First West Yorkshire & York discussion

[WAB]

The electrics are not popular in Leeds. Slow running and going pop on the 91 leading to 1 or 2 hour gaps which is driving people away from the route, according to the drivers.

 

[Seehof]

Can’t see the diesels leaving York anytime soon. Hope not I often use route 10!

 

[Edvid]

Bramley depot will take on another 22 electric double-deckers as the West Yorkshire ZEBRA 1 pot rose by £3.4 million after a successful variation request to the DfT; First Bus will contribute £7.8 million on top of that. I think this replaces another operator's (Transdev Blazefield?) share of 17 vehicles that remain unordered to date.

First Bus and Combined Authority announce further £11.2m for Bramley bus depot​

16 May 2024

• Investment and co-funding from Department for Transport Zebra scheme
• Extra 22 electric buses brings zero emission fleet to 79 – half Bramley total
• Delivery of more buses expected in July 2024

First Bus and West Yorkshire Combined Authority (WYCA) have announced a further £11.2m investment in the operator’s Bramley depot which will make half the fleet zero emission before the end of 2024.

WYCA with support from First Bus have been successful in securing £3.4m in a ‘variation request’ from the Department for Transport (DfT) Zero Emission Bus Regional Area (ZEBRA) project.

First Bus is investing £7.8m which will introduce an additional 22 double-decker electric buses (EV), increasing the total at the depot to 79.

The announcement came as councillors for the Bramley and Stanningley Ward, Tom Hinchcliffe and Kevin Ritchie visited the depot, now home to the largest fleet of zero emission buses in West Yorkshire, which launched in March.

The additional funding boost comes only two months after the depot, which has been transformed with the capacity to operate a fully electric fleet from earlier ZEBRA funding and investment totalling £29m, was celebrated by First Bus and senior members from WYCA.

Commenting on this latest funding success, Deputy Chair of the West Yorkshire Combined Authority Transport Committee, Cllr Peter Carlill said: “These state-of-the-art electric buses will help West Yorkshire towards its goal of becoming a net zero economy by 2038, as well as encouraging more people to use public transport.”

“We are constantly working to introduce more zero-emission buses to the region’s fleet – boosting air quality, improving public transport and helping tackle the climate emergency.”

“This investment will help us build a greener and better-connected West Yorkshire.”

Megan Hope, Operations Director of First Bus in North & West Yorkshire, hosted the councillors on the tour. She said: “It was a pleasure to show councillors what our team together with suppliers has achieved with the depot transformation and the introduction of our EV fleet. This will play an important part in skilled green jobs for the future and supporting the wider community.”

“It is yet more evidence of our continuing successful partnership with West Yorkshire Combined Authority in bringing major improvements to bus services, supporting a shared ambition for a net-zero transport system and reducing carbon emissions in the city.”

Speaking jointly, Cllrs Tom Hinchcliffe and Kevin Ritchie added: “We welcome this investment in the Bramley depot and are really pleased to see more electric buses on our streets.”

“Buses remain the most used form of public transport and so any change to make them more environmentally friendly has a significant impact on reaching our city’s climate targets and providing the public transport network our residents deserve.”

“From a local point of view, more electric buses means better air quality for the people in the area surrounding the depot, as well as the people on the routes these buses serve. We all know clean air has a huge positive impact on people’s health and wellbeing so to see this change is great news.”

“We welcome the support that the WYCA mayor has done in helping to secure this funding and making positive change for our local area.”

The current fleet of 57 electric buses - 32 single-decker GB Kite Electroliners 25 StreetDeck Electroliner double-deckers - entered service in March. The buses are manufactured by Wrightbus in Northern Ireland with features including audio visual next stop technology and USB charging points.

Each bus saves around 75 tonnes of CO2e a year, making a total of 4,275 equivalent tonnes of carbon annually.

“We’re seeing a positive reaction from customers to the electric buses and believe they will attract more people to consider bus travel by realising the real impact this has in reducing congestion and creating cleaner air and quieter streets,” added Megan Hope.

 

[WY Bus Spotter]

Bramley depot will take on another 22 electric double-deckers as the West Yorkshire ZEBRA 1 pot rose by £3.4 million after a successful variation request to the DfT; First Bus will contribute £7.8 million on top of that. I think this replaces another operator's (Transdev Blazefield?) share of 17 vehicles that remain unordered to date.

