Go South Coast

[Gloster]

Does anyone know exactly what Go-Ahead plan to do on the Isle of Wight with the BSIP funds?

They already have pretty good service levels there - is it mainly for increases in frequency on some of the minor cross-island routes? Assume also enhancements to the local town services.

With the electric buses on order presumably these enhancements will soak up any cascaded stock.

Cheaper fares: £1 flat fare for under-21s and £1.50 for some short town service fares.
Bus priority at (some) junctions.
CCTV, better lighting and hardstanding at some stops.
Hubs for e-bikes and e-scooters to complete journeys.

We shall see…

 

[Mollman]

Does anyone know exactly what Go-Ahead plan to do on the Isle of Wight with the BSIP funds?

They already have pretty good service levels there - is it mainly for increases in frequency on some of the minor cross-island routes? Assume also enhancements to the local town services.

With the electric buses on order presumably these enhancements will soak up any cascaded stock.

Being pedantic but it is the Isle of Wight Council which chooses what to do with BSIP funding rather than Go-Ahead. They may see gap in the network which is not commercial but socially (or politically) necessary to fill.

 

[WibbleWobble]

Being pedantic but it is the Isle of Wight Council which chooses what to do with BSIP funding rather than Go-Ahead. They may see gap in the network which is not commercial but socially (or politically) necessary to fill.

Not necessarily - operators are often invited submit proposals to the local authority on how to spend BSIP funding. The authority can then opt to choose which proposals to fund. Sometimes they have to whittle them down as there are too many, sometimes there's not enough suitable ideas so another round of proposal submissions may be requested.

 

[Surreyman]

Copied and pasted-

https://transport.southampton.gov.uk/media/3443/20241022-website-notes-of-meeting-hampshire-southampton-ep-board.pdf

Next spring ten new buses will be delivered for the Barton Peveril routes. 98 seat tri-axle Evo Seti buses are being purchased.

 

[Beemax]

Copied and pasted-

https://transport.southampton.gov.uk/media/3443/20241022-website-notes-of-meeting-hampshire-southampton-ep-board.pdf

Next spring ten new buses will be delivered for the Barton Peveril routes. 98 seat tri-axle Evo Seti buses are being purchased.

Thanks for this. 'Next spring' presumably means this spring as the meeting took place in October.

 

[sam445]

Thanks for this. 'Next spring' presumably means this spring as the meeting took place in October.

Interesting that go south coast are really keen on updating bluestar fleet morebus have open tops buses over 20 years old now

 

[Megafuss]

Interesting that go south coast are really keen on updating bluestar fleet morebus have open tops buses over 20 years old now

AFAIK, there are no current new bus types on the market with a removable roof. Only partial, like the Volvo B5TL Geminis' that Stagecoach Cumbria uses.

The vehicles tend to do Brock College outside the summer. So a covered top deck is a must

 

[Andyh82]

Interesting that go south coast are really keen on updating bluestar fleet morebus have open tops buses over 20 years old now

I presume you missed the masses of new deckers that morebus received last year?

 

[sam445]

So did bluestar I'm on about updating the open tops buses

 

[Surreyman]

So did bluestar I'm on about updating the open tops buses

I guess its a combination of engineering longevity (+ easy availability of spares) and accountants liking fully depreciated vehicles mostly used on low mileage school/college runs for half the year.
If it's true that no bodybuilder is currently marketing new convertibles, they could always chop the roofs off some of the oldest (62 reg) E400s when they are displaced by electrics, they would of course be parked-up for 6 months of the year (I guess that already applies to the 3 Isle of Wight Scanias and the 2 ex yellow bus B7TLs).

 

[aswilliamsuk]

Thanks for this. 'Next spring' presumably means this spring as the meeting took place in October.

There are also more ADLs (Enviro 200 MMC and Enviro 400 MMC) imminent for Bluestar, according to reliable sources on Facebook groups (at least one photo from Alexander-Dennis (ADL) showed an ADL E400 MMC in the right shade of blue), which will see more cascades across the group.

 

[Towers]

Interesting that go south coast are really keen on updating bluestar fleet morebus have open tops buses over 20 years old now

Bluestar run a pretty elderly fleet overall, plenty of ancient Scania deckers. Aside from the same 2008 Omnicitys that More run, Bluestar also have the ex-London DOEs on 58 plates, plus the handful of big East Lancs deckers which are 54/56 platers. Some further investment in rolling stock is certainly due, there can’t be many ‘big group’ fleets running at that sort of age profile now?

