First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

[Private Baxter]

With regards to the new 374 and 375 will they be able to be operated by deckers or will they need to be Streetlites? Am asking as my understanding is the 28 can't use deckers.

It sounds an interesting idea but if it leads to regular single deck workings between Bristol and Wells in place of double deck workings and a greater potential for delay en route then much less so.

Histrorically deckers have been used on the 29, though it was never officially the allocated vehicle. That was some years ago, and the route has changed numerous times since then, so can't speak for the current route. Meanwhile they have never been used on the 375, but presumably there is no reason why they can't.
I think Wimdmill Hill is the section that loses in this. They claim not many board there, and maybe that's the case (although it didn't use to be). Perhaps the 377 can be rerouted up there as the official Wimdmill Hill bus?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

With regards to the new 374 and 375 will they be able to be operated by deckers or will they need to be Streetlites? Am asking as my understanding is the 28 can't use deckers.

It sounds an interesting idea but if it leads to regular single deck workings between Bristol and Wells in place of double deck workings and a greater potential for delay en route then much less so.

Think you may be confused.

The 28 is Taunton to Minehead.

The 29 is Taunton to Glastonbury and can take deckers. Single decks out of Bristol wouldn’t have the capacity.

 

[Will1am]

Histrorically deckers have been used on the 29, though it was never officially the allocated vehicle. That was some years ago, and the route has changed numerous times since then, so can't speak for the current route. Meanwhile they have never been used on the 375, but presumably there is no reason why they can't.
I think Wimdmill Hill is the section that loses in this. They claim not many board there, and maybe that's the case (although it didn't use to be). Perhaps the 377 can be rerouted up there as the official Wimdmill Hill bus?

Historically if I'm correct they probably would have been deckers but Wells depot if I'm correct only recently got the ability to facilitate them

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Histrorically deckers have been used on the 29, though it was never officially the allocated vehicle. That was some years ago, and the route has changed numerous times since then, so can't speak for the current route. Meanwhile they have never been used on the 375, but presumably there is no reason why they can't.
I think Wimdmill Hill is the section that loses in this. They claim not many board there, and maybe that's the case (although it didn't use to be). Perhaps the 377 can be rerouted up there as the official Wimdmill Hill bus?

Decker were used on the Bridgwater route in the latter days of Bridgwater depot when an e200 wasn’t available.

Deckers can be used on those services but are massively overcapacity for the loadings. However, you need deckers for the Bristol end even with the extra capacity from the 172

 

[Private Baxter]

Historically if I'm correct they probably would have been deckers but Wells depot if I'm correct only recently got the ability to facilitate them

Wells became 'decker compliant' in 2015. Deckers had never been used on the 375 or 163 before that, though demand never really justified it anyway.
The 29 was always operated by Taunton depot, and was for many years a bit of a cinderella route, so wasnt unheard of for one to stray on there. In fact there was a time when a Taunton bus was outstationed in Wells, but before retiring, had to do a Wells duty on the old 172 (Wells to Wookey Hole), so that saw a decker from time to time, albeit rarely!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Historically if I'm correct they probably would have been deckers but Wells depot if I'm correct only recently got the ability to facilitate them

No - the 29 and 75 routes were traditionally single decked. They aren’t that busy in the main. In fact, it was often a minibus in the 1990s - a Vario or an 811.

Wells depot was modified in 2015 to accommodate deckers when the Streetdecks arrived

 

[Private Baxter]

Decker were used on the Bridgwater route in the latter days of Bridgwater depot when an e200 wasn’t available.

Deckers can be used on those services but are massively overcapacity for the loadings. However, you need deckers for the Bristol end even with the extra capacity from the 172

Thanks for clarifying; I wasnt aware of that.

To pick up on a point you made yesterday, I too am a little skeptical as to whether this is the right move. In fact I think the current arrangement works well, and the smaller buses are ideal.

Both the 375 anf 376 used to do the full route, to Bridgwater and Yeovil respectively, but one of the reasons they were split was reliability - it was hard to explain to someone down in, say, Ilminster, that the bus was late due to issues in Whitchurch!

The other issue was a legal one to do with driver hours, but I expect there are reasonable ways round that.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Thanks for clarifying; I wasnt aware of that.

To pick up on a point you made yesterday, I too am a little skeptical as to whether this is the right move. In fact I think the current arrangement works well, and the smaller buses are ideal.

