Glasgow bus lane discussion

[InOban]

Bus lanes are not only for buses. Also cycles, taxis and in the future electric scooter.

 

[Spsf3232]

Glasgow City Council don't have a good track record with public transport. Consistently have brilliant ideas and only follow through half way with them.

Going back to the early First days GCC promised priority traffic lights for buses. It never worked.

Then the bus lanes as discussed with no policing which doesn't work. We have bus lanes added in which only moves and creates traffic further back for buses still having to deal with traffic and doesn't improve the suitation.

My biggest pet hate though was the fast link! It was designed to get buses to the hospital as quick as possible but the priority for the fast link was to cars over buses. Joining the fastlink has red lights that you spend a minute waiting at, then again to leave to rejoin main roads. The Squinty bridge has the fast link as the last road to get priority and every single other road gets to go before it. When I drove the route I would only ever enter the fast link when I seen a passenger at the stop ahead, otherwise I would stay on the main road as it was faster. I don't understand why after all that money was spent that buses didn't get priority.

A lot has to be done in Glasgow to make it transport friendly and sadly its getting worse as time goes on especially with new covid measures. You only have to look at the delays first experience now to realise there is a major problem and frankly I would say its more the road layouts and traffic light sequences that cause the delays and pollution over the amount of vehicles

 

[Tom Gallacher]

The existing bud lanes in Maryhill Road see regular parking and no enforcement. So extending these would probably just be more waste of paint.

The one which is crying out for a bus lanes is Byres Road. In fact with more parking restrictions at the the same time. No matter where new bus lanes are placed there nerds to be enforcement. Couldn't say I have seen much.

I think that the only solution to the traffic problems on Byres Rd is to go for a complete no stopping zone (other than buses) between the hours of say 7am and 11pm. Controversial - Yes. Unpopular - Almost certainly. Through time though I believe that it would be accepted as the most practical way of solving this bottleneck. Through traffic would be speeded up considerably and the air quality would be improved exponentially. Enforcement would need to be strict though, by cameras instead of traffic wardens, with absolutely no allowances for vehicles "dropping someone off". It could be possible that by closing off some side roads drop off areas for delivery drivers and disabled people could be constructed to allow for the continued flow of traffic. I know that this can be abused but that's a burden we just might have to bear.

It might of course require certain deliveries to be scheduled out-side of these times but that might be a sacrifice shopkeepers would have to bear. The plus side for them might be that shoppers would need to actually walk past the establishments with the possibility of popping in (it's up to the shop owners to attract them in) to get to their vehicles instead of jumping into them outside and driving away.

To some this might appear to be using a sledgehammer to crack a nut but in this case the nut is so hard that's the only tool that will do the job IMO. A part time bus lane won't address the problem.

 

[Glasgowbusguy]

I think that the only solution to the traffic problems on Byres Rd is to go for a complete no stopping zone (other than buses) between the hours of say 7am and 11pm. Controversial - Yes. Unpopular - Almost certainly. Through time though I believe that it would be accepted as the most practical way of solving this bottleneck. Through traffic would be speeded up considerably and the air quality would be improved exponentially. Enforcement would need to be strict though, by cameras instead of traffic wardens, with absolutely no allowances for vehicles "dropping someone off". It could be possible that by closing off some side roads drop off areas for delivery drivers and disabled people could be constructed to allow for the continued flow of traffic. I know that this can be abused but that's a burden we just might have to bear.

It might of course require certain deliveries to be scheduled out-side of these times but that might be a sacrifice shopkeepers would have to bear. The plus side for them might be that shoppers would need to actually walk past the establishments with the possibility of popping in (it's up to the shop owners to attract them in) to get to their vehicles instead of jumping into them outside and driving away.

To some this might appear to be using a sledgehammer to crack a nut but in this case the nut is so hard that's the only tool that will do the job IMO. A part time bus lane won't address the problem.

Having worked on byres rd for 10 years a no stopping zone is not the solution as it creates issues with deliveries for the shops on byres road.

The best fix is to actually Sort out the side roads off byres rd and remove the majority of the 1 ways , no entries etc

The whole area is such a mess that most sat navs get lost in it

 

[Tom Gallacher]

Having worked on byres rd for 10 years a no stopping zone is not the solution as it creates issues with deliveries for the shops on byres road.

The best fix is to actually Sort out the side roads off byres rd and remove the majority of the 1 ways , no entries etc

The whole area is such a mess that most sat navs get lost in it

So what would you still keep all the parking bays?

 

[col197]

So what would you still keep all the parking bays?

I think it would be disastrous to remove the parking bays. Most of the shops would go out of business. Byres road has the subway for people who want to use public transport.

 

[InOban]

I am sure that almost all the retail spend on Byres Road (or any other busy street ) comes from people who walk there. People in cars are travelling through.

 

[Trnsprt4Sctlnd]

I am sure that almost all the retail spend on Byres Road (or any other busy street ) comes from people who walk there. People in cars are travelling through.

certainly.

