Freezing weather on the way

[InkyScrolls]

This is hilarious. One inch of snow and the SE grinds to a halt; cars are abandoned, people are 'snowed in', it's described as 'treacherous'. . . You can tell what their winters are usually like!

 

[RichJF]

This is hilarious. One inch of snow and the SE grinds to a halt; cars are abandoned, people are 'snowed in', it's described as 'treacherous'. . . You can tell what their winters are usually like!

To be fair the local buses, schools & trains ARE running in my area. The local gritters/ploughs were out in force last night.
Southern/Thameslink have tried to get a service running. Southeastern have completely given up, despite having to deal with the same amount of snow/ice as other operators.

I attribute lots of the issues to people not knowing how to drive in wintry conditions or being scared of the roads in snow. Couple that with big 4x4s with summer tyres & you get the inevitable result. You can get a surprising amount of traction on snow with sensible, slow driving & the right tyres, even with 2wd.

 

[Russel]

This is hilarious. One inch of snow and the SE grinds to a halt; cars are abandoned, people are 'snowed in', it's described as 'treacherous'. . . You can tell what their winters are usually like!

I was accused of talking absolute nonsense earlier in this thread for predicting this very thing happening!

 

[Snow1964]

I was accused of talking absolute nonsense earlier in this thread for predicting this very thing happening!

So was I, when I suggested people in UK should use all season (all year) tyres so don’t get stranded when there is rare snowy weather

 

[AM9]

... Southern/Thameslink have tried to get a service running. Southeastern have completely given up, despite having to deal with the same amount of snow/ice as other operators.

Now let me guess, what is common with all those services, ah yes it's that ultra reliable 3rd rail low voltage supply that trains use, - No OLE problems there!

 

[ChrisC]

I attribute lots of the issues to people not knowing how to drive in wintry conditions or being scared of the roads in snow. Couple that with big 4x4s with summer tyres & you get the inevitable result. You can get a surprising amount of traction on snow with sensible, slow driving & the right tyres, even with 2wd.

It's not just people not knowing how to drive in snowy conditions it's also general icy conditions. We've had so few winters in recent years with days of heavy frost that drivers don't realise the dangers of things like black ice.

Older drivers, especially in rural areas remember the roads and country lanes that were always prone to icy conditions at times of heavy frost and drive accordingly. When I'm driving slowly and carefully in these conditions it horrifies me at the drivers who try to overtake me at speed. Yesterday morning on the road out of the village where I live it was very icy as usual and I drove very slowly much to the annoyance of a young driver following me. On my return journey the road was partly blocked by three 4x4's which had skidded off the road on the ice.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

In London, most of the underground seems to be fouled up - which I'm slightly surprised about: From experience in previous years, and because it's - umm - underground - I'd normally expect it to be running fine even when national rail is severely disrupted by snow. Kudos to the Elizabeth line though - it seems the new infrastructure there is working fine. DLR also good. From memory, I think the DLR has also generally held up well in previous years when it's snowed.

Live departures at Abbey Wood is showing quite a contrast - with basically every Elizabeth line train showing as On Time, while the vast majority of SouthEastern/Thameslink trains are delayed or cancelled.

(In this map, the coloured lines are disrupted, lines running OK are in light gray)

As expected, now snow has fallen in London / S.East, the weather is suddenly getting greater prominence...w

Was it expected? I'm pretty sure when I checked the local weather forecast last night (in SE London) it didn't say anything about snow. I thought I remembered seeing that it was suggesting some very light rain. I was certainly pretty surprised when I woke up this morning to a sea of whiteness.

 

[kristiang85]

In London, most of the underground seems to be fouled up - which I'm slightly surprised about: From experience in previous years, and because it's - umm - underground - I'd normally expect it to be running fine even when national rail is severely disrupted by snow.

Only 45% is underground, and most termini are above ground, so I can see how it can be easily disrupted.

Seemed fine enough when I came in this morning though.

