-25 railcard (expired Oct 30th). I had the completed application form for the new railcard in my bag, including the photographs, all had been stamped and signed by my university. I was able to show these all to the inspector and naively though he would simply ensure that I bought my new railcard there and then, or issue me with a fine. Instead he notified me that I would get a letter regarding prosecution. This letter arrived today. It is from Govia Thameslink Railway.

The alleged offence 'That you did enter a train for the purpose of travelling on the railway, and upon inspection at Stevenage; did not produce a valid ticket entitling travel' The letter asks for my response.

I have read other threads and this is my draft response. Please let me know your thoughts.

"On Dec 20th I travelled with an expired student railcard and I would like to profusely apologise for this matter. I now understand that simply having the completed student railcard application form with me was not sufficient and I deeply regret my actions. I have subsequently purchased the new 16-25 railcard and set up a calendar reminder to ensure this does not happen again.

I would like to respectfully request that you consider settling the matter out of court, I will of course pay any outstanding fare and fees."


The advice on this forum says not to include any sob stories. But I would also be keen to know your thoughts on whether to include these mitigating circumstances; I have ADHD, and am going through separation/divorce and a house-move.

Also, is it worth saying any prosecution could have a devastating effect on my future career?

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Welcome to the forum!

I think that your planned response covers most of the necessary points, and you're right not to include the 'mitigation': it sounds like you're having a rough time right now but I'm not convinced that the railway will see them as good enough reasons for not getting the application form out of your bag when you were passing a ticket office.

We often find that GTR are willing to settle out of court: this is likely to cost you the train fare and an admin fee of maybe £150 - but while this isn't cheap, it's almost certainly cheaper than the matter going to court. So you're likely to be able to settle this if you submit something like what you suggest to GTR.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

@EmDav. Welcome to the forum. Just to clarify, you bought a railcard discounted ticket, yet still boarded a train & travelled knowing that you needed to renew your expired railcard, but hadn't yet done so? What do you consider that the mitigating circumstances might be?

By the way, what was the journey you were making?

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello, I would hugely appreciate any help with the below matter which is causing me a huge amount of stress and anxiety.

On Dec 20th I was stopped at Stevenage station with an expired 16-25 railcard (expired Oct 30th). I had the completed application form for the new railcard in my bag, including the photographs, all had been stamped and signed by my university. I was able to show these all to the inspector and naively though he would simply ensure that I bought my new railcard there and then, or issue me with a fine. Instead he notified me that I would get a letter regarding prosecution. This letter arrived today. It is from Govia Thameslink Railway.

The alleged offence 'That you did enter a train for the purpose of travelling on the railway, and upon inspection at Stevenage; did not produce a valid ticket entitling travel' The letter asks for my response.

I have read other threads and this is my draft response. Please let me know your thoughts.

"On Dec 20th I travelled with an expired student railcard and I would like to profusely apologise for this matter. I now understand that simply having the completed student railcard application form with me was not sufficient and I deeply regret my actions. I have subsequently purchased the new 16-25 railcard and set up a calendar reminder to ensure this does not happen again.

I would like to respectfully request that you consider settling the matter out of court, I will of course pay any outstanding fare and fees."


The advice on this forum says not to include any sob stories. But I would also be keen to know your thoughts on whether to include these mitigating circumstances; I have ADHD, and am going through separation/divorce and a house-move.

Also, is it worth saying any prosecution could have a devastating effect on my future career?

I don't think at this stage you need to mention about impact on future career of prosecution - as I think the likelihood is they will settle the matter with you fingers crossed without prosecution.

Presumably there was some reason why if you had all the application form / paperwork completed and ready you did not pop into a ticket office before getting on the train to obtain a new Railcard (I'm assuming that Stevenage was your destination not your origin station) - my line of thinking being if you boarded at at station that was supposed to have an open ticket office - according to time published by the railway operator - at the time you were there, but you found it was closed, this would be a mitigating point that it might be worth mentioning.

 

[fandroid]

my line of thinking being if you boarded at at station that was supposed to have an open ticket office - according to time published by the railway operator - at the time you were there, but you found it was closed, this would be a mitigating point that it might be worth mentioning.

Unfortunately, you bought your discounted ticket while you had no Railcard and then boarded the train, still with no Railcard. I'm not sure that a closed ticket office would be seem as mitigation as you had two chances to put things right when you realised you weren't going to be able to renew before travelling.

 

[EmDav]

@EmDav. Welcome to the forum. Just to clarify, you bought a railcard discounted ticket, yet still boarded a train & travelled knowing that you needed to renew your expired railcard, but hadn't yet done so? What do you consider that the mitigating circumstances might be?

By the way, what was the journey you were making?

As I mentioned I have adhd and am going through a very stressful time in my life with separation, divorce and a house move etc.

I bought the discounted ticket with the intention of getting my railcard renewed but subsequently forgot, -quite typical adhd behaviour. I am not offering these things as an excuse, or saying that I shouldn’t be punished. I am simply explaining the circumstances.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Feb 2024 ==

Welcome to the forum!

I think that your planned response covers most of the necessary points, and you're right not to include the 'mitigation': it sounds like you're having a rough time right now but I'm not convinced that the railway will see them as good enough reasons for not getting the application form out of your bag when you were passing a ticket office.

We often find that GTR are willing to settle out of court: this is likely to cost you the train fare and an admin fee of maybe £150 - but while this isn't cheap, it's almost certainly cheaper than the matter going to court. So you're likely to be able to settle this if you submit something like what you suggest to GTR.

Thank you.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Feb 2024 ==

I don't think at this stage you need to mention about impact on future career of prosecution - as I think the likelihood is they will settle the matter with you fingers crossed without prosecution.

Presumably there was some reason why if you had all the application form / paperwork completed and ready you did not pop into a ticket office before getting on the train to obtain a new Railcard (I'm assuming that Stevenage was your destination not your origin station) - my line of thinking being if you boarded at at station that was supposed to have an open ticket office - according to time published by the railway operator - at the time you were there, but you found it was closed, this would be a mitigating point that it might be worth mentioning.

Ticket office was open, I simply forgot.

 

[ikcdab]

To be honest I think your letter is about right and hits the right note. You have clearly done your research on here in an intelligent way so full marks for that. You have to chalk this one up to experience and (as you have done) put controls in place to prevent it happening again.

 

[WesternLancer]

Ticket office was open, I simply forgot.

Thanks for the explanation.

Maybe this would allow you to simply say along lines of this in your explanation eg - 'although I had completed my application form for a new railcard, on the day I simply forgot to renew it at the station before joining my train. It was never my intention to evade the correct fare.' - although there may no need to add this.

Good luck with getting it sorted.

 

[John R]

How did you buy your ticket? Was it from a ticket machine, or online (it obviously wasn’t at a ticket office, as you would have had to present the railcard). If online, would a review of your account show more tickets bought with a railcard, as if so, these may well be investigated too in due course.

 

[EmDav]

To be honest I think your letter is about right and hits the right note. You have clearly done your research on here in an intelligent way so full marks for that. You have to chalk this one up to experience and (as you have done) put controls in place to prevent it happening again.

I feel so ashamed and my anxiety through the roof.
I stupidly thought he’d said I’d get a letter within 21 days, and when that time had passed I thought they must have decided not to prosecute, but I must have misheard.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

I think your draft letter reads well, but would add the amendment suggested by @WesternLancer GTR are normally one of the better train companies to deal with and I would expectthem to offer you an out of court settlement.