GWR Reading Station shift patterns and routes 2021

[Elvina Chhabra]

Hi Everyone

This is for the Train drivers who are based in Reading work at Reading Station for GWR. Please could you advise me on the following:

Shift patterns - days on days off, shift types, day swap (are they allowed) /annual leave (is it a number system or do you have set annualleave given to you)

Routes - number of routes to learn, how long/ far are the routes 30mins , 1hr etc

This will help me out a lot thanks!

 

[tlionhart]

- shift pattern is something like: Weds/thurs off then the following week you’ll have fri-Tues off. Following week Weds/thurs…and so on

- Sunday’s are not part of the week. However you work 2 Sundays and have 2 Sundays off. (One as mentioned above is in the long weekend)

- Shifts are generally long and can be quite intense in work. For instance a day could be:
Reading - Didcot - padd - reading. Then a break. Pass to Twyford to do last 5 Henleys. On the last trip you take the train back empty to Reading and wait for an attachment from Maidenhead to then take to the depot. Finish. A typical day is 8:45 to 9:30hr.

- Rest day work is readily available

- Swaps for perm late or early is possible. Getting a perm early is difficult as it is popular. If you’re new you’ll be in link 4. Meaning you can only swap with drivers in that link. (Must cover same work)
- day swaps are also possible as is a Sunday off whilst someone works it. Or vice versa. There’s a mutual exchange board and you put it on that board and hope for the best. For the swap to work, You have to sign the same stuff

- earlies are generally 0300/04:30.
- lates 01:00 /02:30.
- there are nights. 2 weeks from what I recall?

It’s a huge depot and the work
changes all the time to keep up with.

- annual leave is 32 days a year. You may need to keep 2 days aside for Xmas/boxing day. Fixed leave is 16 days a year which is pre-allocated. You can swap this. The rest is ad hoc leave (use when you want, giving 5 days notice) Say you want the 1st July off. The first 14 drivers are guaranteed. The remaining might be rejected. Places are done on first come-first serve.

- being a new driver whether trainee or qualified you’ll sign:
• Paddington-Didcot (time varies. Mon-fri you do a semi fast. If you did the whole trip with most stops in 1 hit it’s approx 01hr:20mins)
• Reading - Newbury (27 min)
• Windsor branch (5mins)
• Henley branch (12 min)
• Bourne End/Marlow branch (12mins / 8mins. Occasionally you do 3 trips as a rounder. )
• Basingstoke
• Reading TCD
• Reading southern junction (to shunt trains from plat 4/5/6 to High end platforms in the station
• Reading triangle

Traction is: 387/165

When you move into Link 3 add the following:

• Newbury - Bedwyn
• Didcot - Oxford
• Gatwick
traction remains the same. Although 319 coming soon.

When you move to Link 2 you’ll additionally sign 800.

only when you get to link 1/2 you can drop some branches off your route card. Can’t remember which ones, think it’s Marlow and Windsor.

- link progressions are fairly slow. The quickest transition is from link 4 to 3. You’ll be in link 3 for sometime before moving into link 2 and so forth. (It use to be quicker until lots of the vacant lines were taken out)
It wouldn’t surprise me if a link 5 is created…

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

- shift pattern is something like: Weds/thurs off then the following week you’ll have fri-Tues off. Following week Weds/thurs…and so on

- Sunday’s are not part of the week. However you work 2 Sundays and have 2 Sundays off. (One as mentioned above is in the long weekend)

- Shifts are generally long and can be quite intense in work. For instance a day could be:
Reading - Didcot - padd - reading. Then a break. Pass to Twyford to do last 5 Henleys. On the last trip you take the train back empty to Reading and wait for an attachment from Maidenhead to then take to the depot. Finish. A typical day is 8:45 to 9:30hr.

- Rest day work is readily available

- Swaps for perm late or early is possible. Getting a perm early is difficult as it is popular. If you’re new you’ll be in link 4. Meaning you can only swap with drivers in that link. (Must cover same work)
- day swaps are also possible as is a Sunday off whilst someone works it. Or vice versa. There’s a mutual exchange board and you put it on that board and hope for the best. For the swap to work, You have to sign the same stuff

- earlies are generally 0300/04:30.
- lates 01:00 /02:30.
- there are nights. 2 weeks from what I recall?

