GWR Reimbursement?

[lrailadventure]

Yesterday I was travelling from Gloucester to York (via London) and it would be safe to say that it was not the easiest of journeys (this is going to be a long ramble but I need some advice at the end)..

I was booked on the following trains:

• 11:17 - Gloucester to London Paddington (arriving 12:59)
• 14:27 - Kings Cross to York (arriving 16:14)

I held Advance tickets for both of these trains and because of all of the issues between Reading and Paddington recently, I gave myself a longer connection time than I normally would just in case anything went wrong (which oh boy did it..)

The problems started at Gloucester, with the 11:17 omitting the stop (due to a fault with the unit) and travelling directly from Cheltenham to Stonehouse to make up time for the delay in leaving Cheltenham (only 14 minutes, but GWR control seems to be omitting the Gloucester stop for any delay currently due to the train having to reverse there). The platform staff started providing mixed messages about what people could do, some saying to travel to Bristol Parkway and connect with the next Paddington train there, and others saying to wait for the next direct service an hour later. Another passenger pointed out that the train they were suggesting to connect with at Bristol was cancelled, but the staff were not proactive in getting this information to passengers that they had already told to get on the Bristol train.

This led to confusion among passengers on the platform as to which train they should be taking. I obviously waited for the next direct train at 12:17, knowing there was no connection in Bristol to be made. I spoke to the staff at the customer information desk and asked what would happen to my connection at Kings Cross, as at a maximum I would now only have 30 minutes to get there from Paddington, and they told me that I would need to speak to the staff there and see if they could get me on an LNER service, should I miss my connection due to the infrequency of Grand Central.

The 12:17 arrived and I boarded it with no problems (apart from departing 2 minutes late but we'd be able to make it up right..?). By Stonehouse, we were 6 minutes late, and we kept this delay up for the rest of the journey, eventually arriving into Paddington at 14:05 (22 minutes before my train was booked to leave Kings Cross). There was no information provided as to why we were running late during the journey.

When I arrived at Paddington, I ran (not something I do very often.. or enjoy doing) to the Circle Line platform and watched the tube close the doors and leave as I was coming down the stairs. There was a 4-minute wait for the next service, which got me to Kings Cross at 14:25, but since it's quite a trek up to the mainline (and on a Saturday afternoon with hopeless tourists getting in the way at every possible chance), I didn't get to the mainline platforms until 14:28 - a minute after my train had departed!

I went and spoke to staff at the King's Cross information desk, and they told me they wouldn't be able to put me on an LNER service unless I bought a brand-new ticket, and the best they could offer was for me to travel on the next Grand Central service at 16:48. The reason they wouldn't put me on a LNER train? Because GWR had not given me anything that had an official stamp to state that their cancellations and delays had caused me all these problems.

I couldn't afford to pay for a new ticket, but I also really didn't want to wait nearly 2.5 hours at Kings Cross - I had been to my Grandad's funeral the day before and literally just wanted (and desperately needed) a quick and easy journey home. My only option was to take the 16:48, for which the person I was speaking to gave me a stamped ticket saying that I would be allowed to travel on, and incur no extra charges, but I was so frustrated, stressed at tired at this point that I was stood in the middle of the concourse, completely alone, crying. No one offered any help and I was left to try and work this all out on my own.

I messaged GWR's Social Media team (through X) and asked them if i purchased a new ticket for an LNER train, would they reimburse the costs, since I was facing a near 2.5 hour delay otherwise. They came back to me after I provided details of my tickets and said that because I had 2 separate advanced tickets they would not be able to do this, and once again I was on my own with no help. The only help came in the saving grace of a very good friend who purchased a new ticket for me, and provided me with the collection code, so I could pick it up at a TVM. He had booked me on the 15:00 LNER service, so I arrived in York at 16:52 (38 minutes after I had planned to).

