GWR Class 800

[coppercapped]

On GWR you’ll then need to factor in loss of performance when running on diesel.

I'm not sure what this is intended to imply.

On those sections where diesel power was always to be used - that is on those lines off the end of the electrified network - the line speed limits are such that the trains will not be able to reach 125mile/h anyway, so there will be no loss of performance when compared to an HST. In fact, with the increase in the number of powered axles and the inherent slip-resistance of variable voltage, variable frequency 3 phase drives coupled with the lack of low speed 'grunt' in HSTs the potential exists to improve the timings.

The performance will only be compromised compared to that planned on the sections that are not due to be wired in the immediate future - that is Wootton Bassett / Chippenham to Bristol via Bath and Bristol Parkway to Temple Meads via Filton Bank and the extension from Cardiff to Swansea. Only some of the first route is passed for 125mile/h and none of the latter two routes. There may be some loss in time compared to an HST when hill-climbing, which will however only affect the Up trains, but this will have to be seen in practice.

In the short term - until the Didcot to Cardiff section is energised - there will be no improvement in timings. But history shows that this is not unusual when new traction is introduced - time is given for staff and operations to become used to the new equipment and sufficient is available to enable changes to be made to the whole timetable for that route. In addition timings are such that an HST could be substituted without an effect on performance.

The issue with the Class 80X is not its technical capability but the very expensive way the DfT executed the Intercity Express Programme.

 

[highspeed990]

Does anyone know when the class 800s will be in service

 

[JamesT]

Does anyone know when the class 800s will be in service

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/gwr-super-express-train-initial-diagrams.153431/ is your friend...

 

[highspeed990]

thanks

 

[50031]

That plus the seat handles, although it looks as though this is only inflicted on Standard class, as First looks to have a Brown Strip with White handles, as for what the Standard Class seats are like remains to be seen they don't look comfortable and the seat fabric looks cheap.

Lets see some GWR green headrest covers added to all seats or a new version of the HST antimacassers

 

[DidcotDickie]

Class 800s now signed off by ORR for passenger use?

https://twitter.com/IanProsser7/status/918228681293811713

I know it doesn't explicitly say that but that's what I infer.

 

[Olaf]

They're not going to recall all the 80x in the Country are they? The impact doesn't bear thinking about if so.

My understanding was that the initial assessment was that the sets were still safe for the imminent introduction, but more recent reports are suggesting that there may be issues with the material that has gone into wheel-sets which is potentially more serious.

 

[jimm]

My understanding was that the initial assessment was that the sets were still safe for the imminent introduction, but more recent reports are suggesting that there may be issues with the material that has gone into wheel-sets which is potentially more serious.

I'm sure the ORR will have been alerted by Hitachi to any potential issues.

In any case, the pre-series IEP sets have been running many miles on trials under all sorts of conditions and speeds for the past couple of years, which might be expected to have shown up potential problems at some stage.

Of course, test running can never truly replicate the effects of daily operation, but I haven't seen any suggestion so far that IEPs or any of the bullet trains supplied to Japanese railways have given cause for concern - I would have thought 300kmh+ running on Shinkansen routes would have found out flaws at an early stage.

 

[dp21]

Class 800s now signed off by ORR for passenger use?

https://twitter.com/IanProsser7/status/918228681293811713

I know it doesn't explicitly say that but that's what I infer.

This certainly means they've been approved for use by the regulator however I don't know if they've passed the Network Rail approvals yet?

 

[gsnedders]

The performance will only be compromised compared to that planned on the sections that are not due to be wired in the immediate future - that is Wootton Bassett / Chippenham to Bristol via Bath and Bristol Parkway to Temple Meads via Filton Bank and the extension from Cardiff to Swansea. Only some of the first route is passed for 125mile/h and none of the latter two routes. There may be some loss in time compared to an HST when hill-climbing, which will however only affect the Up trains, but this will have to be seen in practice.

On the down trains, most trains will be heading onto the non-wired section from Wootton Bassett at 125mph will they not? Hence in that direction is primarily becomes a question of whether they can maintain that speed on diesel.

 

[D1009]

W

On the down trains, most trains will be heading onto the non-wired section from Wootton Bassett at 125mph will they not? Hence in that direction is primarily becomes a question of whether they can maintain that speed on diesel.

(yawn) Wootton Bassett to Thingley Junction is going to be wired, in fact many of the masts are already up.

 

[Master29]

I can see a problem with the lack of wheelchair space in the 5 car units. Yes, I know they will get a free first class upgrade but that`ll be where problems start surely. On this basis anyone travelling who has a disabled railcard can get a free upgrade. Discrimination surely. Only wheelchair users can do this is not an answer. I wonder if GWR are setting themselves up here.

 

[aar0]

I have a vague idea of making an article for my university's newspaper about the train, do you think DfT/GWR/NR/Hitachi would be willing to let me on one next time it's in Swansea?

The ball would be entirely in the court of Hitachi - as has been said many times GWR have nothing to do with these units at the present time. Contact them by all means, but I wouldn't hold your hopes up - I believe the most recent visits to Maliphant are purely to commission the new Depot, testing is being done elsewhere and thus I'd suspect visits to be few and far between.

Emailed GWR, their response was nearly a whole sentence long - No.