It’s a huge depot and the work
changes all the time to keep up with.

- annual leave is 32 days a year. You may need to keep 2 days aside for Xmas/boxing day. Fixed leave is 16 days a year which is pre-allocated. You can swap this. The rest is ad hoc leave (use when you want, giving 5 days notice) Say you want the 1st July off. The first 14 drivers are guaranteed. The remaining might be rejected. Places are done on first come-first serve.

- being a new driver whether trainee or qualified you’ll sign:
• Paddington-Didcot (time varies. Mon-fri you do a semi fast. If you did the whole trip with most stops in 1 hit it’s approx 01hr:20mins)
• Reading - Newbury (27 min)
• Windsor branch (5mins)
• Henley branch (12 min)
• Bourne End/Marlow branch (12mins / 8mins. Occasionally you do 3 trips as a rounder. )
• Basingstoke
• Reading TCD
• Reading southern junction (to shunt trains from plat 4/5/6 to High end platforms in the station
• Reading triangle

Traction is: 387/165

When you move into Link 3 add the following:

• Newbury - Bedwyn
• Didcot - Oxford
• Gatwick
traction remains the same. Although 319 coming soon.

When you move to Link 2 you’ll additionally sign 800.

only when you get to link 1/2 you can drop some branches off your route card. Can’t remember which ones, think it’s Marlow and Windsor.

- link progressions are fairly slow. The quickest transition is from link 4 to 3. You’ll be in link 3 for sometime before moving into link 2 and so forth. (It use to be quicker until lots of the vacant lines were taken out)
It wouldn’t surprise me if a link 5 is created…

Oh gosh thank you so much for a detailed answer! If I can be honest with you ...my husband is a qualified train driver for the past 4 years he works for GWR (formerly Hex) and does a single route London Paddington to Heathrow 6 days on 4 days off (usually swaps early for lates) and annual leave is the number system you mentioned above but the pre-allocated 16 day leave doesn't apply their. I currently live in Reading our home is here but I am trying to persuade him to transfer to Reading so he can move back home. But he is thinking it is much harder and a lot more work load in Reading so more chances of making a mistake. But surely there are breaks in between routes the longest he will probably drive non stop would be 1hr 20mins in total how many routes would he need to learn?

 

[tlionhart]

Yes there are breaks in between the longest. After all you can only be driving for 5hrs max.
He can PTR (transfer) to Reading (at 4yrs experience, if there’s a vacancy he’ll be inline with link 3)
If he uses the PTR move, he won’t get another shot. IE if you both decide to relocate to Cornwall, it won’t be permitted.
If you’re near to Reading station, lots of drivers commute from Reading to Paddington. (Mainly for the work loads and type)
This can be an option.
To be honest with you…operational incidents can happen to any type of driving and intensity. Sometimes under-load is a bad thing.

To clarify, when you say move back home, I’m assuming Reading? Doesn’t he commute from Reading or is he living near London?

At the end of the day, if he likes what he’s doing and the commute from Padd to reading isn’t bothering him, Why change things? If the work is boring at HX and he wants variety and doesn’t mind the commute just transfer to the LTV side of stuff.

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

Yes there are breaks in between the longest. After all you can only be driving for 5hrs max.
He can PTR (transfer) to Reading (at 4yrs experience, if there’s a vacancy he’ll be inline with link 3)
If he uses the PTR move, he won’t get another shot. IE if you both decide to relocate to Cornwall, it won’t be permitted.
If you’re near to Reading station, lots of drivers commute from Reading to Paddington. (Mainly for the work loads and type)
This can be an option.
To be honest with you…operational incidents can happen to any type of driving and intensity. Sometimes under-load is a bad thing.

To clarify, when you say move back home, I’m assuming Reading? Doesn’t he commute from Reading or is he living near London?

At the end of the day, if he likes what he’s doing and the commute from Padd to reading isn’t bothering him, Why change things? If the work is boring at HX and he wants variety and doesn’t mind the commute just transfer to the LTV side of stuff.

