First Generation DMUs with windows in the carriage ends

[Davester50]

I have a sketchy memory of being at Stirling station in the mid to late 1970s where the DMU that I had been on had glass in the car ends beside the gangways.
I've had a search, but naturally most photos show the driving cab, rather than the inner coach ends. I do have a feeling that they were quite wide windows, rather than a narrower panel, and the unit would be in all over Rail Blue, if I remember rightly.
Any idea from the rather poor description what would the likely class be?

 

[Y Ddraig Coch]

Probably a 101 , 121 or similar.

 

[hexagon789]

I have a sketchy memory of being at Stirling station in the mid to late 1970s where the DMU that I had been on had glass in the car ends beside the gangways.
I've had a search, but naturally most photos show the driving cab, rather than the inner coach ends. I do have a feeling that they were quite wide windows, rather than a narrower panel, and the unit would be in all over Rail Blue, if I remember rightly.
Any idea from the rather poor description what would the likely class be?

104 maybe?

They definitely had the windows in the vehicle inner ends you describe but I don't think the Scottish Region/ScotRail had some in the 1970s, only the 1980s bar a single unit loaned to Hamilton from Darlington in 1960/61.

 

[Ashley Hill]

Guards compartments on the DMUs I worked (101/108/118) had windows on the carriage ends. Endless hours of fun watching the buffers going up and down.
Just remembered,John W1 posted this picture of a 104 centre car with guards van the other day.

59229_1976_08_Doncaster_A3_600dpi

Birmingham Railway Carriage & Wagon Co. Class 104 Trailer Brake Second Lavatory (TBSL) E59229 stands in the yard at Doncaster Carriage works, 8th August 1976. Vehicle History Three hundred and two Class 104 vehicles were built by Birmingham Railway Carriage & Wagon Co. Ltd between 1957 and...

www.flickr.com

 

[Davester50]

104 maybe?

They definitely had the windows in the vehicle inner ends you describe but I don't think the Scottish Region/ScotRail had some in the 1970s, only the 1980s bar a single unit loaned to Hamilton from Darlington in 1960/61.

Thanks. Having been through the very interesting Railcar website, I'd say the 104 looks odds on for how I remember the inner windows.

This photo - Jerry Glover's pic on Railcar - is very much how I remember how it looked.
Age could well be playing tricks on the brain for time, but I'm 99% sure it was at Stirling.

Guards compartments on the DMUs I worked (101/108/118) had windows on the carriage ends. Endless hours of fun watching the buffers going up and down.
Just remembered,John W1 posted this picture of a 104 centre car with guards van the other day.

59229_1976_08_Doncaster_A3_600dpi

Birmingham Railway Carriage & Wagon Co. Class 104 Trailer Brake Second Lavatory (TBSL) E59229 stands in the yard at Doncaster Carriage works, 8th August 1976. Vehicle History Three hundred and two Class 104 vehicles were built by Birmingham Railway Carriage & Wagon Co. Ltd between 1957 and...

www.flickr.com

Thanks, and yup, larger inner windows is how I remember it.

I remember it becasue it was different from the usual, and looked old to me then, which IMHO the 104s do compared with the 101s, but not in a bad way!
I shall now waste the rest of the afternoon avoiding Mrs D, searching for old DMU pictures.
Thanks all!

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Based solely on models, it would seem quite a few DMU classes had these windows in at least some vehicles. Though I don't ever recall seeing them on units in service towards the end of their lives. Were some plated over during refurbishments?

 

[Davester50]

104 maybe?

They definitely had the windows in the vehicle inner ends you describe but I don't think the Scottish Region/ScotRail had some in the 1970s, only the 1980s bar a single unit loaned to Hamilton from Darlington in 1960/61.

Now, looking further, the Scottish Region did have class 105s in the period, and while I still think the 104 is closer to what I remember, the 105 also had these windows.
Railcar photo of 105 at Haymarket in 1979

Based solely on models, it would seem quite a few DMU classes had these windows in at least some vehicles. Though I don't ever recall seeing them on units in service towards the end of their lives. Were some plated over during refurbishments?

I wonder that too. I wish the Railcar website had a next button - similar to Flickr, as it would make life easy looking through!

 

[hexagon789]

Now, looking further, the Scottish Region did have class 105s in the period, and while I still think the 104 is closer to what I remember, the 105 also had these windows.

I hadn't realised 105s had these windows or I would have said 105 over 104; the Scottish Region had plenty of Cravens 105s delivered new. Mostly for local services - around Glasgow (to East Kilbride and Cathcart for example) from Hamilton Depot and Aberdeen (Buchan Lines and Ballater) from Kittybrewster Depot.

 

[Davester50]

I hadn't realised 105s had these windows or I would have said 105 over 104; the Scottish Region had plenty of Cravens 105s delivered new. Mostly for local services - around Glasgow (to East Kilbride and Cathcart for example) from Hamilton Depot and Aberdeen (Buchan Lines and Ballater) from Kittybrewster Depot.

Maybe one for a more general "what classes had those windows on the end, and did they have them plated over at some point", or is even that a bit niche for here?

 

[hexagon789]

Maybe one for a more general "what classes had those windows on the end, and did they have them plated over at some point", or is even that a bit niche for here?

You can never be too niche on a railway forum...

 

[edwin_m]

You can never be too niche on a railway forum...

Unless the niches have been plated over.

 

[MadMac]

104 maybe?

They definitely had the windows in the vehicle inner ends you describe but I don't think the Scottish Region/ScotRail had some in the 1970s, only the 1980s bar a single unit loaned to Hamilton from Darlington in 1960/61.

Yeah, the 104s only appeared in Scotland to any degree following the 1984 Ayr depot fire.