Transdev are getting E-Citaros for theShuttle in Keighley. The only order that hasn't been announced is the Flyer one.

 

[Mollman]

Transdev are getting E-Citaros for theShuttle in Keighley. The only order that hasn't been announced is the Flyer one.

I can't recall seeing Arriva's order announced either

 

[Man of Kent]

I can't recall seeing Arriva's order announced either

Original bid documents were for 47 DD for Arriva, 32 SD for First and also 32 SD for Transdev. The Keighley order is for 15 Citaros; the grant funding for the remaining 17 would not be equal to the cost of this new First order for 22 DD, so it does look more likely it has come from the Arriva allocation, especially as the detailed documents showed 11 vehicles each for three distinct groups of Arriva services.

(If the original bid document is still on the WYCA website, I can't find it - this detail comes from a downloaded copy).

 

[WY Bus Spotter]

I can't recall seeing Arriva's order announced either

*Just in terms of Transdev*

 

[ash39]

69276 and 278 off-road atm

276 waiting new head gasket
278 engine blew up 18mo after replacement so waiting for new engine under warranty

275/277/279 still plying their trade

69276 back out today

 

[dodecahedron67]

Happy to say (especially to @Seehof) that the long term planned changes to 10/59 are coming from June 2nd.

59 will now serve all stops on Leeman Road Mon-Sun with a revised timetable

10 will be rerouted to go via York Station, Blossom St, Holgate Road Mon-Sun daytime. It will use Kites mainly with Electroliners subbing as a last resort.

New service 10L will be introduced evenings which will serve Leeman Road when the 59 doesn’t run. This will use Versas.

At the same time, the 1/1A changes will happen. 1s will receive a new timetable with 1 journey per hour now as a 1A, which will serve Haxby West Nooks via York Road.

This will finally allow the release of the last 5 B7s and 100% electric operation

 

[YorkRailFan]

Happy to say (especially to @Seehof) that the long term planned changes to 10/59 are coming from June 2nd.

59 will now serve all stops on Leeman Road Mon-Sun with a revised timetable

10 will be rerouted to go via York Station, Blossom St, Holgate Road Mon-Sun daytime. It will use Kites mainly with Electroliners subbing as a last resort.

New service 10L will be introduced evenings which will serve Leeman Road when the 59 doesn’t run. This will use Versas.

At the same time, the 1/1A changes will happen. 1s will receive a new timetable with 1 journey per hour now as a 1A, which will serve Haxby West Nooks via York Road.

This will finally allow the release of the last 5 B7s and 100% electric operation

That's great news! Just hoping the Versas can keep up.

 

[dodecahedron67]

That's great news! Just hoping the Versas can keep up.

As the 10L will only require 2 vehicles, I believe the plan is to use early run-off versas that are then recharged and sent out for the 7pm-midnight section.

Early versa:
1x 200
1x 8

Daytime versa:
4x 59
1x C1
2-3x 9
1x 8

Evening versa:
2x 10L

 

[Seehof]

Wow!
Thank you for this information.

 

[158756]

Original bid documents were for 47 DD for Arriva, 32 SD for First and also 32 SD for Transdev. The Keighley order is for 15 Citaros; the grant funding for the remaining 17 would not be equal to the cost of this new First order for 22 DD, so it does look more likely it has come from the Arriva allocation, especially as the detailed documents showed 11 vehicles each for three distinct groups of Arriva services.

(If the original bid document is still on the WYCA website, I can't find it - this detail comes from a downloaded copy).

They've apparently got an extra £3.4m from the DfT, would that be right for changing 17 single decks to 22 doubles?

I think I've found that document or a similar one, it suggests the Transdev Flyer order was to have some sort of pantograph charging system. If that is the batch that's been dropped maybe the technology is a factor, more conventional EVs seem to be the way things are going.

 

[Bayum]

Bramley depot will take on another 22 electric double-deckers as the West Yorkshire ZEBRA 1 pot rose by £3.4 million after a successful variation request to the DfT; First Bus will contribute £7.8 million on top of that. I think this replaces another operator's (Transdev Blazefield?) share of 17 vehicles that remain unordered to date.

What is a variation request? What vehicle has been ordered?