So basically the issue is I live here in Reading where our home is (comfortable 4 bed forever type of home) I work 2 jobs here and our ext family is close by too so unlikely we ever move. But he rents out a room near PAD because he does the PAD - Heathrow late shifts so 6 days plus any OT he's there then on days off he comes home. We are definitely not far from Reading Station I don't even mind dropping him to the station and picking him up. But his reason for not commuting is that because he does late shifts yeh there won't be an issue me dropping him but coming back he finishes at 12, 1, 2 am in morning and apparently trains stop coming from Paddington to Reading at that point. Then I said why don't you drive but he goes its 1hr 30min driving especially in rush hour he's going to be driving all day there which is intense then drive another 1hr 30mins back home at night which is dangerous if he's extremely tired. So my last option was for him to transfer to Reading GWR but now his reason for not doing that as well is you have to learn more routes and drive for longer periods of time so more chances of mistakes. So now I'm running out of options ....do you happen to know people who do PAD- Heathrow and commute from Reading whilst doing late shifts??

If only there was a way where he can keep his job at Hex but still be able to commute back to Reading or there was an easier job at Reading with the same pay.

 

[tiptoptaff]

There's an argument that HeX is at greater risk of incident due to the habituation of working one route all the time day in day out.

If he PTRs to Reading they won't care if he wants an easier time of it to reduce his incident risk, he'll be told to manage it. Like the rest of us drivers are.

HeX is very unique. No other depot on the GWR network will be the same. If he wants to come "home" to Reading he'll have to accept the route and traction card that comes with it.

 

[Horizon22]

So basically the issue is I live here in Reading where our home is (comfortable 4 bed forever type of home) I work 2 jobs here and our ext family is close by too so unlikely we ever move. But he rents out a room near PAD because he does the PAD - Heathrow late shifts so 6 days plus any OT he's there then on days off he comes home. We are definitely not far from Reading Station I don't even mind dropping him to the station and picking him up. But his reason for not commuting is that because he does late shifts yeh there won't be an issue me dropping him but coming back he finishes at 12, 1, 2 am in morning and apparently trains stop coming from Paddington to Reading at that point. Then I said why don't you drive but he goes its 1hr 30min driving especially in rush hour he's going to be driving all day there which is intense then drive another 1hr 30mins back home at night which is dangerous if he's extremely tired. So my last option was for him to transfer to Reading GWR but now his reason for not doing that as well is you have to learn more routes and drive for longer periods of time so more chances of mistakes. So now I'm running out of options ....do you happen to know people who do PAD- Heathrow and commute from Reading whilst doing late shifts??

If only there was a way where he can keep his job at Hex but still be able to commute back to Reading or there was an easier job at Reading with the same pay.

There are 0134 and 0334 departures from Paddington on a daily basis. Not sure why he couldn't take those?

Reading are also recruiting externally for qualified drivers, so as an internal (ish, HeX is odd) there should be potential to move.

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

There's an argument that HeX is at greater risk of incident due to the habituation of working one route all the time day in day out.

If he PTRs to Reading they won't care if he wants an easier time of it to reduce his incident risk, he'll be told to manage it. Like the rest of us drivers are.

HeX is very unique. No other depot on the GWR network will be the same. If he wants to come "home" to Reading he'll have to accept the route and traction card that comes with it.

Very true which is why he doesn't want to transfer so then that only leaves me with the commute option which again he says because he does late shift and drops the train at the depot in PAD then there are no trains coming back to Reading or very few so if he misses one he'll have to wait an hour for the next.....is working at Reading Station really so much harder than Hex

There are 0134 and 0334 departures from Paddington on a daily basis. Not sure why he couldn't take those?

Reading are also recruiting externally for qualified drivers, so as an internal (ish, HeX is odd) there should be potential to move.

He basically goes that the night trains are very few so if he is delayed dropping the train at the depot in PAD he'll need to wait hour for the next one ....I kind of wish that how in late shifts his work provide him a taxi home to Hayes they could extend that to Reading but apparently its too far and they don't do that

 

[tlionhart]

I wouldn’t say it’s hard, it’s just a lot of work when other depots do less. It gets a lot of work because of where it’s located and the main depot for storing suburban trains is there.

