First Bus - no new Buses

[Butts]

I regulary frequent First Bus Services in Falkirk Edinburgh Alloa and Stirling.

The newest vehicle I have seen is at least three years old and most of them are even older - some used to be horse-drawn I believe

Do they ever buy any new Buses for use in this area

 

[Ivo]

Three years? What's wrong with that?

Entire swathes of First territory are worse off than that...

They do have problems up there though.

 

[DavidBrown]

Three years old? That's pretty much brand spanking new. Do you honestly expect all buses to be built, used for 12 months then sent to the scrapheap? Get real.

 

[trentside]

Given that First are actively seeking to dispose of various bits of their UK bus portfolio, making significant investments in new vehicles wouldn't make sense until they've got themselves on a better footing.

 

[Failed Unit]

I regulary frequent First Bus Services in Falkirk Edinburgh Alloa and Stirling.

The newest vehicle I have seen is at least three years old and most of them are even older - some used to be horse-drawn I believe

Do they ever buy any new Buses for use in this area

Head to Glasgow, they have some 2 months old there. Falkirk seem to be all about 10 years old.

 

[Butts]

Three years old? That's pretty much brand spanking new. Do you honestly expect all buses to be built, used for 12 months then sent to the scrapheap? Get real.

No but in the huge fleet that operates out of the Larbert Garage you would expect to see the odd new one

 

[Eagle]

No but in the huge fleet that operates out of the Larbert Garage you would expect to see the odd new one

Bearing in mind that buses would normally be ordered en masse for a single depot every few years, it's entirely plausible that a depot (even a large one) hasn't had any new vehicles for a couple years.

It's not as if they're ordered one at a time, as and when.

 

[Butts]

Head to Glasgow, they have some 2 months old there. Falkirk seem to be all about 10 years old.

If they have some in Glasgow they certainly don't use them on the X37 Glasgow to Falkirk service as you say most of the Falkirk fleet are ancient(only the 38 Edinburgh service gets the three year old ones)

Hit the wilds of Alloa and your lucky if its got seats
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Bearing in mind that buses would normally be ordered en masse for a single depot every few years, it's entirely plausible that a depot (even a large one) hasn't had any new vehicles for a couple years.

It's not as if they're ordered one at a time, as and when.

How often does this happen - if you take the few 09's out most of the others are over 6 years old

 

[anthony263]

I wouldnt complain we are still waiting for brand new vehicles.
The only new vehicles were those enviro 200 darts for the swansea orange bus university contract which have now been nicked by them lot down in Bristol & Bath and the vehicles for the greyhound coach service and the FTR's for the Swansea metro

The newest vehicles were have received have been some volvo from Manchester and Devon.

Meanwhile Stagecoach and Arriva are buying brand new vehicles for their wales operations

 

[Butts]

I wouldnt complain we are still waiting for brand new vehicles.
The only new vehicles were those enviro 200 darts for the swansea orange bus university contract which have now been nicked by them lot down in Bristol & Bath and the vehicles for the greyhound coach service and the FTR's for the Swansea metro

The newest vehicles were have received have been some volvo from Manchester and Devon.

Meanwhile Stagecoach and Arriva are buying brand new vehicles for their wales operations

I have noticed that the odd Stagecoach Bus I see crossing in from Fife, do on the whole seem to be newer than the First vehicles.

Its about time they spent money at Falkirk Bus Station as well - we don't even have automated signage telling you the times services are due - the old timetable is all we have.:roll:

 

[Ivo]

I wouldnt complain we are still waiting for brand new vehicles.
The only new vehicles were those enviro 200 darts for the swansea orange bus university contract which have now been nicked by them lot down in Bristol & Bath and the vehicles for the greyhound coach service and the FTR's for the Swansea metro

The newest vehicles were have received have been some volvo from Manchester and Devon.

You should know by now that Cymru operate a strict "Hand-Me-Downs Only" policy

And what do you mean, "them lot"? We didn't get any in the end! Brizzle got the lot! (I think :?)

 

[Butts]

You should know by now that Cymru operate a strict "Hand-Me-Downs Only" policy

And what do you mean, "them lot"? We didn't get any in the end! Brizzle got the lot! (I think :?)