The More open toppers seem to soldier on tirelessly, the eldest (55 plate?) really were looking increasingly tatty last season though, so some money needs spending if they’re staying much longer!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Bluestar run a pretty elderly fleet overall, plenty of ancient Scania deckers. Aside from the same 2008 Omnicitys that More run, Bluestar also have the ex-London DOEs on 58 plates, plus the handful of big ex-Brighton & Hove deckers which are 56 platers. Some further investment in rolling stock is certainly due!

That said, they probably had to keep some fleet longer than anticipated owing to the increased PVR after the collapse of Yellow Buses and the exit of First from Southampton.

 

[Towers]

That said, they probably had to keep some fleet longer than anticipated owing to the increased PVR after the collapse of Yellow Buses and the exit of First from Southampton.

That’s true, both operations were of course running whatever they could get their hands on for quite a while!

I’ve edited my post to remove the reference to “ex-Brighton & Hove” regarding the big 54/56 plate Scanias - I always assumed they were, but Google suggests I might have made that up!

 

[Surreyman]

There is ongoing pressure in Southampton for an all Euro 6 compliant fleet, Bluestar are nearly there, the ex WM & new ADL & EvoCity deliveries will see even the 'out of area' college contracts as Euro 6, the 11 'DOEs' and the 12 Southampton based N230s were of course upgraded sometime ago.

 

[buslad1988]

Bluestar run a pretty elderly fleet overall, plenty of ancient Scania deckers. Aside from the same 2008 Omnicitys that More run, Bluestar also have the ex-London DOEs on 58 plates, plus the handful of big East Lancs deckers which are 54/56 platers. Some further investment in rolling stock is certainly due, there can’t be many ‘big group’ fleets running at that sort of age profile now?

Have you not seen the Go East Anglia fleet?! Hedingham/Chambers in particular is shockingly elderly. Wouldn’t be surprised if some of the oldest Blue Star stock ends up being cascaded to there.

 

[Gloster]

I guess its a combination of engineering longevity (+ easy availability of spares) and accountants liking fully depreciated vehicles mostly used on low mileage school/college runs for half the year.
If it's true that no bodybuilder is currently marketing new convertibles, they could always chop the roofs off some of the oldest (62 reg) E400s when they are displaced by electrics, they would of course be parked-up for 6 months of the year (I guess that already applies to the 3 Isle of Wight Scanias and the 2 ex yellow bus B7TLs).

I think that the open-toppers, at least the ones on which the door between the small cabin at front and the main open area can be locked, are sometimes used on odd fill-in turns, particularly the quieter (*) school runs. There also a few out of season open-top trips, such as the Christmas Lights.

* - Quieter in the sense of fewer passengers: they are school runs so there is no lack of noise.

 

[Towers]

Have you not seen the Go East Anglia fleet?! Hedingham/Chambers in particular is shockingly elderly. Wouldn’t be surprised if some of the oldest Blue Star stock ends up being cascaded to there.

Sounds splendid!

 

[WibbleWobble]

The Barton Peveril contract has just been awarded, and I believe one of the requirements was for younger vehicles. The west-Fareham area produces massive flows to the college, hence the need for bigger buses.

As for the seasonal routes, there is the aforementioned issue of nobody doing convertible double decks. At present, the reduction in university vehicle requirement in the summer helps cover the need for additional open tops by filling in the gaps left by the convertibles going topless (the Mylenniums originally doing both back in the day - Uni over the winter and open top in the summer). This removes the need for having a fleet of open-top buses that is just used for a third of the year.

 

[Andyh82]

The Barton Peveril contract has just been awarded, and I believe one of the requirements was for younger vehicles. The west-Fareham area produces massive flows to the college, hence the need for bigger buses.

As for the seasonal routes, there is the aforementioned issue of nobody doing convertible double decks. At present, the reduction in university vehicle requirement in the summer helps cover the need for additional open tops by filling in the gaps left by the convertibles going topless (the Mylenniums originally doing both back in the day - Uni over the winter and open top in the summer). This removes the need for having a fleet of open-top buses that is just used for a third of the year.