So I now have a few questions:

• Should GWR reimburse the costs of the new ticket (so I can pay my friend back)?
  • If they won't reimburse the whole ticket, could they reimburse the difference between the ticket I already held and the new ticket?
• What should I be claiming delay repay on (Just Gloucester to Paddington or the whole journey despite my split tickets that GWR seem to have issue with)?
• Is this worth making an official complaint about (because I have never had such little help, and been left crying alone in the middle of a concourse before)!?
  • Who would the complaint go to? GWR? Grand Central (it was their representative I spoke to I believe)?
  • If I make the complaint will someone help me write it, because right now any letter I write would contain a lot of 'f's and 'o's.

Just for clarity, the prices of the tickets I held (with my 16-25 railcard discount) were:

• Gloucester to Paddington - £17.80
• Kings Cross to York (GC, old) - £13.85
• Kings Cross to York (LNER, new) - £44.55

 

[Babybirdrobin]

Good evening,

In answer to your questions:
1. GWR won’t be in a position to reimburse the whole cost because it’s not their operator you had a new ticket on, look at LNER or maybe GC for that (I’m still not 100% sure though that they’d reimburse but still worth trying
2. Any reimbursement from GWR would be through delay repay so you would submits a form there and GWR could only pay for disruption on their ticket because split-tickets are technically separate so the legs would be different and you would end up needing to submit 2 and not both to GWR.
3. Delay Repay would be just Gloucester to Paddington although you could try a second one from King’s Cross to York although likely to get delayed as buying a new ticket would technically reset the delay for you as the service your new ticket was on wasn’t delayed.
4. Unfortunately, an unofficial complaint wouldn’t help you as it’s not GWR’s responsibility for an LNER ticket even if it was their fault that you missed the train associated with your second ticket, any delay repay would get denied because GWR would say it’s not their ticket and their train and GC would say it’s GWR’s fault.

Sorry for the length of this, also, I don’t specialise I’m tickets and this is only my knowledge of the system and reality may be different but here’s my opinion anyways

 

[AlterEgo]

Good evening,

In answer to your questions:
1. GWR won’t be in a position to reimburse the whole cost because it’s not their operator you had a new ticket on, look at LNER or maybe GC for that (I’m still not 100% sure though that they’d reimburse but still worth trying
2. Any reimbursement from GWR would be through delay repay so you would submits a form there and GWR could only pay for disruption on their ticket because split-tickets are technically separate so the legs would be different and you would end up needing to submit 2 and not both to GWR.
3. Delay Repay would be just Gloucester to Paddington although you could try a second one from King’s Cross to York although likely to get delayed as buying a new ticket would technically reset the delay for you as the service your new ticket was on wasn’t delayed.
4. Unfortunately, an unofficial complaint wouldn’t help you as it’s not GWR’s responsibility for an LNER ticket even if it was their fault that you missed the train associated with your second ticket, any delay repay would get denied because GWR would say it’s not their ticket and their train and GC would say it’s GWR’s fault.

Sorry for the length of this, also, I don’t specialise I’m tickets and this is only my knowledge of the system and reality may be different but here’s my opinion anyways

This advice is premature.

We need to know whether the OP held a through rail ticket to Zone 1 (or some other Zone or LU station) or whether they used Oyster/contactless for their rail journey. This will fundamentally affect the outcome they can achieve here.

 

[lrailadventure]

Following LNER moving to single leg pricing, there is no through ticket from Gloucester to York via London. The only way to do it is to purchase 2 separate tickets (plus the tube).

So basically because LNER changed the system, I'm £60 out of pocket? I can't get the money back for the unused GC ticket that I missed due to disruption and I'm going to have to stump up the £40 to give back to my friend, all because GWR wouldn't give me a stamped ticket saying they've caused the delays (the only reason GC wouldn't try and get me acceptance on a LNER service is because I didn't have anything officially stamped from GWR ...)

 

[skyhigh]

Grand Central (it was their representative I spoke to I believe)?

(the only reason GC wouldn't try and get me acceptance on a LNER service is because I didn't have anything officially stamped from GWR ...)

