First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)

[83G/84D]

Trident 33182 was in Camborne yesterday with a front panel missing and defect sticker on the windscreen. Three Enviro 500’s were lined up alongside it.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I believe all have now been redone internally except those that have arrived in the last week or two.
Ive always found the cleaning team do a good job the majority of the time.
The u4 is a reasonably short route compared to others that are Gemini worked. The 271 and 272 both being 40-50 miles each way spring to mind, both have strong reliability on quite demanding routes. Likewise Gemini’s are coping well with the Dartmoor Explorer across a very challenging route with the hilly nature of Dartmoor.
My experiences driving B7TLs are that they are very reliable buses when well maintained and evidenced by how well the recent disposals to Ensign have moved on quickly, and show a good demand for these types of buses

We have to remember that Cornwall isn't the most populous county and isn't the best operating territory. Therefore, it has had to rely on secondhand cascades since the 1970s so throughout the NBC, Badgerline and First eras. The current cascades certainly aren't the worst vehicles to have been sent south, especially when the tattiest ones have been treated to a refurb.

To be honest, given that the former Western National operations have enjoyed very few new deckers since the days of the bus grant, the sheer number of e400s Kernow has received is nothing short of incredible. Probably about 7 Tridents for Torpoint and 3 for Falmouth, 11 Olympians and 3 B10Ms for Plymouth.....can't be many more? It's not a lucrative area and the cloth has to be cut accordingly.

 

[Trainfan061193]

And to me although smaller, Buses of Somerset have just as much of an interesting fleet as Kernow do so in my view it’s a bit of a shame Somerset isn’t spoken about as much. I’m hoping to go up to Somerset soon to do some of their routes up there.

 

[M803UYA]

U4 doesn't serve Truro.


A "Commercial manager" that doesn't see the people on the floor, that treating the location as a "personal project". Should we ask how it ended in his previous jobs?

I'm saying that the amount of people, especially in summer, make it viable. Not to mention the buses have paid themselves off. If it wasn't viable, why is it still a running route? Why did they place 33301/02 on the route previously?

Marc's record in previous jobs is fairly well known. However the work he has done since 2013. quietly, in the background away from the limelight is nothing short of impressive even to this onlooker who has had cause to differ on opinions in the past. Both his and Alex's prior experiences have stood them well and been applied to good effect to an operation that needed to do a lot of things differently.

Had someone said to me, in 2011 that First Kernow would be an operation running what it does, would have eliminated it's primary competition and that it would be the dominant provider of buses in Cornwall I'd have asked for some of whatever was being smoked.

They were a model of how not to a bus operation 10-15 years ago and had seriously lost their way. Closure, or more likely a disposal was a serious prospect. Even the loss of the tendered service work in 2020 doesn't appear to have stunted the operation given the solid commercial corridors it provides. In fact it's grown and more than made up for that lost work, whilst Go Ahead now has the headache.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

And to me although smaller, Buses of Somerset have just as much of an interesting fleet as Kernow do so in my view it’s a bit of a shame Somerset isn’t spoken about as much. I’m hoping to go up to Somerset soon to do some of their routes up there.

Somerset is certainly overlooked in comparison to Kernow in this thread. In fact, there is a rather strong Penzance and Helston bias even within that

Don't know how well you know the area so apologies if I'm teaching you to suck eggs. A nice loop is to go from Taunton to Chard on the 30, which is often a Trident and is a good run. Grab a coffee and then get a 99 from Chard back through the Blackdown Hills to Taunton, usually on a Streetlite.

Another good loop is to go from Taunton on the 54 to Yeovil; a fun trip across the Somerset countryside that can be operated by any long single deck so a Dart or long e200, Omnicity, Eclipse, e300.... That gets you to the timewarp that is Yeovil bus station but it's a really pleasant ride out. Then you can retrace your steps partly on the 77 and up to Street/Glastonbury/Wells so you can get to see the Glasto anti-vaxxers and 5G protesters. However, leave them and then you can head out on the 75 to Bridgwater that follows the main A39 along the Polden Hills before dropping down and through a number of villages on the edge of the Somerset Levels - think that's usually an e200 (or you could go straight back to Taunton on the 29). Then from Bridgwater to Taunton, it's a fairly dull if brisk sprint back to Taunton, usually on a Solar or e300 though a Trident often appears on there.

The 25 and 28 from Taunton to Dulverton and Minehead respectively are also very scenic trips out.