The Breezer 60 I expect doesn’t carry as many passengers as the 50 so won’t justify new buses

The New Forest Tour has a very short season, I think it’s basically just two months, so again wouldn’t justify new buses or a fleet that can’t be converted to close top

 

[sam445]

The Breezer 60 I expect doesn’t carry as many passengers as the 50 so won’t justify new buses

The New Forest Tour has a very short season, I think it’s basically just two months, so again wouldn’t justify new buses or a fleet that can’t be converted to close top

But when the buses are 20 years now and keep breaking down they should be replaced with newer stuff

 

[Park47515]

AFAIK, there are no current new bus types on the market with a removable roof. Only partial, like the Volvo B5TL Geminis' that Stagecoach Cumbria uses.

The vehicles tend to do Brock College outside the summer. So a covered top deck is a must

I would have thought that *if* the order was big enough, Wrightbus could look at offering a convertible, but it's going to be about scale, and is the pvr big enough for that

 

[OptareOlympus]

I would have thought that *if* the order was big enough, Wrightbus could look at offering a convertible, but it's going to be about scale, and is the pvr big enough for that

Wightbus are no good. The Streetdeck was unsuitable for the Sandbanks Ferry. As far as the New Forest Tours go, replacing them is complicated by Empress Bridge in Lymington which requires lowheight vehicles.

MCV can still supply convertible Evoseti bodies but Volvo no longer offer the twin axle B5TL chassis to mount them on. The Volvo B8L is not an option as being tri axle, it is prohibited from using the Sandbanks Ferry.

 

[Andyh82]

When I travelled on the 60 from Sandbanks to Poole last summer it did feel like a blast from the past. I can’t recall the last time I’d been on an open top bus that was both fully open and only had the metal bars and plastic sheeting over the front and back.

Normally these days open tops are either only partial, or if fully open have more substantial regular bodywork at the front and back

 

[Towers]

When I travelled on the 60 from Sandbanks to Poole last summer it did feel like a blast from the past. I can’t recall the last time I’d been on an open top bus that was both fully open and only had the metal bars and plastic sheeting over the front and back.

Normally these days open tops are either only partial, or if fully open have more substantial regular bodywork at the front and back

It’s an enjoyable experience, isn’t it!

 

[Trainman40083]

It’s an enjoyable experience, isn’t it!

Last time I went, it was a Northern Counties DAF, M or N prefix?

 

[Towers]

Last time I went, it was a Northern Counties DAF, M or N prefix?

Blimey! It’ll be an East Lancs Volvo on about a 54 or 05 plate these days if they turn out their oldest hardware. 59 plate Opatare Olympus/Scanias also feature, along with the newest 66 reg Volvo/EvoSetis on the 40 & 50 runs.

 

[Towers]

25 plate E400s have seemingly arrived at Empress Road, duly branded as “The One”. Any ideas on numbers or planned cascades etc?

 

[aswilliamsuk]

25 plate E400s have seemingly arrived at Empress Road, duly branded as “The One”. Any ideas on numbers or planned cascades etc?

There are 18 in total, it seems - 1792 to More, 1793/94 for the X8, apparently (Not sure what livery), 1795-1808 to Bluestar for the 1 and 9, and then 1809 for Salisbury (and has already arrived in red and black).

There are also Enviro 200 MMCs coming - eight for Bluestar as far as I'm aware. Not sure if there are any for anyone else.

As for cascades, 1638-47 have begun moving to Salisbury (although will presumably be repainted first), and would I presume oust the OmniCities. There should also be some older Enviro 200 MMCs moving to Swindon to start replacement of the Scania/Wright single decks.

 

[Towers]

There are 18 in total, it seems - 1792 to More, 1793/94 for the X8, apparently (Not sure what livery), 1795-1808 to Bluestar for the 1 and 9, and then 1809 for Salisbury (and has already arrived in red and black).

There are also Enviro 200 MMCs coming - eight for Bluestar as far as I'm aware. Not sure if there are any for anyone else.

As for cascades, 1638-47 have begun moving to Salisbury (although will presumably be repainted first), and would I presume oust the OmniCities. There should also be some older Enviro 200 MMCs moving to Swindon to start replacement of the Scania/Wright single decks.

Ah, thanks! Any ideas what the E200s are expected to replace?