I'll try and see one of the first into Swansea; I do have a photographer to come with me too.

 

[JN114]

I can see a problem with the lack of wheelchair space in the 5 car units. Yes, I know they will get a free first class upgrade but that`ll be where problems start surely. On this basis anyone travelling who has a disabled railcard can get a free upgrade. Discrimination surely. Only wheelchair users can do this is not an answer. I wonder if GWR are setting themselves up here.

GWR aren’t setting themselves up for anything. For the umpteenth time the Interior specification is per the DfT.

Any concerns you have regarding the provision of standard class wheelchair accommodation should be addressed to:

The Rt Hon C Grayling MP
Department for Transport
Great Minster House
33 Horseferry Road
London
SW1P 4DR

There isn’t anything GWR can do about it. They are obliged to carry wheelchairs; they can only carry wheelchairs in 1st Class. Any “discrimination” claim (which incidentally I don’t think this is) goes down to the Civil Servants that specified no wheelchair space in standard.

 

[JN114]

Emailed GWR, their response was nearly a whole sentence long - No.

I'll try and see one of the first into Swansea; I do have a photographer to come with me too.

Sorry to hear you were unsuccessful, although per my previous message - It’s Hitachi you need to be speaking to for access to Maliphant Depot, not GWR.

 

[Master29]

GWR aren’t setting themselves up for anything. For the umpteenth time the Interior specification is per the DfT.

Any concerns you have regarding the provision of standard class wheelchair accommodation should be addressed to:

The Rt Hon C Grayling MP
Department for Transport
Great Minster House
33 Horseferry Road
London
SW1P 4DR

There isn’t anything GWR can do about it. They are obliged to carry wheelchairs; they can only carry wheelchairs in 1st Class. Any “discrimination” claim (which incidentally I don’t think this is) goes down to the Civil Servants that specified no wheelchair space in standard.

OK it isn`t GWR`s fault but this still answers nothing.

 

[Olaf]

I'm sure the ORR will have been alerted by Hitachi to any potential issues.

Unlikely, because this is a developing story - the range of customers affected was still growing and the investigation is not yet complete.

 

[Olaf]

Of course, test running can never truly replicate the effects of daily operation, but I haven't seen any suggestion so far that IEPs or any of the bullet trains supplied to Japanese railways have given cause for concern - I would have thought 300kmh+ running on Shinkansen routes would have found out flaws at an early stage.

Bullet trains were reported as affected by the issue earlier on the day I posted the above.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I am currently on the 07.00 from Paddington and the interior is very good. Full report later. It's 008 and 009 by the way.

 

[Pete_uk]

Wow, they are here...

 

[XCTurbostar]

I am currently on the 07.00 from Paddington and the interior is very good. Full report later. It's 008 and 009 by the way.

Nothing like a good under floor engine thud to wake the commuters up in the morning.

 

[1179_Clee2]

Nothing like a good under floor engine thud to wake the commuters up in the morning.

If people don't like underfloor engines then sit in a coach that does not have one. A 10 car 800 only has 6 coaches with engines !!!

 

[jimm]

OK it isn`t GWR`s fault but this still answers nothing.

As opposed to you raising what looks like a rather spurious 'concern'.

Wheelchair spaces are provided for people who need to use wheelchairs... many people with a Disabled Person's Railcard do not use wheelchairs and can perfectly happily sit in standard class (or first if they have bought a first class ticket).

Bullet trains were reported as affected by the issue earlier on the day I posted the above.

"Affected" in what way? In the same way as 800s and 802s, in that some of the material used may potentially have come from dubious batches of metal? Are there lots of bullet trains currently parked in sidings with fractured wheels or something?

Unlikely, because this is a developing story - the range of customers affected was still growing and the investigation is not yet complete.

It's not usually a good idea to let safety authorities in any industry find out about potential problems through the media... especially when you know they are on the brink of signing off your product for use by the public.

 

[dk1]

If people don't like underfloor engines then sit in a coach that does not have one. A 10 car 800 only has 6 coaches with engines !!!

Exactly. Plenty of choice & to be fair, I'd probably choose the powered option

 

[Oxfordblues]

Oh dear, 1A03 appears have encountered further delay at Taplow. 42 late at Slough. This is after a 25min late start from Temple Meads.

 

[XCTurbostar]

Looks like it went well.. Bet those commuters are thrilled.

 

[class387]

Looks like it went well.. Bet those commuters are thrilled.

And the next one's cancelled apparently.

 

[Quark999]

Plus the videos of seats roped off because the air con was leaking. They were floods - probably the first time anyone bothered testing the train with “super crush load” and the AC is going nuts because of all the extra warm bodies.

Going swimmingly, quite literally.

 

[341o2]

Oh dear, 1A03 appears have encountered further delay at Taplow. 42 late at Slough. This is after a 25min late start from Temple Meads.

and running by diesel

 

[AlterEgo]

Plus the videos of seats roped off because the air con was leaking. They were floods - probably the first time anyone bothered testing the train with “super crush load” and the AC is going nuts because of all the extra warm bodies.

Going swimmingly, quite literally.

Nothing to do with a crush load - Coach D at least was locked out of use because of leaking air conditioning from Bristol. The problem was present as the train came off the depot.