As far as I'm aware, there are no GC staff at King's Cross other than on the trains. So you'd probably have spoken to LNER staff.

 

[bcarmicle]

Following LNER moving to single leg pricing, there is no through ticket from Gloucester to York via London. The only way to do it is to purchase 2 separate tickets (plus the tube).

So basically because LNER changed the system, I'm £60 out of pocket?

I will let others speak as to what compensation you may or may not be entitled to, but I do not believe there has ever been a through ticket from Gloucester to York valid via London.

 

[lrailadventure]

Deleted.

If it's not worth pursuing I'll just give up and find a way to somehow stump up the cash. Ridiculous that GWR are not responsible for this apparently even though it's a directly result of their failing.. Guess the railways just continue to get more and more useless.

 

[skyhigh]

I will let others speak as to what compensation you may or may not be entitled to, but I do not believe there has ever been a through ticket from Gloucester to York valid via London.

There hasn't been since at least September 2022, I can't easily check any further back than that. That's before single leg pricing came in on York tickets so any change isn't related to that.

 

[30907]

If you had through tickets that connected, ie one of them covered your tube journey, then GW would be liable for delay repay throughout, based on the arrival of the 1648. If not, they are only liable as far as Paddington. You haven't clarified which you had.
Delay repay would be at 100%.

 

[lrailadventure]

I've already detailed what tickets I had in post #1. But I had an advanced single for Gloucester to Paddington, and a separate advanced single for Kings Cross to York. Neither included the tube journey because:

A) I didn't know that was even possible to do.​

B) I didn't realise the system was so horrendously set up so that this wasn't counted as a single journey.​

C) I assumed 1.5 hours to get from Paddington to Kings Cross was significantly more than enough time and I wouldn't find myself in this situation.​

​

And just incase anyone is wondering why I went via London.. it was cheaper through those 2 advanced tickets than a through ticket via Birmingham because prices on XC routes are extortionate, and 4 car voyagers on a Saturday afternoon are not something I want to be involved with.

Next time I have to travel I'm just going by bus, cheaper and a hell of a lot less complicated. I've given up using trains now - I can't remember the last journey I made without complications or delays...

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Deleted.

If it's not worth pursuing I'll just give up and find a way to somehow stump up the cash. Ridiculous that GWR are not responsible for this apparently even though it's a directly result of their failing.. Guess the railways just continue to get more and more useless.

You will be able to claim delay repay on your journey from Gloucester to Paddington.

 

[furlong]

The bit about the underground is a red herring as long as plenty of time was allowed for it. Focus on the lack of endorsement and write a simple letter to LNER seeking reimbursement because their member of staff didn't want to take the trouble to validate the delay with either GWR or industry systems themselves, which they should have done. Which retailer did your friend use? You can make separate arguments that GWR is liable or that LNER is liable so if the ticket was bought from either of them, that might be the place to start as refunds can be simpler than compensation payments.

 

[Haywain]

As far as I'm aware, there are no GC staff at King's Cross other than on the trains. So you'd probably have spoken to LNER staff.

There are permanent GC staff at Kings Cross, shared with Hull Trains and possibly Lumo.

 

[AlterEgo]

I've already detailed what tickets I had in post #1. But I had an advanced single for Gloucester to Paddington, and a separate advanced single for Kings Cross to York. Neither included the tube journey because:

A) I didn't know that was even possible to do.​

B) I didn't realise the system was so horrendously set up so that this wasn't counted as a single journey.​

C) I assumed 1.5 hours to get from Paddington to Kings Cross was significantly more than enough time and I wouldn't find myself in this situation.​

​

And just incase anyone is wondering why I went via London.. it was cheaper through those 2 advanced tickets than a through ticket via Birmingham because prices on XC routes are extortionate, and 4 car voyagers on a Saturday afternoon are not something I want to be involved with.

Next time I have to travel I'm just going by bus, cheaper and a hell of a lot less complicated. I've given up using trains now - I can't remember the last journey I made without complications or delays...