 

[Edvid]

West Yorkshire CA sought consent from the DfT to alter the agreed ZEBRA vehicle quota per operator, which in this case was dependent on extra funding. I expect First Bus will have ordered the same model (Streetdeck Electroliner) as before.

(If the original bid document is still on the WYCA website, I can't find it - this detail comes from a downloaded copy).

This one?

https://www.westyorks-ca.gov.uk/media/8305/zebra-fbc-redacted.pdf

[N.B. There's a flaw that allows some of the redacted text to be read.]

 

[aswilliamsuk]

They've apparently got an extra £3.4m from the DfT, would that be right for changing 17 single decks to 22 doubles?

I think I've found that document or a similar one, it suggests the Transdev Flyer order was to have some sort of pantograph charging system. If that is the batch that's been dropped maybe the technology is a factor, more conventional EVs seem to be the way things are going.

The Harrogate examples are going to be pantograph charged (as well as the E400EVs for the 36, if I understood correctly), and I'd be surprised if the Keighley examples too won't be the same.

Believe the problem with the Flyer examples was electrifying Idle depot (it isn't currently possible to do, or that's what I'd heard)

 

[Leedsbusman]

The Harrogate examples are going to be pantograph charged (as well as the E400EVs for the 36, if I understood correctly), and I'd be surprised if the Keighley examples too won't be the same.

Believe the problem with the Flyer examples was electrifying Idle depot (it isn't currently possible to do, or that's what I'd heard)

I was told the issue for the Flyer buses was depot related.
Neither the Harrogate or Keighley e-Citaros will have pantograph charging, but the E400EVs will do as I understand.

 

[aswilliamsuk]

I was told the issue for the Flyer buses was depot related.
Neither the Harrogate or Keighley e-Citaros will have pantograph charging, but the E400EVs will do as I understand.

Interesting! I thought the installation of pantograph charging units at Harrogate in particular was for all the new vehicles! I stand corrected.

 

[Russel]

How many Streetdecks have First in Leeds/Bradford lost to fire/arson since their introduction?

Reason I ask is I remember one around a year ago, but I saw a video pop up on social media and the caption suggested it was recent to within the last couple of days, but not seen anything else about it to suggest it's actually a recent video.

 

[dodecahedron67]

How many Streetdecks have First in Leeds/Bradford lost to fire/arson since their introduction?

Reason I ask is I remember one around a year ago, but I saw a video pop up on social media and the caption suggested it was recent to within the last couple of days, but not seen anything else about it to suggest it's actually a recent video.

I believe it’s just 2 - 35289 in Leeds and 35647 in Bradford

 

[158756]

I believe it’s just 2 - 35289 in Leeds and 35647 in Bradford

There were three last year alone - one in Middleton, one in Harehills and one in Bradford. All apparently arson.

There was actually another suspected arson this week in Leeds city centre, but it doesn't look like the damage is as bad this time.

Police probe 'malicious' Leeds city centre bus fire

West Yorkshire Police say they are investigating the circumstances behind a bus fire in Leeds.

www.bbc.co.uk

Police probe 'malicious' Leeds city centre bus fire


A bus fire in Leeds city centre is being investigated as potentially "malicious".

Firefighters were called to Vicar Lane at about 13:45 BST to a blaze on the first floor of the vehicle.

West Yorkshire Police said there were no casualties, but both the force and firefighters "believe the cause to be malicious".

First Bus said the driver was told about the fire by a customer on board, with the vehicle evacuated.

A police spokesperson said officers were investigating the incident.

 

[mlambeuk]

It looks like the local yobs are up to their tricks in York

Vandals damage York’s buses in ‘streak’ of incidents

They are targeting three routes

yorkmix.com

Police are appealing for the public’s help after ‘a streak of criminal damage incidents’ on York buses.

The vandals are targeting First York buses on the routes 1, 3 and 5.

PC John-Simon Coleman said: “Unknown suspects repeatedly keep damaging headrests on the brand new zero emission buses.

Mod note: a relevant quote should be included when referring to an external source.

 

[dodecahedron67]

It looks like the local yobs are up to their tricks in York

Vandals damage York’s buses in ‘streak’ of incidents

They are targeting three routes

yorkmix.com

Mod note: a relevant quote should be included when referring to an external source.

Been happening for months, even before the electroliners/kites arrived last summer

Kids from JoRo school are worst for it on 1s