Both the 375 anf 376 used to do the full route, to Bridgwater and Yeovil respectively, but one of the reasons they were split was reliability - it was hard to explain to someone down in, say, Ilminster, that the bus was late due to issues in Whitchurch!

The other issue was a legal one to do with driver hours, but I expect there are reasonable ways round that.

I think you mean Ilchester I always mix the two up. Drivers hours was fine once they did separate registrations but I fear for reliability as you say.

 

[Peter Philips]

Histrorically deckers have been used on the 29, though it was never officially the allocated vehicle. That was some years ago, and the route has changed numerous times since then, so can't speak for the current route. Meanwhile they have never been used on the 375, but presumably there is no reason why they can't.

I travelled on a DD 29 only last year and the route was fine tree wise. Also the 75 required a DD on the college timed journeys in more recent times after the additional college service was withdrawn in Buses of Somerset cuts before both routes transferred to West of England.

 

[Private Baxter]

I think you mean Ilchester I always mix the two up. Drivers hours was fine once they did separate registrations but I fear for reliability as you say.

Haha I think I did!
And call me Mr Negative, but I can see it reverting back to something resembling the current operation in a few years, but I'm happy to be proved wrong. I think the resources can be better utilsed elsewhere, rather than some west Somerset villages.

 

[Will1am]

Here is the new timetables shown. New routes shown are 374,375 and 376a.

 

[Private Baxter]

Here is the new timetables shown. New routes shown are 374,375 and 376a.

Ahh I was under the impression Windmill Hill was being removed from the services, so good to see it remains.on 374/375.
Didn't expect to see 376a! Replacing some early 172 journeys maybe?

 

[DaveHarries]

Didn't expect to see 376a! Replacing some early 172 journeys maybe?

The Bus Advistory Boaard meeting of Somerset COunty Council on 06th February was told that the Wells to Bath journeys numbered as Service 172 will be replaced by journeys numbered as Service 171 to avoid confusion with the Bristol 172.

Dave

 

[Buses in Bath]

Ahh I was under the impression Windmill Hill was being removed from the services, so good to see it remains.on 374/375.
Didn't expect to see 376a! Replacing some early 172 journeys maybe?

It was kind of just a warning as he said it was a use it or lose it situation. Also mentioned Rode on the D2 having low numbers. Got to imagine imagine the 376a is replacing the 172 journeys that start/end at Midsomer Norton. The Mendip routes look a lot more connected up that the dire situation it found itself in not too long ago. Good that theyre clearing up buses that start end part way through a route. Seems Midsomer Norton has much better connections to Wells and Bristol now.

 

[Citistar]

The Bus Advistory Boaard meeting of Somerset COunty Council on 06th February was told that the Wells to Bristol journeys numbered as Service 172 will be replaced by journeys numbered as Service 171 to avoid confusion with the Bristol 172.

Dave

Wells to Bath 172 depot journeys become 171.

376A appears to replace the morning 173 shorts feeding in to 172 journeys starting at Midsomer Norton for Bristol. The late evening 376A journeys are a very welcome addition to the provision between Bristol and Norton. My only criticism is that the numbering feels a bit clumsy. Perhaps 372 would have made more sense given that we're going to be seeing 374 and 375 along the same corridor. I also hope that 376A won't be unnecessarily dragging around Redfield Road in both directions.

Most of us haven't seen a revised 172 timetable yet, so it'll be interesting to see how many adjustments there are to that. This regular user hopes that some of the slack in the daytime journeys (particularly Peasedown -> MSN and Temple Meads -> Whitchurch) has been taken out as the sitting around on bus stops for 8-9 minutes is very frustrating.

 

[Private Baxter]

It was kind of just a warning as he said it was a use it or lose it situation. Also mentioned Rode on the D2 having low numbers. Got to imagine imagine the 376a is replacing the 172 journeys that start/end at Midsomer Norton. The Mendip routes look a lot more connected up that the dire situation it found itself in not too long ago. Good that theyre clearing up buses that start end part way through a route. Seems Midsomer Norton has much better connections to Wells and Bristol now.

Ahh I see. At the moment it is an hourly service so good that it is being retained. But I do think it will be better on the Yeovil route 77, rather than disrupt the half hourly direct route between Bristol, Glastonbury and Street, especially for those making longer journeys.