I know this is not so helpful now, but you can get tickets to London Zone 1 instead of Paddington, this gives you a "fully sewn up" split ticket with no gap and you would have been able to enforce your rights better.

As it stands, you have no strict legal right to recompense for the additional ticket, but you can still complain about the bad service, and I encourage you to do so. The staff at Kings Cross you spoke to were lazy; there is no need to get a stamped card or ticket verifying a delay; they can look it up themselves, or call someone. They were going to pass you for travel anyway until they decided not to, capriciously, in my view. I would first be complaining to Grand Central, assuming you are sure it is their staff you spoke to.

 

[30907]

The bit about the underground is a red herring as long as plenty of time was allowed for it. Focus on the lack of endorsement and write a simple letter to LNER seeking reimbursement because their member of staff didn't want to take the trouble to validate the delay with either GWR or industry systems themselves, which they should have done. Which retailer did your friend use? You can make separate arguments that GWR is liable or that LNER is liable so if the ticket was bought from either of them, that might be the place to start as refunds can be simpler than compensation payments.

Small detail: the OP had a GC Advance for the second leg, not LNER.

 

[alastair]

You will be able to claim delay repay on your journey from Gloucester to Paddington.

Indeed and the procedure for GWR delay repay is very quick and simple on their website. The last couple of claims I have done have been paid (direct to my bank account)within 36 hrs. 100% GWR delay repay will at least recover some or most of your losses.

 

[Haywain]

My view here is that any claim is against GWR and refers to the whole journey. Recompense should be sought from GWR for the additional fare paid and for Delay Repay. It is the cancellation of and delay to GWR services that is the rootcause of all this. Grand Central (assumption alert) did not act correctly at King's Cross and should be the subject of a complaint also but I'm not sure it will achieve anything as we have seen on a number of occasions that GC don't worry much about doing the right thing for customers.

 

[ValleyLines142]

The problems started at Gloucester, with the 11:17 omitting the stop (due to a fault with the unit) and travelling directly from Cheltenham to Stonehouse to make up time for the delay in leaving Cheltenham (only 14 minutes, but GWR control seems to be omitting the Gloucester stop for any delay currently due to the train having to reverse there). The platform staff started providing mixed messages about what people could do, some saying to travel to Bristol Parkway and connect with the next Paddington train there, and others saying to wait for the next direct service an hour later. Another passenger pointed out that the train they were suggesting to connect with at Bristol was cancelled, but the staff were not proactive in getting this information to passengers that they had already told to get on the Bristol train. This led to confusion among passengers on the platform as to which train they should be taking. I obviously waited for the next direct train at 12:17, knowing there was no connection in Bristol to be made. I spoke to the staff at the customer information desk and asked what would happen to my connection at Kings Cross as at a maximum I would now only have 30 minutes to get there from Paddington, and they told me that I would need to speak to the staff there and see if they could get me on an LNER service, should I miss my connection due to the infrequency of Grand Central.

The 12:17 arrived and I boarded it with no problems (apart from departing 2 minutes late but we'd be able to make it up right..?). By Stonehouse, we were 6 minutes late, and we kept this delay up for the rest of the journey, eventually arriving into Paddington at 14:05 (22 minutes before my train was booked to leave Kings Cross). There was no information provided as to why we were running late during the journey. When I arrived at Paddington, I ran (not something I do very often.. or enjoy doing) to the Circle Line platform and watched the tube close the doors and leave as I was coming down the stairs. There was a 4-minute wait for the next service, which got me to Kings Cross at 14:25, but since it's quite a trek up to the mainline (and on a Saturday afternoon with hopeless tourists getting in the way at every possible chance), I didn't get to the mainline platforms until 14:28 - a minute after my train had departed!

