Flight shaming

[HSTEd]

There is work towards electric short-haul aircraft - probably not going to be taking you to New York or Singapore any time soon, but could be just the trick for outlying islands. I could see Loganair going over to fully electric operation in due course, for instance.

When that happens, there might well not be much in it between non-electrified railways and battery-electric air travel in terms of CO2 emissions.

If we get good enough batteries to make short haul airliners practical, we will also have non-electrified railways being operated entirely by battery trains.

 

[Bletchleyite]

There is work towards electric short-haul aircraft - probably not going to be taking you to New York or Singapore any time soon, but could be just the trick for outlying islands. I could see Loganair going over to fully electric operation in due course, for instance.

When that happens, there might well not be much in it between non-electrified railways and battery-electric air travel in terms of CO2 emissions.

I think electric buses and coaches are a far bigger threat. What justification does one have to keep a branch line open when you've got a zero emission new bus with a posh interior against a rotting, near-50-year-old Class 150 belching filth?

The railway needs to buck that particular idea up very quickly or there'll certainly be an anti-diesel Beeching II.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If we get good enough batteries to make short haul airliners practical, we will also have non-electrified railways being operated entirely by battery trains.

Branch line railways are already viable to operate in that way - my local bus service (which has a 2 hour end to end running time, roughly, with top-up charging at the outer ends) has been battery operated for about 3-4 years now. The railway is just being typically slow in adopting it, and the purchase of brand-new filth-spewing DMUs for Northern and West Midlands Trains (rather than bi-modes with a planned option to swap the generator raft for battery kit) is nothing short of scandalous.

Ironically the biggest new fume-belchers, the TPE LHCS, can just have an E-lok coupled on the end...solved!

And Vivarail need to get their skates on to develop a battery 230 that can charge from the OHLE, that would be perfect for the Marston Vale.

 

[Bald Rick]

I think electric buses and coaches are a far bigger threat. What justification does one have to keep a branch line open when you've got a zero emission new bus with a posh interior against a rotting, near-50-year-old Class 150 belching filth?

The railway needs to buck that particular idea up very quickly or there'll certainly be an anti-diesel Beeching II.

Quite. As has been demonstrated on these very pages repeatedly, for many branch lines it would be quicker, cheaper*, more environmentally friendly, and more convenient (in terms of accessibility and frequency) for an electric bus / coach service than to operate a branch line railway, let alone build a new one.

* very, very much cheaper.

 

[Bald Rick]

So once the line is fully high speed and the service runs stop the time would be around 7 hours. Would attract some passengers but wouldn't be a complete shift of course.

What do you mean by “once the line is fully high speed”? There are no plans to raise the speeds of HS1, or any of the LGVs.

 

[BigCj34]

What do you mean by “once the line is fully high speed”? There are no plans to raise the speeds of HS1, or any of the LGVs.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGV_Montpellier–Perpignan

That segment is not LGV at the moment. Probably would shave 30 minutes off the journey.

 

[Bald Rick]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGV_Montpellier–Perpignan

That segment is not LGV at the moment. Probably would shave 30 minutes off the journey.

Ah, I see. Well that’s a long way away (I though Macron had paused all new high speed lines, but perhaps this one got through). However it’s only about 150km; a non-stop service would save nearly an hour compared to today’s best time. So we’d be down to 6h30 at best, call it 6h45, which I’d argue is still too long, unless there was something particularly special about it, eg top class full service offer, entertainment on train, etc.

However it does then bring it just about into the realm of possibility for a return trip with one set for the day; 0700 off London, 1445 CET arrival Barca, 1615 departure, London arrive 2200. If fares were set high enough (probably an average fare of £200+ one way) it might might might just be viable.

Interesting though, as if this last stretch does get built it will bring Paris to Barcelona non-stop to around 4h30, and that will make a dent in the airlines.