 

[Trainfan061193]

Somerset is certainly overlooked in comparison to Kernow in this thread. In fact, there is a rather strong Penzance and Helston bias even within that

Don't know how well you know the area so apologies if I'm teaching you to suck eggs. A nice loop is to go from Taunton to Chard on the 30, which is often a Trident and is a good run. Grab a coffee and then get a 99 from Chard back through the Blackdown Hills to Taunton, usually on a Streetlite.

Another good loop is to go from Taunton on the 54 to Yeovil; a fun trip across the Somerset countryside that can be operated by any long single deck so a Dart or long e200, Omnicity, Eclipse, e300.... That gets you to the timewarp that is Yeovil bus station but it's a really pleasant ride out. Then you can retrace your steps partly on the 77 and up to Street/Glastonbury/Wells so you can get to see the Glasto anti-vaxxers and 5G protesters. However, leave them and then you can head out on the 75 to Bridgwater that follows the main A39 along the Polden Hills before dropping down and through a number of villages on the edge of the Somerset Levels - think that's usually an e200 (or you could go straight back to Taunton on the 29). Then from Bridgwater to Taunton, it's a fairly dull if brisk sprint back to Taunton, usually on a Solar or e300 though a Trident often appears on there.

The 25 and 28 from Taunton to Dulverton and Minehead respectively are also very scenic trips out.

The 25 I would definitely like to have a go on one time as it does sound very scenic as you say! Yes the 28 is certainly a very scenic route as that is the route I do the most in Somerset although some of the routes you’ve mentioned here I would like to do as well.

You must do the Exmoor Coaster one time as well! I did that in the summer and I think it gives the Land’s End Coaster a huge run for it’s money scenery wise, the views along the A39 between Porlock and Lynmouth are breathtaking so I’m hoping to do that again soon

When I do come up fairly soon I’m planning to do the 28 to Minehead from Taunton Railway Station then catch the Exmoor Coaster to Lynmouth and back then the 28 back to Taunton then afterwards jump on the 30 to Axminster to catch my train home to Exeter from there.

I do know Somerset rather well and the routes you’ve told me about I will definitely bear in mind so thank you for these suggestions

 

[Whiteway215]

Somerset is certainly overlooked in comparison to Kernow in this thread. In fact, there is a rather strong Penzance and Helston bias even within that

Don't know how well you know the area so apologies if I'm teaching you to suck eggs. A nice loop is to go from Taunton to Chard on the 30, which is often a Trident and is a good run. Grab a coffee and then get a 99 from Chard back through the Blackdown Hills to Taunton, usually on a Streetlite.

Another good loop is to go from Taunton on the 54 to Yeovil; a fun trip across the Somerset countryside that can be operated by any long single deck so a Dart or long e200, Omnicity, Eclipse, e300.... That gets you to the timewarp that is Yeovil bus station but it's a really pleasant ride out. Then you can retrace your steps partly on the 77 and up to Street/Glastonbury/Wells so you can get to see the Glasto anti-vaxxers and 5G protesters. However, leave them and then you can head out on the 75 to Bridgwater that follows the main A39 along the Polden Hills before dropping down and through a number of villages on the edge of the Somerset Levels - think that's usually an e200 (or you could go straight back to Taunton on the 29). Then from Bridgwater to Taunton, it's a fairly dull if brisk sprint back to Taunton, usually on a Solar or e300 though a Trident often appears on there.

The 25 and 28 from Taunton to Dulverton and Minehead respectively are also very scenic trips out.

Not sure how much longer you would have if you wanted a trip on a Trident.
I believe they are an endangered species?

 

[Goldfish62]

The u4 is a reasonably short route compared to others that are Gemini worked.

It's certainly not a short route at just under 30 miles one way!

 

[carlberry]

That gets you to the timewarp that is Yeovil bus station but it's a really pleasant ride out.

It's worth a few minutes to explore the bits of Yeovil town centre adjacent to the bus station (including the novelty outdoor escalator!) which illustrate the demise of the high street quite well and, as a consequence, less demand for bus services.

 

[Trainfan061193]

Not sure how much longer you would have if you wanted a trip on a Trident.
I believe they are an endangered species?

Yes all Tridents in Somerset are due to be replaced so I’m hoping to get at least one or two more rides before they all go. The ALXs they have there currently are just amazing so it will be sad to see these go

 

[richw]

It's certainly not a short route at just under 30 miles one way!

As per what I said, compared to other routes that are wholly gemini operated that is short.

 

[Goldfish62]

As per what I said, compared to other routes that are wholly Gemini operated that is short.

Depends if you're referring to the core network or infrequent tourist / college routes.