I went and spoke to staff at the information desk, and they told me they wouldn't be able to put me on an LNER service unless I bought a brand-new ticket, and the best they could offer was for me to travel on the next Grand Central service at 16:48. The reason they wouldn't put me on a LNER train? Because GWR had not given me anything that had an official stamp to state that their cancellations and delays had caused me all these problems. I couldn't afford to pay for a new ticket, but I also really didn't want to wait nearly 2.5 hours at Kings Cross - I had been to my Grandad's funeral the day before and literally just wanted (and desperately needed) a quick and easy journey home. My only option was to take the 16:48, for which the person I was speaking to gave me a stamped ticket saying that I would be allowed to travel on, and incur no extra charges, but I was so frustrated, stressed at tired at this point that I was stood in the middle of the concourse, completely alone, crying. No one offered any help and I was left to try and work this all out on my own.

I messaged GWR's Social Media team (through X) and asked them if i purchased a new ticket for an LNER train, would they reimburse the costs, since I was facing a near 2.5 hour delay otherwise. They came back to me after I provided details of my tickets and said that because I had 2 separate advanced tickets they would not be able to do this, and once again I was on my own with no help. The only help came in the saving grace of a very good friend who purchased a new ticket for me and provided me with the collection code so I could pick it up at a TVM. He had booked me on the 15:00 LNER service, so I arrived in York at 16:52 (38 minutes after I had planned to).

So I now have a few questions:

• Should GWR reimburse the costs of the new ticket (so I can pay my friend back)?
  • If they won't reimburse the whole ticket, could they reimburse the difference between the ticket I already held and the new ticket?
• What should I be claiming delay repay on (Just Gloucester to Paddington or the whole journey despite my split tickets that GWR seem to have issue with)?
• Is this worth making an official complaint about (because I have never had such little help, and been left crying alone in the middle of a concourse before)!?
  • Who would the complaint go to? GWR? Grand Central (it was their representative I spoke to I believe)?
  • If I make the complaint will someone help me write it, because right now any letter I write would contain a lot of 'f's and 'o's.

Just for clarity, the prices of the tickets I held (with my 16-25 railcard discount) were:

• Gloucester to Paddington - £17.80
• Kings Cross to York (GC, old) - £13.85
• Kings Cross to York (LNER, new) - £44.55

I was in Gloucester at the time.

The 11:17 from Gloucester had a train fault in the cab on the previous journey. Because a reversal is required at Gloucester, it ran fast from Cheltenham to Stonehouse to avoid having to use the faulty cab that it would have done from Gloucester.

The advise was to get the 11:39 to Bristol and change there for a connecting service to Paddington. However, after that advice was given, the connecting service from Bristol was cancelled at the last minute. It was at this point where one of the platform staff made an announcement advising people to go against this and to just wait for the 12:17 instead.

It's a grey area because of how infrequent Grand Central are; as @AlterEgo has said, GC could have checked themselves on various internal systems and they would have seen that the 11:17 did not call at Gloucester.

Claim delay repay through GWR for the 11:17, but I'd also lodge a seperate complaint at GC because they could have been a bit pro-active in working with either LNER or Lumo and tried to get you on there instead.

 

[lrailadventure]

A complaint has been submitted to GWR this morning in regards to how the situation was handled, and because I hold this view too:

My view here is that any claim is against GWR and refers to the whole journey. Recompense should be sought from GWR for the additional fare paid and for Delay Repay. It is the cancellation of and delay to GWR services that is the rootcause of all this. Grand Central (assumption alert) did not act correctly at King's Cross and should be the subject of a complaint also but I'm not sure it will achieve anything as we have seen on a number of occasions that GC don't worry much about doing the right thing for customers.

Just a couple of responses to other bits:

I know this is not so helpful now, but you can get tickets to London Zone 1 instead of Paddington, this gives you a "fully sewn up" split ticket with no gap and you would have been able to enforce your rights better.

That's good to know, but does that mean I wouldn't be able to make use of advanced tickets? My ticket was £17 and the cheapest I can now find on GWRs website is £26.. That's quite a difference in prices.

As far as I'm aware, there are no GC staff at King's Cross other than on the trains. So you'd probably have spoken to LNER staff.