 

[adrock1976]

I think that the only solution to the traffic problems on Byres Rd is to go for a complete no stopping zone (other than buses) between the hours of say 7am and 11pm. Controversial - Yes. Unpopular - Almost certainly. Through time though I believe that it would be accepted as the most practical way of solving this bottleneck. Through traffic would be speeded up considerably and the air quality would be improved exponentially. Enforcement would need to be strict though, by cameras instead of traffic wardens, with absolutely no allowances for vehicles "dropping someone off". It could be possible that by closing off some side roads drop off areas for delivery drivers and disabled people could be constructed to allow for the continued flow of traffic. I know that this can be abused but that's a burden we just might have to bear.

It might of course require certain deliveries to be scheduled out-side of these times but that might be a sacrifice shopkeepers would have to bear. The plus side for them might be that shoppers would need to actually walk past the establishments with the possibility of popping in (it's up to the shop owners to attract them in) to get to their vehicles instead of jumping into them outside and driving away.

To some this might appear to be using a sledgehammer to crack a nut but in this case the nut is so hard that's the only tool that will do the job IMO. A part time bus lane won't address the problem.

Having worked on byres rd for 10 years a no stopping zone is not the solution as it creates issues with deliveries for the shops on byres road.

The best fix is to actually Sort out the side roads off byres rd and remove the majority of the 1 ways , no entries etc

The whole area is such a mess that most sat navs get lost in it

When I worked over Byres Road years ago, most of the traffic queues seem to be caused by the traffic lights at the University Avenue/Highburgh Road crossroads where Tennents Bar is.

How the lights are set up is that it only allows one set of traffic to move at a time e.g. Byres Rd northbound, then University Av, then Byres Rd southbound, and then Highburgh Rd, with the pedestrian phase in somewhere. It would be better if it was set to normal e.g Byres Rd north and south, and Uni Av/Highburgh Rd so as the traffic does not back up from Dumbarton Rd to Great Western Rd.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

I think it would be disastrous to remove the parking bays. Most of the shops would go out of business. Byres road has the subway for people who want to use public transport.

So what function would a bus lane provide?

 

[Glasgowbusguy]

Y

So what would you still keep all the parking bays?

Yes having worked there for 10 years every time during that 10 year period when parking charges went up or restrictions where put in place there was a fall in takings and footfall.

As others have said the underground provides a good link on byres rd with Great Western and Dumbarton rd at either end providing bus links

The lights at university avenue are a issue as are the lights at great George Street.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

Y

Yes having worked there for 10 years every time during that 10 year period when parking charges went up or restrictions where put in place there was a fall in takings and footfall.

As others have said the underground provides a good link on byres rd with Great Western and Dumbarton rd at either end providing bus links

The lights at university avenue are a issue as are the lights at great George Street.

Given that you need to provide a safe method of crossing the road for pedestrians there is no realistic alternative to the lights at Great George St as it is the closest junction to the subway. The traffic flows at the junction with Highburgh Rd are fairly similar with more buses transiting east to west than north to south so any prioritising of sequences would probably be swayed towards the route that contains the biggest amount of public transport ie Highburgh Rd. This won't help Byres Rd so it would therefore appear that there is nothing anyone can do to sort the problem.

 

[sannox]

When I worked over Byres Road years ago, most of the traffic queues seem to be caused by the traffic lights at the University Avenue/Highburgh Road crossroads where Tennents Bar is.

How the lights are set up is that it only allows one set of traffic to move at a time e.g. Byres Rd northbound, then University Av, then Byres Rd southbound, and then Highburgh Rd, with the pedestrian phase in somewhere. It would be better if it was set to normal e.g Byres Rd north and south, and Uni Av/Highburgh Rd so as the traffic does not back up from Dumbarton Rd to Great Western Rd.

It was changed due to the amount of right turning traffic which wouldn't be able to turn and blocks up the ahead traffic. The main issue is too much traffic at the junctions hence the queuing - the junctions just can't let more traffic and pedestrians through.

I very much doubt Byres Road retail has much car mode share- most business would be related to existing footfall in the area like Uni and Hospital as well as existing residents.

Shawlands has bus lanes constantly parked in and little is ever done.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

It was changed due to the amount of right turning traffic which wouldn't be able to turn and blocks up the ahead traffic. The main issue is too much traffic at the junctions hence the queuing - the junctions just can't let more traffic and pedestrians through.

I very much doubt Byres Road retail has much car mode share- most business would be related to existing footfall in the area like Uni and Hospital as well as existing residents.

Shawlands has bus lanes constantly parked in and little is ever done.

There's probably the perception that the problem is too much traffic but I think it's more to do with the fact that the traffic is mostly contained in one lane both north and south. Traffic turning left into Highburgh Rd are held up by the number of vehicles that are going straight on as are any vehicles turning left into University Ave.

If you had two lanes available each way for the entire length of Byres Road you could solve the problem easily. As ever just my opinion.