Do they come up here when the taffs have worn them out

 

[starrymarkb]

If they have some in Glasgow they certainly don't use them on the X37 Glasgow to Falkirk service as you say most of the Falkirk fleet are ancient(only the 38 Edinburgh service gets the three year old ones)

Hit the wilds of Alloa and your lucky if its got seats
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


How often does this happen - if you take the few 09's out most of the others are over 6 years old

Most of the 2012 First order is stockpiled for the Olympics, then will go on to the various depots in the empire later in the year

 

[tbtc]

Bearing in mind that buses would normally be ordered en masse for a single depot every few years, it's entirely plausible that a depot (even a large one) hasn't had any new vehicles for a couple years.

It's not as if they're ordered one at a time, as and when.

Here in Sheffield we've got very few First vehicles under ten years old.

We had a big delivery in the late '90s, then a big delivery in 2002 (inc fifty B7Ls that were brand new for the Manchester Commonwealth Games), then a decent sized delivery in 2008 (some of which have moved elsewhere).

First seems to have its "favourite areas" (Glasgow, Leeds etc) whilst Stagecoach spread the new vehicles around the country more.

If they have some in Glasgow they certainly don't use them on the X37 Glasgow to Falkirk service as you say most of the Falkirk fleet are ancient(only the 38 Edinburgh service gets the three year old ones)

The 38 is about the only route in the old Midland Scottish area that seems to make First any money - no wonder that's where the investment goes

 

[Butts]

I don't know how much money First get when people use concessionary passes as they predominate on all the routes I travel on.

Someone actually paying is a novelty

The scanning of the passes is far slower that "flashing a pass" and hence slows things up.

Another gripe the driver never apologises if a service is running late - from my experience the few female drivers are far better mannered than the males.

 

[tbtc]

I don't know how much money First get when people use concessionary passes as they predominate on all the routes I travel on

The old Midland Scottish area stuff is highly rumoured to be one of the next bits of First to be sold off which suggests that they aren't making enough money to justify new vehicles.

 

[Statto]

New buses will only be delivered, if the route(s) Depot(s) there going on/to make money, & the Depot manager has to make a case for new vehicles.

The OP complaining about the age of the fleet, he's lucky , First's newest bus in my area is on an 04 plate, most of the Fleet is about 11 years, there are Deckers who's average age is 14, & the depot is losing around £10,000 a week.

 

[WelshBluebird]

Three years is pretty damn good. Not sure of the actual age, but the stagecoach buses down back home (stagecoach south wales services 120 and 130 from Blaenrhondda / Blaencwm to Caerphilly) are pretty old.

And while Bath / the south west has had a fair amount of newish vehicles in the short time I've been here, there are still an awful lot of older buses (many which struggle significantly with the hills in Bath) around.

And what do you mean, "them lot"?

Haha, I feel a bit of a divided loyalty here

 

[313103]

I wouldnt complain we are still waiting for brand new vehicles.
The only new vehicles were those enviro 200 darts for the swansea orange bus university contract which have now been nicked by them lot down in Bristol & Bath and the vehicles for the greyhound coach service and the FTR's for the Swansea metro

The newest vehicles were have received have been some volvo from Manchester and Devon.

Meanwhile Stagecoach and Arriva are buying brand new vehicles for their wales operations

Actually i think some of the buses in the Swansea Bus Museum on Fabian Way are newer buses then what First put out in the Swansea and outlying areas, Most that i see were around in London over 10 years ago or should i say left London 10 years ago!

 

[Butts]

Has no one seen the slogan First have on some of their buses.....or at least used to.

"First Bus transforming travel" - back to the eighties !!!

 

[Schnellzug]

Stagecoach do, i think, order new Vehicles on a more regular basis than the First Bus; what Frist tend to do is order large numbers in one go, e.g. Somerset & Avon and Bristol have large numbers of 57/58 registered double Deckers and 59 registered single Deckers, but having done that, of course, any further requirements will be met by cascades from elsewhere (often London); which is sensible enough. Stagecoach in Devon, it's reasonable to point out, also have some of the oldest S registered Tridents from London.