I spoke to a member of staff at the information desk who was wearing an LNER uniform. They confirmed that I had a GC only advanced ticket, and radio'd for someone else to come over. That member of staff was not wearing any distinctive uniform, except a purple high-vis style vest. They gave me a stamped ticket that said I would be able to travel on the 16:48 without any additional charge and signed it with their name under a "GC representative" section, hence my beliefs that I was talking to GC staff.

The member of staff did not in any way attempt to verify my delay, they simply said because I didn't have anything from GWR, they could only put me on the next GC service. I asked could I excess my ticket from a GC only to an LNER and got the response "this is like flying, you wouldn't book easyJet and expect to fly British Airways" in a very rude and abrupt tone. This is the part where I got so frustrated that I started crying and just took the ticket for the 16:48 and gave up trying.

The advise was to get the 11:39 to Bristol and change there for a connecting service to Paddington. However, after that advice was given, the connecting service from Bristol was cancelled at the last minute. It was at this point where one of the platform staff made an announcement advising people to go against this and to just wait for the 12:17 instead.

Knowledge that the connection at Bristol Parkway was cancelled wasn't "last minute". The staff were informed by a passenger almost as soon as they had announced to get the Bristol train that it was cancelled. They didn't make an announcement until the Bristol train was pulling in. 1 announcement as a train is arriving, after making multiple announcements on the PA and talking to individual groups of passengers on the platform isn't really acceptable in my view, and leads to unnecessary confusion.

Claim delay repay through GWR for the 11:17, but I'd also lodge a seperate complaint at GC because they could have been a bit pro-active in working with either LNER or Lumo and tried to get you on there instead.

A complaint with GC will be following suit, but is there a certain timeframe I have to do it within? I.e could I wait for the result of the complaint with GWR, and then complain to GC, so if GWR won't reimburse the fare, I can ask GC to reimburse it instead?

 

[Haywain]

That member of staff was not wearing any distinctive uniform, except a purple high-vis style vest.

That will have been the GC member of staff - there's no distinctive uniform because they also represent Hull Trains (and, possibly, Lumo).

 

[WesternLancer]

A complaint with GC will be following suit, but is there a certain timeframe I have to do it within? I.e could I wait for the result of the complaint with GWR, and then complain to GC, so if GWR won't reimburse the fare, I can ask GC to reimburse it instead?

I would get some sort of compliant into them too ASAP - as that stopes them claiming at some later point that you have missed whatever deadline they might impose to consider complaints

I see their Passenger Charter and Complaints Procedure can both be downloaded here so you could check deadlines there but I would not wait to lodge it.
and I see this

"For compensation to be considered, your claim must be received by our Customer Relations team within 28 days of you completing the relevant journey."

Complaint handling, refunds and compensation information | Grand Central Rail

Return to "How are we doing?" Our process for managing complaints is covered under the "If things go wrong" section of our Passenger Charter. Our complaint procedure can be found here.

www.grandcentralrail.com

I would also seek to frame your complain to them in a clear way that seeks to relate your complaint to a failing in their delivery of their own procedure or passenger charter if this is possible (since it gives them less wriggle room) - eg by saying things like 'I do not believe my circumstances were treated in line with what you state should happen on page X of ....where it states"...."' or some such form of words, if possible to do.

Good luck with all this - you were treated very poorly by the railway IMHO.

 

[lrailadventure]

Thank you @WesternLancer.

I shall have a look through their passenger charters and formulate a complaint letter. Would it help my case to include the ticket they provided me for the 16:48 since it has their intial and surname under the signature, or would they be able to work out who I was likely to have been speaking to without it (I'm only asking because I've gone away for a couple of days and if it will help my case, I won't be able to submit it until at least Friday).

I've had some shockingly poor experiences on the railway, but never to the extent where I've been left crying from frustration and stress.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you @WesternLancer.