It’s not a bad depot as it offers a large variety of work. In the train driving world there are depots that work much more than Reading.

If he goes on Genius, then onto documents he can look at the diagrams at Reading. Then he can compare them with say Paddington or Oxford.

Can he drive to Paddington?

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

I wouldn’t say it’s hard, it’s just a lot of work when other depots do less. It gets a lot of work because of where it’s located and the main depot for storing suburban trains is there.

It’s not a bad depot as it offers a large variety of work. In the train driving world there are depots that work much more than Reading.

If he goes on Genius, then onto documents he can look at the diagrams at Reading. Then he can compare them with say Paddington or Oxford.

Can he drive to Paddington?

So he can drive and has a car but says driving to Paddington in the afternoon is rush hour so it will take 1hr 30min and then says that driving the train concentrating there is intense then at maybe 1/2am in the morning driving back for 1hr is too much for him he will be too tired to drive so then I offered to drop him at Reading Station in the afternoon but if he could get a train back at night but he goes delays happen so if he misses a train he could be waiting 1/2hrs fr the next train to come at 2am in the morning so commuting turned out to be a no no and then all this time we were waiting for his transfer to happen to Reading and now he said no to that because the work load is more intense for the same pay as in longer drives learning more routes etc so now I'm stuck and running out of options.

So I came on this forum to try and show him that Reading is not harder then PAD Hex but it is longer drives and more routes to learn so he again might say no

Is there no scheme where GWR supply a taxi service to drop you home at night but I guess that's for people who live close by

 

[JN114]

Is there no scheme where GWR supply a taxi service to drop you home at night but I guess that's for people who live close by

There is not, not even for people that live close by - there are some HEx shifts which involve a taxi back to Paddington at the end of the shift, and on occasion traincrew resources will agree to amending that taxi to go to another local West London destination. But that isn’t a scheme, it’s just resources using their discretion - I wouldn’t rely on it being the case.

Back in Heathrow Express days proper, and for the start of GWR’s tenure there was an agreement regarding shuffling taxis as shifts could book on/off at Old Oak, Heathrow or Paddington (basically so drivers weren’t wrong-ended from their transport). But all shifts start/end at Paddington now so that’s gone away.

Your husband is correct - the work at Reading is probably harder and more involved than HEx for the same pay; but by the same token he is responsible for getting himself to/from work. If the latter is making him unhappy or proving difficult then the option is to go with the former. There is no have cake and eat it outcome here.

 

[tlionhart]

As JN114 states, there is no cake and eat it sadly.
As he also states, we are responsible for getting to/from work.

The 1:30hr commute isn’t bad but outweigh that with his workload at HX. I say it balances things out.

If he wants the straight forward commute but doesn’t care about the work, then move to Reading.

 

[JN114]

And sorry I hope I didn’t sound too down-putting.

There are a number of your husband’s colleagues who do live similarly further afield - within the Slough/Reading/Bracknell triangle is popular - if he’s struggling they may have some words of advice for how they manage/cope with it.

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

Yes I see where you guys are coming from its just hard for me because every option I put forward is a rejection from him:

- transfer to Reading station = harder work same pay no

- commut by car = time wasting too drained to drive rush hour no

- commute by train just for coming back = might miss a train no frequent trains running at night between 12-3am time waste just in case he does miss train no

So there's literally no compromise....hypothetically if you guys were in my husband shoes which option would you go for please??

 

[Driver2B]

Yes I see where you guys are coming from its just hard for me because every option I put forward is a rejection from him:

- transfer to Reading station = harder work same pay no

- commut by car = time wasting too drained to drive rush hour no

- commute by train just for coming back = might miss a train no frequent trains running at night between 12-3am time waste just in case he does miss train no

So there's literally no compromise....hypothetically if you guys were in my husband shoes which option would you go for please??

Hi,

I sympathise with your situation, and finding a way forward would be for you and your husband to work out, but I just wanted to add a couple of points.