 

[gswindale]

The transport situation in the south east this morning would suggest its not nonsense.

What transport situation?

Woke up this morning and spotted a covering of snow (and ice) on our garden/roads.

Received notification from the nursery that their car park was not gritted (it's the local school's responsibility I believe).

Drove carefully from our driveway to the main bus-route and carefully into the nursery/school grounds. No problems.

Took heed of the traffic information on Google Maps, so worked from home and came into the office once traffic was back to more reasonable levels.

Certainly hasn't caused any disruption to my working apart from the office being like a freezer this morning.

I've seen worse traffic when we get Scotland's annual rainfall in a few hours.

I don't think that what we have seen has caused

If we get an inch of snow, the country grinds to a halt, we give up and call it a day...

as you suggested earlier on - certainly the traffic levels I've seen suggest normal working down here in the arctic wastes of Berkshire.

 

[birchesgreen]

Was it expected? I'm pretty sure when I checked the local weather forecast last night (in SE London) it didn't say anything about snow. I thought I remembered seeing that it was suggesting some very light rain. I was certainly pretty surprised when I woke up this morning to a sea of whiteness.

BBC weather forecast last night did predict it.

 

[Mag_seven]

This happens ever year when we get a period of snowfall. Stories of schools closed and people trapped in their cars / trains for hours. The word "Chaos" dominates the headlines. Then the mild weather returns and its all forgotten about until next year.

 

[gswindale]

I wasn't expecting it, but wasn't surprised having been out at Wellington Country Park last night to see the lights there.

Certainly felt like snow was in the air, but wasn't on my forecasts.

 

[brad465]

I remember Michael McIntyre once joked how when it snows, news, weather, travel and sport are all exactly the same.

 

[AM9]

This is hilarious. One inch of snow and the SE grinds to a halt; cars are abandoned, people are 'snowed in', it's described as 'treacherous'. . . You can tell what their winters are usually like!

I was accused of talking absolute nonsense earlier in this thread for predicting this very thing happening!

I see this provincial trope is still trotted out whenever the south-east gets weather that it's infrastructure isn't built for.

 

[12LDA28C]

I remember Michael McIntyre once joked how when it snows, news, weather, travel and sport are all exactly the same.

Now there's a comedian who's about as funny as being trapped in your car on a blocked M25 all night.

 

[InkyScrolls]

I see this provincial trope is still trotted out whenever the south-east gets weather that it's infrastructure isn't built for.

Rather insulting, don't you think?

It's strange that as soon as London hits 0°C and receives half an inch of the white stuff the 'whole county grinds to a halt', while in, for example, November last year when my village in the North of England and much of the surrounding area had was at -10°C with just under five feet of snow, it doesn't even get mentioned - because a) if it doesn't happen in the SE the media don't care, and b) we just sucked it up and got on with it; no point in nancying around or whinging to the press.

It's winter. It's cold and it will snow. Why is that such a surprise to Southerners, every single year?

 

[WelshBluebird]

The time to start worrying is if we get a repeat of Winter 1962/1963. Sub-zero temperatures on most days between December and April....

It is worth stating the somewhat obvious, that something that happened 60 years ago is out of the living memory of the vast majority of the population. It may feel like it wasn't that long ago but those who hark on about how we were fine in previous times seem to forget that firstly life has changed a huge amount since then, and secondly the people who were around back then aren't the same people dealing with the situation now.

It's winter. It's cold and it will snow. Why is that such a surprise to Southerners, every single year?

Partly because it doesn't always snow every single year, and when it does it is usually one maybe two days a year. Spending lots of money to beef up our infrastructure for between 0.25 and 0.5% of the year is generally simply not worth it. Partly because there are usually additional factors - either a specifically heavy snowfall, or this year people travelling in advance of an upcoming rail strike. And partly because more people live in the South East than in any other specific British region so there are going to be more people affected by snowfall in a particular region which means you hear the consequences of that more loudly.

 

[gswindale]

As I said, it was unexpected but not a surprise to this "Southerner".