I shall have a look through their passenger charters and formulate a complaint letter. Would it help my case to include the ticket they provided me for the 16:48 since it has their intial and surname under the signature, or would they be able to work out who I was likely to have been speaking to without it (I'm only asking because I've gone away for a couple of days and if it will help my case, I won't be able to submit it until at least Friday).

I've had some shockingly poor experiences on the railway, but never to the extent where I've been left crying from frustration and stress.

I would tend to think it can be of no harm to include your ticket or a copy of it / scan / image. Keep copies of all that you send to all parties (in case you end up pursuing it to the Ombudsman or Transport Focus (the watchdog) and need all the material).

Yes, a shockingly poor experience.

 

[lrailadventure]

Thank you for the help @WesternLancer, I shall have to wait until the end of the week in that case to get a scan of the ticket and submit the complaint to GC.

 

[ValleyLines142]

Knowledge that the connection at Bristol Parkway was cancelled wasn't "last minute". The staff were informed by a passenger almost as soon as they had announced to get the Bristol train that it was cancelled. They didn't make an announcement until the Bristol train was pulling in. 1 announcement as a train is arriving, after making multiple announcements on the PA and talking to individual groups of passengers on the platform isn't really acceptable in my view, and leads to unnecessary confusion.

I could have sworn it was a lot earlier. Doesn't help that GWR took an almost work to rule style approach, cancelling a train that only a few moments prior was still running (I'm referring to the connection from Bristol Parkway to Paddington) when checked. At least the announcement was made before the Bristol train was pulling in, so that people could wait for the next direct one, and not after the Bristol had departed.

However, Grand Central are really at fault here because they didn't need a 'stamp' from GWR to say it was cancelled. Whilst LNER and Lumo shouldn't have to pick up the slack from a Grand Central-only Advance, GC could have worked with them to meet a customer's expectations which ultimately should be all TOCs priority.

 

[gray1404]

Was Grand Central even obliged to carry the passenger on their next service given that the tickets didn't join up?

I think we need to be clear about who expressed he said that the passenger could not travel with LNER.

 

[island]

Was Grand Central even obliged to carry the passenger on their next service given that the tickets didn't join up?

No. As the passenger had a "hole in the middle" not covered by a pre-purchased ticket, they had two separate journeys, and the advance ticket was lost upon their failure to arrive on time to board the booked train. So even authorising travel on the 16:48 was a gesture of goodwill.

The passenger is entitled to DelayRepay on GWR of £17.80 being 100% of the ticket price based on their 60+ minutes late arrival time at Paddington, and that is all.

Following LNER moving to single leg pricing, there is no through ticket from Gloucester to York via London. The only way to do it is to purchase 2 separate tickets (plus the tube).

This has nothing to do with single leg pricing. Even before that change, through tickets from Gloucester to York were routed Not Via London and various CrossCountry advance routes.

 

[Haywain]

I think we need to be clear about who expressed he said that the passenger could not travel with LNER.

We have established that - an LNER uniformed member of staff called the person who authorised travel on a later Grand Central service, which only the GC representative would be able to do.

 

[lrailadventure]

However, Grand Central are really at fault here because they didn't need a 'stamp' from GWR to say it was cancelled. Whilst LNER and Lumo shouldn't have to pick up the slack from a Grand Central-only Advance, GC could have worked with them to meet a customer's expectations which ultimately should be all TOCs priority.

Grand Central didn't even check what ticket I had for the Gloucester to Paddington leg of my journey. They didn't know if I held a ticket to through to zone 1 or just to Paddington. They didn't make any attempts to sort anything for me (I do not consider making a lone young woman who's stood in tears wait 2.5 hours as sorting things..). If they had said you could travel on the GC 15:25 Bradford service as far as Doncaster and then pay for a new ticket between Doncaster and York, I would have accepted it. But the member of staff was (in my opinion at least) rude and unhelpful.

No. As the passenger had a "hole in the middle" not covered by a pre-purchased ticket, they had two separate journeys, and the advance ticket was lost upon their failure to arrive on time to board the booked train. So even authorising travel on the 16:48 was a gesture of goodwill.