The 17 and 18 are both around 10 miles long and the 19 less than 3 miles. In the core network I'd say that the U4 is the longest Gemini operated route by a long way.

Somerset is certainly overlooked in comparison to Kernow in this thread. In fact, there is a rather strong Penzance and Helston bias even within that

That's because we don't want people to forget about us down in the "proper" part of Cornwall.

 

[vla50]

Does the U4 usually get overcrowded during the peaks? Have heard from some it sometimes can

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The 25 I would definitely like to have a go on one time as it does sound very scenic as you say! Yes the 28 is certainly a very scenic route as that is the route I do the most in Somerset although some of the routes you’ve mentioned here I would like to do as well.

You must do the Exmoor Coaster one time as well! I did that in the summer and I think it gives the Land’s End Coaster a huge run for it’s money scenery wise, the views along the A39 between Porlock and Lynmouth are breathtaking so I’m hoping to do that again soon

When I do come up fairly soon I’m planning to do the 28 to Minehead from Taunton Railway Station then catch the Exmoor Coaster to Lynmouth and back then the 28 back to Taunton then afterwards jump on the 30 to Axminster to catch my train home to Exeter from there.

I do know Somerset rather well and the routes you’ve told me about I will definitely bear in mind so thank you for these suggestions

I did the Exmoor Coaster just a few weeks ago, from Taunton on the 28, then on the EXMO over to Lynmouth, up the hill to catch the Lynton to Barnstaple bus, then a 155 to Tiverton and back on the 22 to Taunton. One variation that I'd like to try is to get the EXMO to Lynmouth and back and then get one of the obscure tendered runs to Dulverton to get the 25 back to Taunton. Did the 25 quite a few years back on a Dart from Bampton to Taunton and it's a cracking run.

It's worth a few minutes to explore the bits of Yeovil town centre adjacent to the bus station (including the novelty outdoor escalator!) which illustrate the demise of the high street quite well and, as a consequence, less demand for bus services.

So many quality aspects of Yeovil. That end of town has really declined but the whole place is much less vibrant than 30 years ago.

I'm usually a proponent of bus stations/decent facilities in which to wait for a bus. However, Yeovil bus station is planned to go at some point, and it won't be a great loss.

Yes all Tridents in Somerset are due to be replaced so I’m hoping to get at least one or two more rides before they all go. The ALXs they have there currently are just amazing so it will be sad to see these go

The President Tridents are pretty fun too and had a trip from Taunton to Chard on one which was a spirited trip. Last time though, it was one of the ALXs from Axminster to Chard (followed by a 99 - bus not ice cream) and they're fine old machines though showing their age. Perhaps one last trip before Xmas....

Depends if you're referring to the core network or infrequent tourist / college routes.

The 17 and 18 are both around 10 miles long and the 19 less than 3 miles. In the core network I'd say that the U4 is the longest Gemini operated route by a long way.


That's because we don't want people to forget about us down in the "proper" part of Cornwall.

Are you suggesting that people in Redruth or St Austell are, in some way, improper?

The U4 may be a longish route but it's not one renowned for nice new vehicles. My first experience of it was in the fledgling First days (c.1997) and I split my journey in Helston. The initial portion was on something like a refurbished ex Eastern National VR (new seat coverings, DiPTAC handrails, new flooring yet still water through the wheelarches), before the next bit was on a Leopard - both would've been about 17 years old then!

Does the U4 usually get overcrowded during the peaks? Have heard from some it sometimes can

There's a reason why it's decker operated and it has schools traffic on it.

 

[Lizard1324]

Does the U4 usually get overcrowded during the peaks? Have heard from some it sometimes can

When I used the U4 pre covid it was above 75% capacity if not more leaving penzance at 2:45, 3:45 with most people getting of at helston. The other times were busy but the lunch time U4 was also dead when I got it.

 

[Goldfish62]

When I used the U4 pre covid it was above 75% capacity if not more leaving penzance at 2:45, 3:45 with most people getting of at helston. The other times were busy but the lunch time U4 was also dead when I got it.

In my experience the Penzance - Helston section is the busiest. I've often (including in the Summer) been the only passenger between Helston and Penryn Campus.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

In my experience the Penzance - Helston section is the busiest. I've often (including in the Summer) been the only passenger between Helston and Penryn Campus.

My experience is a lot more limited but I'd tend to agree. Not surprising in some respects as two of the more populous villages and tourist hotspots, Marazion and Porthleven, are on that stretch, as is Goldsithney. Not much on the stretch from Helston until the very edge of Falmouth.