Think about it - a snowdrift in North Yorkshire affects half a dozen people and 50 sheep - probably makes it onto the National Baa Baa News Network, but is not much more than local news for humanity. Most of those people will be farmers with vehicles designed for dealing with all sorts of weather conditions including (hopefully) snow.

There is very little point designing things like the Underground network to have a full fleet of trains with built-in snow ploughs to be used on 2 days of the year just in case.

It gets mentioned in the media because it is impacting a large element of the population (I believe London has roughly 1/6 of the English population and nearly double that of Yorkshire in it's entirety?)

 

[Acey]

Rather insulting, don't you think?

It's strange that as soon as London hits 0°C and receives half an inch of the white stuff the 'whole county grinds to a halt', while in, for example, November last year when my village in the North of England and much of the surrounding area had was at -10°C with just under five feet of snow, it doesn't even get mentioned - because a) if it doesn't happen in the SE the media don't care, and b) we just sucked it up and got on with it; no point in nancying around or whinging to the press.

It's winter. It's cold and it will snow. Why is that such a surprise to Southerners, every single year?

Give it a break .please ,I get so fed up with this rubbish put out by the tough Northerners who like to think they are impervious to all that nature can throw at them ,if it makes you feel happy and superior keep it up ! Also consider
The local authority with the highest traffic level in 2021 is Essex with 8.513 billion vehicle miles. Essex is followed by Hampshire (8.497 billion vehicle miles) and Kent (8.385 billion vehicle miles).


Of the five local authorities with the highest levels of traffic, three are in the South East region (Hampshire, Kent, Surrey) and two were in the East of England region (Essex, Hertfordshire). These are all authorities with relatively large road networks, and they all contain some of the major motorways of Great Britain.
Obviously more mileage of roads to grit and clear with fewer resources and more vehicles in the way

 

[AM9]

Rather insulting, don't you think?

It's strange that as soon as London hits 0°C and receives half an inch of the white stuff the 'whole county grinds to a halt', while in, for example, November last year when my village in the North of England and much of the surrounding area had was at -10°C with just under five feet of snow, it doesn't even get mentioned - because a) if it doesn't happen in the SE the media don't care, and b) we just sucked it up and got on with it; no point in nancying around or whinging to the press.

It's winter. It's cold and it will snow. Why is that such a surprise to Southerners, every single year?

Precisely that, London (or even the home counties) haven't had 5 feet of snow for decades (1963 in my memory) so roads, their maintenance support, emergency vehicles etc., aren't equipped for dealing with that and barely capable of handling 5 inches of snow. Of course, suitable investment of snow clearance equipment, dedicated space to dump snow, (there aren't that many fields next to the busiest roads for snow blowers to spray the stuff on), and far more gritting capability could all be paid for, but most of that expensive equipment would only come out of it's dedicated storage space once per year to be re-MoTed and serviced resulting a chorus of whinges from the population about wasted council tax etc..
As an example, when I was in Tromsø, there was six inches of snow 3 times per day. Within 10 minutes of each shower stopping, there were excavators and trucks on the streets which cleared it within 20 minutes, - most of it being dumped into the harbour. Impressive, but only necessary there.

As far as the disruption resulting from snow, well the M25 is busier than any motorway in the north and probably has more traffic passing under any of its bridges in 10 minutes than your village in the "North of England" does in a week!

 

[GS250]

This happens ever year when we get a period of snowfall. Stories of schools closed and people trapped in their cars / trains for hours. The word "Chaos" dominates the headlines. Then the mild weather returns and its all forgotten about until next year.

Great display of inappropriate driving, mainly by those with larger BMW's and Mercedes. Saw quite a few prangs on the way to work. These types seem to think that the enhanced tech will save them in icy conditions. No amount of ABS, traction control etc will stop a car that's slipping on ice and out of control.

 

[Thirteen]

I'm surprised that the mostly above ground District Line only experienced minor delays whereas the Northern Line had to be part suspended.