 

[sannox]

There's probably the perception that the problem is too much traffic but I think it's more to do with the fact that the traffic is mostly contained in one lane both north and south. Traffic turning left into Highburgh Rd are held up by the number of vehicles that are going straight on as are any vehicles turning left into University Ave.

If you had two lanes available each way for the entire length of Byres Road you could solve the problem easily. As ever just my opinion.

You'd likely just see traffic growth for using Byres Road and the same queues would manifest themselves with double the road space used.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

You'd likely just see traffic growth for using Byres Road and the same queues would manifest themselves with double the road space used.

You could be right but if more traffic uses Byres Road then that will relieve traffic pressures on the side roads that are currently being used as rat runs so perhaps, if only to alleviate these problems, it might have some benefit. But, as you say, it could all be for nothing in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Glasgowbusguy]

Given that you need to provide a safe method of crossing the road for pedestrians there is no realistic alternative to the lights at Great George St as it is the closest junction to the subway. The traffic flows at the junction with Highburgh Rd are fairly similar with more buses transiting east to west than north to south so any prioritising of sequences would probably be swayed towards the route that contains the biggest amount of public transport ie Highburgh Rd. This won't help Byres Rd so it would therefore appear that there is nothing anyone can do to sort the problem.

Moving the lights down to near Iceland would actually help as the traffic becomes jammed with cars going straight on Byres rd and turning in to and off of Great George Street.

It was changed due to the amount of right turning traffic which wouldn't be able to turn and blocks up the ahead traffic. The main issue is too much traffic at the junctions hence the queuing - the junctions just can't let more traffic and pedestrians through.

I very much doubt Byres Road retail has much car mode share- most business would be related to existing footfall in the area like Uni and Hospital as well as existing residents.

Shawlands has bus lanes constantly parked in and little is ever done.

There actually is a fair proportion of people who actually drive on to Byres Road for shopping. The bigger issues is that any further restrictions on parking will hurt the commercial viability of the businesses on Byres Road especially their ability to retain staff. My former employer has had 28 staff leave or transfer to other shops within the company in the last 5 years due to the difficulties in parking.

 

[col197]

Moving the lights down to near Iceland would actually help as the traffic becomes jammed with cars going straight bon byres rd and turning in to and off of great George Street.


There actually is a fair proportion of people who actually drive on to byres road for shopping , the bigger issues is that any further restrictions on parking will hurt the commercial viability of the businesses on byres road especially there ability to retain staff , my former employer has had 28 staff leave or transfer to other shops within the company in the last 5 years due to the difficulties in parking

Exactly. Some people want bus lanes for the sake of bus lanes.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

Moving the lights down to near Iceland would actually help as the traffic becomes jammed with cars going straight on Byres rd and turning in to and off of Great George Street.


There actually is a fair proportion of people who actually drive on to Byres Road for shopping. The bigger issues is that any further restrictions on parking will hurt the commercial viability of the businesses on Byres Road especially their ability to retain staff. My former employer has had 28 staff leave or transfer to other shops within the company in the last 5 years due to the difficulties in parking.

They could close the junctions with Great George St and Cranworth St as all it does is provide a rat run for drivers wanting to avoid the lights at Highburgh Rd. Put either bus stops or disabled/loading bays at the ends of these streets. FWIW I would also consider doing this with all the junctions other than that at Highburgh Rd/University Ave.

In respect of staff parking I very much doubt that any staff will be using the on street parking as you are not allowed to park there for any length of time. Perhaps a multi storey car park behind Ashton Lane would provide the necessary parking for both shoppers and staff but I can't see that getting planning approval.

In the case of a bus lane I don't think that would be of any use either, certainly not when you only have two bus services that use this road and they are half hourly.

 

[EMU303]

Work is due to start on Byres Road soon and it will see a reduction in on street parking and wider pavements and cycle lanes.
This link isn’t the final plan which I cannot locate but gives a flavour of the plan

https://www.glasgowconsult.co.uk/UploadedFiles/Byres%20Road%20-%20Exhibition%20Panels.pdf

 

[InOban]

It will be interesting to see the effect that the Greens have, now that they have joined the snp to run the Council.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

Work is due to start on Byres Road soon and it will see a reduction in on street parking and wider pavements and cycle lanes.
This link isn’t the final plan which I cannot locate but gives a flavour of the plan

https://www.glasgowconsult.co.uk/UploadedFiles/Byres%20Road%20-%20Exhibition%20Panels.pdf

Thanks for posting this. Looks like it's going to be pretty much a kind of clearway then as far as I can make it out.

 

[Glasgowbusguy]

Work is due to start on Byres Road soon and it will see a reduction in on street parking and wider pavements and cycle lanes.
This link isn’t the final plan which I cannot locate but gives a flavour of the plan

https://www.glasgowconsult.co.uk/UploadedFiles/Byres%20Road%20-%20Exhibition%20Panels.pdf

Honestly considering the hostility of the locals to any change that reduces parking this will be lucky to get the go ahead .

They recently took some changes in great George Street all the way to the court of session and won