I don't think there's any confusion as to who owns the TfC brand. It's the council. The confusion is using it on a GCB commercial service.
I guess they get paid whether people use them or not on the subsidised services so it doesn’t matter too much to them if they get passengers. A commercial service is a whole different game
Do we have a definite answer for who takes the revenue risk for the TfC contract? I know its it's been discussed on here, but without conclusion.
Based on knowledge of services, PVR, rough running costs and the subsidy amount, I would estimate there is at least an £8m Running cost shortfall per year to pcb. But that is if they solely received funding from The council. There will be other income from fares, fuel rebates, VAT, bus operator grants. It also doesn’t include unforeseen expenditure such as accident damage, breakdowns and recovery costs amongst other unforeseen expenses.
So I think you're implying there that it's a net cost contract, ie the operator taking the revenue risk on the basis that fares revenue is required to make up the shortfall between awarded contract price and operating costs.
As I said my sums Don’t include funding sources away from the council. BSOG for example and passenger fares. The sums aren’t an exact science.
I remember someone saying there was a half way break which will be 4 years.
Are we sure GoAhead are renting houses? I know that when Stagecoach do loans, they often use hotels/serviced apartments and they can manage to get some bulk discount since they rent out so many of these places.
100% renting houses on 6 month agreement.
Ahh, fair enough.
I wonder why GCB considered Praa Sands to Penzance to have escaped FK's notice as a worthwhile route to operate profitably. My shop neighbour in Penzance who lives in Goldsithney had to come in to Pz today on the U4 as his van had broken down and told me that his conversation with the driver of the empty bus that brought him in went along these lines:=GoCornwall Bus are introducing a commercial service (sorry if mentioned, Ive never been to Cornwall so not sure)
Going Commercial
In what has to be said is a low key announcement hidden within their web site Go South West are about to launce their first commercial servi...www.plymothiantransit.com
)so his remark wasn't aimed at me in any way.I wonder why GCB considered Praa Sands to Penzance to have escaped FK's notice as a worthwhile route to operate profitably. My shop neighbour in Penzance who lives in Goldsithney had to come in to Pz today on the U4 as his van had broken down and told me that his conversation with the driver of the empty bus that brought him in went along these lines:=
Les - 'you look empty today'
Driver - 'it.s always like this now, some days I only get ten passengers a shift'
Now Les has no idea in my interest in buses (I keep my life compartmentalised to an extent
As has been said on many occasions on this thread, it was not tendered as one contract, but as multiple lots. It's GoAhead that decided to offer a bulk discount to operate everything.
Something that I suspect FK were not naive enough to do.
Something that I suspect FK were not naive enough to do.
It’s been confirmed from the top of FK, they didn’t bid for anything outside of their existing operating area.
If it isn’t worth the extra few minutes to run the U4 through Praa sands Without the council funding it, I think that tells us all we need to know About Praa sands as a commercial service from an operator who knows the territory and numbers!
Ahh, I haven't seen that before so thank you for bringing it to my attention.
Praa Sands and Perranuthnoe have both been served by a minority of buses either working off the through route or as a separate service over the years but they never come to anything with the possible exception of during the summer holidays. A few ENCTS pass holders will probably comprise almost all of the regular travellers on such services. There are also problems with congestion on narrow roads and, in the past at least, with terminal arrangements.
I thought that it had been said that Go Ahead's bid was more expensive but won on quality in some way?
Correct.
Yea, that has been said, but that's got nothing to do with the fact the tenders were offered in several different lots (batches of routes).
Yes I know that. However you said that Go Ahead offered a bulk discount to cover all the tenders and others have said that Go Ahead was more expensive but won on quality. I cant see how both can be true!
Because they scored highly on “quality” scoring. The overall price was more expensive than other bids, but cheaper than they bid for each route separately
That is indeed a correct explanation for when the winner is more expensive.
There collective bid was still more expensive,
That's right. I was agreeing with you.