London Overground being affected badly isn't too surprising.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

This is hilarious. One inch of snow and the SE grinds to a halt; cars are abandoned, people are 'snowed in', it's described as 'treacherous'. . . You can tell what their winters are usually like!

About 20 or so years ago, Kent county Council famously called out the Army to help after something like 5mm of snow... Can't remember which year exactly that was now...

 

[DelayRepay]

Without wanting to add fuel to the North vs South debate...

When I lived in Yorkshire, we'd get a few periods of snow most winters, and ice on the roads was common. In fact I took my driving test when it was snowing. I've now moved to the South and snow and ice are much less common here (every time there's ice, someone posts a warning on our local Facebook page - that wouldn't happen in the North!)

I think the difference is in the North people are used to driving in snow and ice, and are able to make sensible judgements about when it's better not to use the car. Whereas in the South people are just not as used to it. This extends to knowing when it's better to go the 'long way round' to keep to main/gritted roads and avoid hills as far as possible. I'm happy driving in the snow and ice but I will take a longer route if I think it's going to give an easier journey.

 

[D6130]

London (or even the home counties) haven't had 5 feet of snow for decades (1963 in my memory)

While I agree with the general tenet of your post, the winter of 1986/87 - my last winter as a guard at Brighton - was pretty fierce in the South-East, with deep snow lasting for a couple of weeks. We had lots of cancellations and delays and I recall helping to make and light a bonfire under the frozen fuel tank (! *) of a class 56 in Hove Yard, so that we could fire it up to haul stranded EMUs back to Lovers Walk depot for repairs. Was that the year that they sent the Bielhack snow blower down from Inverness to clear blocked lines in Kent?

* Can you imagine what Elf & Safety would say about that sort of thing nowadays?

 

[DC1989]

If the north are so great at dealing with snow why is there always news articles about cars getting stranded on the M6 overnight and drivers getting stranded in scotland etc

Maybe it's the southerners who drove up

 

[duncanp]

About 20 or so years ago, Kent county Council famously called out the Army to help after something like 5mm of snow... Can't remember which year exactly that was now...

And the dry ski slope in Gillingham was closed because of, er, snow.

Ski slope being closed because of snow on it.

You couldn't make it up.

 

[gswindale]

And the dry ski slope in Gillingham was closed because of, er, snow.

Ski slope being closed because of snow on it.

You couldn't make it up.

your point being?

That's like the val d'isere being closed in the summer due to no snow isn't it? The whole point of a dry ski slope is that it is for when there is no snow. I really wouldn't expect to use a dry ski slope if there was snow on it.

 

[WelshBluebird]

And the dry ski slope in Gillingham was closed because of, er, snow.

Well yes. Dry ski slopes aren't supposed to have snow on them - they aren't built for that and the way they are used isn't meant for it.

 

[Magdalia]

It's winter. It's cold and it will snow. Why is that such a surprise to Southerners, every single year?

No it doesn't snow every year. The snowfall here last night was the first since February 2018. Snowfall in the south east and east of England is a rare event.

And snow here last night was a surprise, the weather forecast said snow showers for the Essex and Suffolk coast, but snow very unlikely further inland.

While I agree with the general tenet of your post, the winter of 1986/87 - my last winter as a guard at Brighton - was pretty fierce in the South-East, with deep snow lasting for a couple of weeks.

1986/87 is very annoying for me. At the time I had a boss who lived in Kent and was snowed in for 2 weeks. Meanwhile, north of the Thames we had no snow, and I was able to get into the office every day. There was no WFH in those days so I got 2 people's work for 2 weeks.

This snowfall does remind me of December 1981, when we also had snowfall on the Sunday of the weekend 2 before Christmas. But the snow was heavier, starting at about dusk, with both rail routes to London and the M11 all quickly blocked by snow. I was in the Fens for the weekend and, having stayed on for Sunday night I got to work at about 1400 on the Monday.