 

[TechDan2002]

Reported by Marc Huws on Twitter 33158 is now the sole closed top Trident President survivor in Cornwall due withdrawal on Monday: https://twitter.com/marcmorganhuws/status/1445774316931403782?s=21

 

[Trainfan061193]

I did the Exmoor Coaster just a few weeks ago, from Taunton on the 28, then on the EXMO over to Lynmouth, up the hill to catch the Lynton to Barnstaple bus, then a 155 to Tiverton and back on the 22 to Taunton. One variation that I'd like to try is to get the EXMO to Lynmouth and back and then get one of the obscure tendered runs to Dulverton to get the 25 back to Taunton. Did the 25 quite a few years back on a Dart from Bampton to Taunton and it's a cracking run.

The President Tridents are pretty fun too and had a trip from Taunton to Chard on one which was a spirited trip. Last time though, it was one of the ALXs from Axminster to Chard (followed by a 99 - bus not ice cream) and they're fine old machines though showing their age. Perhaps one last trip before Xmas....

I wouldn’t say no to going on a President either as after all it’s a Trident and I do love my Tridents but I’d better be quick! After I’ve done the 28, Exmoor Coaster and 30 I’m hoping to come back up a few weeks later and do the 25 along with one or two more routes.

 

[vla50]

Reported by Marc Huws on Twitter 33158 is now the sole closed top Trident President survivor in Cornwall due withdrawal on Monday: https://twitter.com/marcmorganhuws/status/1445774316931403782?s=21

Weren't some meant to go to Somerset?

Will 33072/144/158/182 end up at Ensign (if you don't mind me asking) or will they perhaps end up at Winkleigh/Dan Shears?

 

[83G/84D]

38206 is in Camborne having arrived today.

 

[richw]

38206 is in Camborne having arrived today.

The 5th one, 38208 arrived in Truro this afternoon, planned to be moved to Camborne tomorrow morning.

 

[83G/84D]

The 5th one, 38208 arrived in Truro this afternoon, planned to be moved to Camborne tomorrow morning.

Thanks, I am day off work tomorrow so hopefully I might see it arrive. I have missed seeing the others arrive due to work commitments so be nice to see it arrive, fingers crossed I will.

 

[Lizard1324]

With the Enviro 500 starting operation soon which routes do you think they will operate.
I am thinking the obvious ones are the T1 to Truro College and a U1 from falmouth to Truro College.

Maybe even a L1 as this requires more then 1 bus, but would be fun around mullion.

 

[richw]

With the Enviro 500 starting operation soon which routes do you think they will operate.
I am thinking the obvious ones are the T1 to Truro College and a U1 from falmouth to Truro College.

Maybe even a L1 as this requires more then 1 bus, but would be fun around mullion.

Consider routes that need more than 1 bus and they will be most likely candidates.
St Blazey/ Holmbush St Austell currently fills 2-3 Gemini’s too between 3-4 stops along the main drag

 

[Goldfish62]

It seems that First Group South West has bought remaining shareholding of Somerset Passenger Solutions, so now owns SPS

SPS has a 156 vehicle fleet according to Regulatory announcements

FirstGroup PLC Acquisition of remaining shareholding in SPS

FIRSTGROUP PLC ACQUISITION OF REMAINING SHAREHOLDING IN SOMERSET PASSENGER SOLUTIONS FirstGroup plc ('FirstGroup') is pleased...

uk.advfn.com

In terms of turnover SPS is a larger company than FSW so the significance of the purchase can't be underestimated.

 

[Lizard1324]

Does that now mean when the Sps buses go past the maximum age limit they will be cascaded to other First bus areas?

 

[richw]

Does that now mean when the Sps buses go past the maximum age limit they will be cascaded to other First bus areas?

Majority are leased so would return to lease company for resale

 

[83G/84D]

@richw delivered the remaining Enviro 500 to Camborne this morning. 38208 is seen here at Tuckingmill on the last part of the journey from Truro.

 

[Busaholic]

My experience is a lot more limited but I'd tend to agree. Not surprising in some respects as two of the more populous villages and tourist hotspots, Marazion and Porthleven, are on that stretch, as is Goldsithney. Not much on the stretch from Helston until the very edge of Falmouth.

No doubt about it whatsoever. The campus at Penryn is almost an irrelevance to the running of the route at the western end, save for one eastbound journey a.m. and one westbound p.m. Even the U prefix, at a time when Penzance also saw routes with A,M and T prefixes, really only served to muddy the waters, although the new blue deckers branded for the U routes were an improvement on what went before. Regrettably, they seem to have departed (sorry, I don't follow all the comings and goings on here, life being too short.)