Forgot Railcard

[arachnid1]

Hey everyone,

So today I got caught without my 16-25 railcard (which I do own, just didn't have it on me) at the return leg of my journey. He took my details and said I would receive a letter.
My journey was literally 15 mins each way within Cardiff.
Will I be fined or can I prove that I own a railcard and let off? As i travelled on 2 journeys without my railcard will this be worse for me in the outcome?

Thanks for any advice.

 

[ikcdab]

Normally you are allowed to forget your Railcard once a year. You need to wait for the letter, depending on what it says, if you can show you had a valid Railcard then the matter should end there. Assuming you haven't done this before within the last twelve months.
If it was a return journey then it shouldn't make a difference.

 

[scrapy]

Normally you are allowed to forget your Railcard once a year.

Unfortunately this is not actually the case. You must have your Railcard with you on every journey.

If you are required to buy a new ticket you are able to claim a refund once in a twelve month period. This does not apply in the OPs case as they were not given this opportunity (I have my own views on this but there's no point in debating whether this is fair or unfair on this thread as such debate will not help the OPs situation).

Many TOCs prosecutions units will not pursue a prosecution if a valid Railcard is provided as mitigation, but they are not under any obligation to do this.

 

[arachnid1]

Unfortunately this is not actually the case. You must have your Railcard with you on every journey.

If you are required to buy a new ticket you are able to claim a refund once in a twelve month period. This does not apply in the OPs case as they were not given this opportunity (I have my own views on this but there's no point in debating whether this is fair or unfair on this thread as such debate will not help the OPs situation).

Many TOCs prosecutions units will not pursue a prosecution if a valid Railcard is provided as mitigation, but they are not under any obligation to do this.

thanks for your reply. so if they don't ask to see the rail card, will I be in for a fine?

 

[ikcdab]

When you get the letter it will give you the opportunity to reply. It's then that you state you have a valid Railcard and you send them a copy of it.

My original post was maybe a bit loose. There is no rule that you can forget your card once a year. It's more that railway companies will not normally persue such cases, much as @scrapy states above, on the general rule of thumb that you have not done it in the last year.

 

[arachnid1]

When you get the letter it will give you the opportunity to reply. It's then that you state you have a valid Railcard and you send them a copy of it.

My original post was maybe a bit loose. There is no rule that you can forget your card once a year. It's more that railway companies will not normally persue such cases, much as @scrapy states above, on the general rule of thumb that you have not done it in the last year.

hopefully when i get the letter I can explain, and show my railcard and all will be good. I'll let you know the outcome.

When you get the letter it will give you the opportunity to reply. It's then that you state you have a valid Railcard and you send them a copy of it.

My original post was maybe a bit loose. There is no rule that you can forget your card once a year. It's more that railway companies will not normally persue such cases, much as @scrapy states above, on the general rule of thumb that you have not done it in the last year.

do you know how strict transport for wales is, as I'm a bit scared not gonna lie. The man acted like I was some evil person, but it was a mistake (an illegal one I know).
I just don't understand why I couldn't have just payed the full fare again and leave it at that, and show them emails of my railcard purchase. Rail companies are not user friendly at all.

 

[ikcdab]

I don't know the exact answer to your question. But if you review the various threads on here then it seems that rail companies generally do not take things further if you had a valid Railcard and just left out at home, assuming this is the first case on a twelve month period.
Clearly they have a process to go through and you need to wait for that to happen.
If they just allowed you to pay on the train then nobody would buy a ticket and would only pay if they got caught.

 

[arachnid1]

hi guys, I got the dreaded letter today...

 

[WesternLancer]

hi guys, I got the dreaded letter today...

so IIRC you own a valid Railcard (or did do at the time of that journey, but just did not have it on you at the time) - is this correct?

This looks like a standard template letter from TIL (for which they have presumably put no effort into relating to the circumstances of the case) does not properly cover the scenario you described in your original post

I would assume your 'mitigation' is that:
- you possess a valid railcard (but did not have it with you on this occasion due to an oversight),
- and you are now enclosing a copy of the Railcard as proof
- and that you believe the sum requested is not owed in line with the relevant policy associated with the Railcard

ie this:

Will I have to pay the full fare if I forget to bring my Railcard when I travel? - 16-25 Railcard

A 16-25 Railcard costs just �30 and it'll save you 1/3 on rail fares throughout Great Britain for a whole year.

www.16-25railcard.co.uk

or am I missing something?

So if I am not wrong then you need to draft up a letter in reply along those lines - but maybe a good idea to post your draft up here for comment before sending so experts can check the wording is in suitable 'railway speak' that TIL will understand.

 

[arachnid1]

this is my letter, probably not very good, any advice would be appreciated. I will also post a copy of my railcard.

 

[jfollows]

Others may comment further on the exact words and have proposed changes, but I do suggest two things:

1. Ask for something. Don't leave the letter dangling, but close with something along the lines of "I hope and trust that this information will enable you to consider this matter closed" or whatever.
2. Make it clear that you have understood the mistake you made and won't make it again, that you will ensure that you always have your railcard with you in future.

Your intent is to avoid not just prosecution but also the offer of a settlement, on the basis that you did have a railcard, and the formal conditions of travel (https://assets.nationalrail.co.uk/e...572570/National_Rail_Conditions_of_Travel.pdf) refers to a process for this, however it's not exactly in line with what you have encountered, but we normally see rail companies agree to waive prosecutions in similar circumstances to yours.

 

[WesternLancer]

Others may comment further on the exact words and have proposed changes, but I do suggest two things:

1. Ask for something. Don't leave the letter dangling, but close with something along the lines of "I hope and trust that this information will enable you to consider this matter closed" or whatever.
2. Make it clear that you have understood the mistake you made and won't make it again, that you will ensure that you always have your railcard with you in future.

Your intent is to avoid not just prosecution but also the offer of a settlement, on the basis that you did have a railcard, and the formal conditions of travel (https://assets.nationalrail.co.uk/e...572570/National_Rail_Conditions_of_Travel.pdf) refers to a process for this, however it's not exactly in line with what you have encountered, but we normally see rail companies agree to waive prosecutions in similar circumstances to yours.

Yes, as well as thse points 1&2 it needs to:

- make clear in your wording in the letter (with proof enclosed as you intend) that you have a valid Railcard
- that the Railcard policy / T&Cs or FAQs as per the relevant Railcard website allows you to submit this evidence so that no further action is taken (the reason you are including the proof)

 

[ikcdab]

Agree with that. You need to enclose a copy of the valid railcard and make it clear that you have done so.
Im would also make it clear that "As i did indeed have a valid railcard and this is the first time I have done this, then i ask that this issue is now closed" or something similar.

 

[arachnid1]

Hi guys, good news. I got my letter yesterday and they have closed the case thank you for all your help with everything. I appreciate it

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi guys, good news. I got my letter yesterday and they have closed the case thank you for all your help with everything. I appreciate it

Good news, and good to hear systems working OK