 

[anthony263]

Three years is pretty damn good. Not sure of the actual age, but the stagecoach buses down back home (stagecoach south wales services 120 and 130 from Blaenrhondda / Blaencwm to Caerphilly) are pretty old.

And while Bath / the south west has had a fair amount of newish vehicles in the short time I've been here, there are still an awful lot of older buses (many which struggle significantly with the hills in Bath) around.



Haha, I feel a bit of a divided loyalty here

Yes however sadly it seems the new scannia stagecoach ordered for service 172 Aberdare - Porthcawl which were supposed to be very good at climbing hills seem to be having some problems tackling Maerdy mountain.

Now in this case I say keep our Volvo B10m's stagecoach.

 

[90019]

I have noticed that the odd Stagecoach Bus I see crossing in from Fife, do on the whole seem to be newer than the First vehicles.

They're about 5 years old.

Another gripe the driver never apologises if a service is running late - from my experience the few female drivers are far better mannered than the males.

What do you expect though? Should the driver have to apologise to every person that gets on the bus because it's running 4 minutes late?

 

[anthony263]

They're about 5 years old.



What do you expect though? Should the driver have to apologise to every person that gets on the bus because it's running 4 minutes late?

Not really but I did certainly stopped some moaning at me

 

[northwichcat]

Another gripe the driver never apologises if a service is running late - from my experience the few female drivers are far better mannered than the males.

Is that really such a big problem? When I've used First Bus services sometimes a service has been cancelled and the next one can't take all the passengers and we don't get an apology.

The closest I can ever remember to a bus driver apologising is once when it was pulled in at the origin stop and a passenger noticed there was diesel pouring out of the unit at a rapid rate, he informed the driver and after the driver inspected the problem he refused to take the service until the bus was swapped for another vehicle. This was on a route with an hourly service and a 20 minute journey each way, so the next service was due to be the same bus and driver. The driver had asked the passengers if anyone needed to get to work or the like (it was a Saturday) and a few people did so he took out the replacement bus out 45 minutes late, opposed to just cancelling the service.

 

[CC 72100]

First seems to have its "favourite areas" (Glasgow, Leeds etc) whilst Stagecoach spread the new vehicles around the country more.

The Forest of Dean is obviously not included in this. We did have some 04 deckers, cascaded from Gloucester, cascaded previously from Manchester but they seem to break down frequently.

We've got some 9 -12 year old Darts, but they tend to appear more on the Herefordshire side of operations.

We currently have mainly old N/P/R reg Volvo ALX 400s. The R reg ones were delivered new, 15 years ago, the others have just 'appeared' - Apparently if I have any comments about the service I still need to talk to Stagecoach Manchester about it!

Meanwhile Cheltenham and Gloucester get the link between the two with leather-seated enviro deckers

 

[Failed Unit]

I don't know how much money First get when people use concessionary passes as they predominate on all the routes I travel on.

Someone actually paying is a novelty

The scanning of the passes is far slower that "flashing a pass" and hence slows things up.

Another gripe the driver never apologises if a service is running late - from my experience the few female drivers are far better mannered than the males.

I know whenever I use the 38 I am the only one that pays, but it is so unreliable I use a bike and train combo now.

If you want to see a nice first bus hit route 66 in Glasgow . Although the majority of thier buses in Glasgow are under 10. Maybe SPT help out a bit.

The soon to be closed Linlithgow garage seems to have some fairly new deckers.

 

[talltim]

You get apologies (often automated admittedly) for late trains so why not for buses?

The only newish First buses I see in the Sheffield are on the X78 service. These are painted in a strange varient of the First livery. Stagecoach seem to have a lot more newish buses, most noticably the hybrids on the 120 service and the 'Wifi' ones on the Matlock service

 

[northwichcat]

You get apologies (often automated admittedly) for late trains so why not for buses?

Assuming it's not Northern Rail who don't have live passenger information at many unstaffed stations and at some staffed stations they rely on the ticket office attendee going out on to the platform and telling the passengers about the delay, which they only normally do for delays of over 15 minutes.

The reason I started my reply saying "Is that really such a big problem?" is because I think they need to make sure they do it for cancelled services first and then worry about delayed services.

 

[Failed Unit]

In the area "Butts" is talking about, you often don't know if you are catching the late running previous bus or the one you want running early!