TOCs usually require new employees to live within 45 or 60 minutes commute of depot, and this is complained about by many potential applicants on these forums. But TOCs require it for a reason. Commuting is tiring, especially when you drive all day. My commute to work is an hour, and I would not want my commute to be any longer than that. The longer your commute, the higher your fatigue index (ie, the sooner during your shift you are likely to get fatigued). Fatigue is a huge issue on the railway, and a huge proportion of incidents are caused by fatigue (driving is very repetetive!). Sometimes we only have 12 hours between booking off of one shift and booking on for our next shift. When you consider the commute, eating dinner and breakfast, preparing for bed and preparing for work, there's very little time there for sleeping! Some people do have long commutes and they appear to manage their fatigue. Personally, I find 1 hour in each direction more than enough for me, and I would certainly not be moving further away from work.

Another thing which I have picked up on as a possibility, which hasn't been mentioned, is your husband's safety record. Reading between the lines, I'm wondering if your husband has had a few incidents as it seems like he is extremely concerned about having one. Certainly, if he has several incidents on his record (and can't afford (m)any more), I can see why he is so keen to protect his record, and therefore his job.

I agree with your husband that commuting by car sounds unworkable. Bearing in mind the night trains, commuting by train it doesn't sound ideal, but if it means he can spend more time with family, could be worth talking through. I understand him not wanting to transfer to Reading if he's got a few incidents on his record. If the reason he doesn't want to transfer to Reading is harder (but not riskier) work, then I would think living with family and saving money on a second home might possibly balance it out.

I do sympathise with your situation, but I just got the feeling that you didn't understand the effect fatigue can have, so I hope that this is helpful.

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

Hi,

I sympathise with your situation, and finding a way forward would be for you and your husband to work out, but I just wanted to add a couple of points.

TOCs usually require new employees to live within 45 or 60 minutes commute of depot, and this is complained about by many potential applicants on these forums. But TOCs require it for a reason. Commuting is tiring, especially when you drive all day. My commute to work is an hour, and I would not want my commute to be any longer than that. The longer your commute, the higher your fatigue index (ie, the sooner during your shift you are likely to get fatigued). Fatigue is a huge issue on the railway, and a huge proportion of incidents are caused by fatigue (driving is very repetetive!). Sometimes we only have 12 hours between booking off of one shift and booking on for our next shift. When you consider the commute, eating dinner and breakfast, preparing for bed and preparing for work, there's very little time there for sleeping! Some people do have long commutes and they appear to manage their fatigue. Personally, I find 1 hour in each direction more than enough for me, and I would certainly not be moving further away from work.

Another thing which I have picked up on as a possibility, which hasn't been mentioned, is your husband's safety record. Reading between the lines, I'm wondering if your husband has had a few incidents as it seems like he is extremely concerned about having one. Certainly, if he has several incidents on his record (and can't afford (m)any more), I can see why he is so keen to protect his record, and therefore his job.

I agree with your husband that commuting by car sounds unworkable. Bearing in mind the night trains, commuting by train it doesn't sound ideal, but if it means he can spend more time with family, could be worth talking through. I understand him not wanting to transfer to Reading if he's got a few incidents on his record. If the reason he doesn't want to transfer to Reading is harder (but not riskier) work, then I would think living with family and saving money on a second home might possibly balance it out.

I do sympathise with your situation, but I just got the feeling that you didn't understand the effect fatigue can have, so I hope that this is helpful.

Thank you so much for your response I agree commute by driving is not feasible because it would be over the limit of 60mins....commute by train which is purely the coming back at night could work because it's not like he will have late late shifts everyday. And the commute from Reading to Paddington is only 30min. He has no incidents or mistakes but he has seen lots of people from his original team who have had to leave due to the mistakes. If I'm not mistaken your only allowed 1 or 2 mistakes then your off the job its happened to a couple of people he knows that's why I guess he doesn't want to transfer because he is comfortable where he has and doesn't want a harder job for the same pay

 

[Lewlew]

What's the reason for doing the lates? Is it not possible to do some earlier shifts? 9-5s or finish around 10/11pm ish? That will make the commute far more bearable.

I'm not a driver on HEx so not sure if those shifts are available.

 

[Horizon22]

Yes I see where you guys are coming from its just hard for me because every option I put forward is a rejection from him:

- transfer to Reading station = harder work same pay no

- commut by car = time wasting too drained to drive rush hour no

- commute by train just for coming back = might miss a train no frequent trains running at night between 12-3am time waste just in case he does miss train no

So there's literally no compromise....hypothetically if you guys were in my husband shoes which option would you go for please??