 

[AllanMacF]

Wells depot was previously located down the road near one of the former rail stations. It was relocated to the former bus station site in the 1970s. It gained the current maintenance unit, with it being modified to accommodate double deck vehicles in 2015, and a planning application for electric chargers submitted recently.

I suspect that the cold store site is due for redevelopment otherwise they would still be there.

In the 1990s, the allocation was smaller both in vehicles and their dimensions. An allocation of 35 vehicles (ish) is more than I can ever recall.


Interesting as the 36 is a very long established service and route number!

The 41 to Avonmouth reappears after a gap of how long.... 15 years?

I think it is tragic that the 36 is to be renumbered - it is Bristol’s longest serving route, having been introduced around ONE HUNDRED years ago. And for what benefit? Regarding the 77, can we expect a reduction of frequency on the 2/2a and 75/76, because the 77 is to cover the busier inner-urban sections? Also, should First be rivalling a contracted service (41 vv 9)?

 

[Will1am]

I think it is tragic that the 36 is to be renumbered - it is Bristol’s longest serving route, having been introduced around ONE HUNDRED years ago. And for what benefit? Regarding the 77, can we expect a reduction of frequency on the 2/2a and 75/76, because the 77 is to cover the busier inner-urban sections? Also, should First be rivalling a contracted service (41 vv 9)?

The 41 extension is most likely to conflict the 9
the 36 (5) might be renumbered as it's easier to say the 1,2,3,4,5 head up one way and the 5,6,7 etc head the other way
Doubt there would be a frequency decrease when the 77 comes in

 

[diffywood]

As said on BBC radio Bristol a few week's back they want to increase the number of buses going through Gloucester rd in April

 

[Citistar]

I think it is tragic that the 36 is to be renumbered - it is Bristol’s longest serving route, having been introduced around ONE HUNDRED years ago. And for what benefit? Regarding the 77, can we expect a reduction of frequency on the 2/2a and 75/76, because the 77 is to cover the busier inner-urban sections?

I think the logic of the 77 is that it is there to strengthen the existing busy sections of the 2/2A and 75/76. How much it will achieve to that end remains to be judged at least until we see a timetable.

 

[Callum15632]

I think the logic of the 77 is that it is there to strengthen the existing busy sections of the 2/2A and 75/76. How much it will achieve to that end remains to be judged at least until we see a timetable.

Will it be soon that we get timetables for the new routes? Also why couldn't they terminate the 77 at Gipsy Patch Lane or something? That would be a better solution in my opinion.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Will it be soon that we get timetables for the new routes? Also why couldn't they terminate the 77 at Gipsy Patch Lane or something? That would be a better solution in my opinion.

Why Gypsy Patch Lane?

As @Citistar says, Southmead would be much more sensible

 

[Marcus Fryer]

Why Gypsy Patch Lane?

As @Citistar says, Southmead would be much more sensible

Southmead Hospital would be a better option as regards where people want to go, but I would think it might be reaching capacity for terminating buses, especially since the eastern leg of the 10/11 was withdrawn.

 

[Callum15632]

Why Gypsy Patch Lane?

As @Citistar says, Southmead would be much more sensible

There wouldn't be enough room for it to terminate at Southmead Hospital as there's too many buses there in the daytime. It's also hard for buses to stop e.g the Y6 and several other buses that don't terminate there including some stagecoach ones too.

 

[-Colly405-]

Especially with the X10 terminating there every 2 hours from April (see Independents thread...)...

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Given the reductions in frequency to the 76 (was every 12 mins) and 24 (was every 10 minutes) since the enlarged hospital was opened, I’m less convinced of the challenge.

 

[-Colly405-]

Don't forget though that the 76 didn't initially go through the hospital grounds or to the bus station, it kept to Monks Park Ave and Southmead Rd, so all 76s are extra...

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Not in 2014 granted, but definitely a few years later.

I just can’t see the point of terminating in some random place.

 

[-Colly405-]

There is precedent - the 71 on Saturdays only came out as far asuller Rd Top, and there was a time when it was the 24 (or 25) terminus...

 

[Marcus Fryer]

There is precedent - the 71 on Saturdays only came out as far as Muller Rd Top, and there was a time when it was the 24 (or 25) terminus...

Also, some 75s turned round there when they put on extras during COVID. From observation, passenger numbers certainly do fall off north of Horfield Common.