So what do you propose I do.. my advance ticket to Paddington, booked 3 weeks in advance, was £17. If I look at booking a ticket now for 3 weeks time, for a zone 1 ticket.. its £26. There is no advanced option. Why would I spend an extra £10 for a £2 tube journey? When I spoke to the staff at Gloucester, they said as long I had given myself enough of a connection time (45 minutes they mentioned) to get from Paddington to Kings Cross, something could be sorted if I missed my train and firmly implied that due to GCs infrequency, there was a good chance of being put on another operator's service. As I'd given myself 1.5 hours for the 20-minute tube journey, I thought I had covered myself pretty well in case of disruption...

 

[Watershed]

Grand Central didn't even check what ticket I had for the Gloucester to Paddington leg of my journey. They didn't know if I held a ticket to through to zone 1 or just to Paddington. They didn't make any attempts to sort anything for me (I do not consider making a lone young woman who's stood in tears wait 2.5 hours as sorting things..). If they had said you could travel on the GC 15:25 Bradford service as far as Doncaster and then pay for a new ticket between Doncaster and York, I would have accepted it. But the member of staff was (in my opinion at least) rude and unhelpful.

Grand Central certainly provided poor customer service and given their indifference to the actual ticket(s) held, we can be almost certain that they would have treated you in the same way if you'd held tickets that 'joined up'. They seem to regard providing re-routing at the earliest opportunity in the event of cancellations or missed connections as optional, rather than the legal requirement it is (the infrequency of their services means the delay by waiting for the next GC service will almost always be more than an hour).

That being said, in this particular situation I don't think they were legally in the wrong - even if that resulted due to a fundamental policy problem on their side rather than a nuanced appreciation of your situation.

So what do you propose I do.. my advance ticket to Paddington, booked 3 weeks in advance, was £17. If I look at booking a ticket now for 3 weeks time, for a zone 1 ticket.. its £26. There is no advanced option.

The problem appears to be that GWR haven't defined any Advance tickets between Gloucester and any of the Underground Zones - only to London Terminals.

Most booking sites therefore won't offer any Advances if you search for London Underground Zone 1. However, some sites such as TrainSplit will offer a 'compound fare' whereby they sell you a fare that's priced using the cost of the London Terminals Advance and then an add-on for the Tube. It still prints as one ticket.

If I search for Gloucester to Paddington Advances on Thursday 22 Feb, most direct trains through the afternoon are priced at £17.80 for an Advance to Paddington. This is ticket type W2S.


The same Advance becomes £19.80 if I buy it to London Underground Zone 1 through TrainSplit:


Therefore I'd suggest using a site that sells 'compound fares' so that you can continue to benefit from cheaper Advances as well as having full protection in the event of delays when you make journeys crossing London.

Why would I spend an extra £10 for a £2 tube journey?

As above, it's possible to pay just £2 more, which is almost exactly the same as the PAYG fare (in fact it's less if you touch in at times when peak PAYG fares apply).

When I spoke to the staff at Gloucester, they said as long I had given myself enough of a connection time (45 minutes they mentioned) to get from Paddington to Kings Cross, something could be sorted if I missed my train and firmly implied that due to GCs infrequency, there was a good chance of being put on another operator's service. As I'd given myself 1.5 hours for the 20-minute tube journey, I thought I had covered myself pretty well in case of disruption...

The staff at Gloucester are correct - the minimum connection time (MCT) between Paddington and Kings Cross is 45 minutes between 07:00 and 19:00 Mon-Sat (it's slightly longer outside these times and on Sundays). This is made up of the 15 minute MCT at both Paddington and Kings Cross and 15 minutes for the Tube.

If they were being even more customer focussed they might have endorsed your onward Advance to permit travel on LNER. But perhaps they felt this was something they shouldn't do - if so, train companies such as GWR should encourage staff to feel they have the authority to provide endorsements such as this, even for other operators.