As I’ve said there’s trains from Paddington at those times - currently at 0030, 0034, 0134 & 0334. (later 3 all stopping services but still quicker). HEX has no arrivals after 0034, so really struggling to work out what the problem is? This is of course the very latest shift and chances are he won’t be on that so will be fine.

There’s no HEX “depot” at Paddington any more (previously Old Oak) - the sets stable overnight or go to West Ealing or Reading.

It seems like he’s made up his mind based on your discussions then and I think the conversation is going around in circles. He needs to work out what his priorities are.

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

What's the reason for doing the lates? Is it not possible to do some earlier shifts? 9-5s or finish around 10/11pm ish? That will make the commute far more bearable.

I'm not a driver on HEx so not sure if those shifts are available.

They are available but hard to come across he kind of has a buddy system so he likes doing lates/mids ...earlys however he has a guy to swap with so he gives all his early to him

As I’ve said there’s trains from Paddington at those times - currently at 0030, 0034, 0134 & 0334. (later 3 all stopping services but still quicker). HEX has no arrivals after 0034, so really struggling to work out what the problem is? This is of course the very latest shift and chances are he won’t be on that so will be fine.

There’s no HEX “depot” at Paddington any more (previously Old Oak) - the sets stable overnight or go to West Ealing or Reading.

It seems like he’s made up his mind based on your discussions then and I think the conversation is going around in circles. He needs to work out what his priorities are.

I agree that's what I was thinking if he doesn't want to transfer because the workload is harder and can't drive because we are passed the distance limit then the only feasible option is train we live like 10/15min away from Reading Station and the train journey itself is only 30mins and up until midnight trains run regularly its only after midnight that there is a bit of a gap and when he has those shifts which won't be every day he can either swap or get a taxi ...he will still be saving money on living costs as he won't need to pay rent to a room anymore and save on food shopping so an occasional taxi won't be so bad

 

[JN114]

This is, ultimately rather circular.

You’ve correctly identified the three options your husband can take. Working (indirectly) with your husband; I know that there are a number of his colleagues who live in a similar area to you. There are also a small number of his colleagues who have “jumped ship” already.

My advice would be to him to speak with those colleagues who live in your area and see how they cope with the same issues; and/or speak with those that have recently made the jump and get their thoughts on the comparative workload. I’d also question if travel is such an issue then perhaps he should consider whether he really can swap all the time with his colleague - going back to “normal” mix of earlies and lates would further reduce how often it’s a problem.

If neither of those change things then you’ve already outlined the three remaining options - the decision is his at that point.

 

[Elvina Chhabra]

Thanks Everyone for all your help I think I will have a sit down and let him know I've done my own investigating and have taken his concerns into consideration if he doesn't want to move to Reading because he wants the easy workload fine. And I can't expect him to drive 3hrs a day and then drive a train that's not fair and for health/fatigue reasons it's not safe. The best option is I'll drop him to Reading station in the afternoons he can take a 30min train ride to his job a PAD then catch a train ride back to Reading and I'll pick him and on the off occasions where his shift is passed midnight and he may miss the train ride home he can grab a taxi. A half hr commute is normal for any job and if I don't mind staying up to pick him from the station I don't see a problem. If after all that he still is not convinced...well then heaven help me!

 

[whoosh]

One thing I will say, is that changing companies (or even swapping depots within a company) can cause anxiety about 'the unknown'.

Also...
The 6 on 4 off has all rest days together, giving quality time off at home. The rest day pattern at GWR would give 5 days off every three weeks (which straddles two of the weeks), but the one remaining period of rest days is 2 together, which isn't so much of a break obviously.
There's also Sundays in the working week at HEX, and Sundays outside the working week at GWR, but I think you are committed to work them unless you can find someone else to do them, so potentially forced overtime depending on how easy or hard they are to give to someone else to do.

You are doing the right thing investigating and finding out as much info as possible. I'd be seeing if I could get a copy of the roster, and someone above said how to get the diagrams off the company intranet.

More variety in routes would probably mean less boredom and less chance of making mistakes I would say.