Heathrow and BA a disgrace to the country

[DanNCL]

Meanwhile an airport I have come to dislike in a short space of time is BER, the new Berlin Airport, if only because the lounge couldn't be further from security, and you need a drink after the long queues I've experienced there Hopefully a better experience next week.

I experienced the new BER airport for the first time a few days ago, for a new airport it is rather disappointing.
One thing I can recommend at BER airport which makes it much easier is Runway security. It's free of charge, it's a dedicated security area with allocated time slots. You can go on to the BER airport website, enter your departure details and book a slot, then simply show up at the allocated time (up to 10 minutes either side) and you're straight through security without queuing.
Also it's worth buying food and drink before border control if you're catching a non-Schengen flight, as the facilities after border control are limited and overpriced.

Something I'll give BER airport credit for is how organised the ground handling is there, puts Heathrow to shame. The aircraft for my flight was delayed inbound, arriving basically when it should have been departing again. BER already had all the baggage, a pushback tug with a driver and the fuel truck all at the stand ready for the aircraft when it arrived, and it was turned around and out again within half an hour. I know that's common for airlines like Ryanair but for BA a 30 minute turnaround is virtually unheard of!

You have to wonder, then, why BA are removing the G-MEDx series of A321s from their fleet and retaining the G-DBCx series of A319s...

Granted, the A321 is too big to directly replace the A319, but they could easily cascade the 321s onto current 320 services and move the 320s to replace the 319s... too late now, though - those 321s have already left the fleet.

...or did those specific 321s, being ex-BMA themselves, also have the same issue with the cargo holds?

I'm not 100% sure but I think they were refitted, along with the G-MIDx batch of A320s, I think it's only the G-DBCx batch of A319s plus G-MEDK that weren't modified for containerised baggage and therefore were kept away from T5 where possible, first at Gatwick and now at T3. The batch of A321s that BA have had from new (G-EUXx regs) have mostly been replaced by A321neos and moved to Euroflyer at Gatwick, with the remaining examples at Heathrow due to move to Euroflyer in the next few months.

The main reason for keeping the G-DBCx batch of A319s as far as I understand is because of the increasingly urgent need to get rid of the ageing G-EUOx and G-EUPx batches of A319s, which are really starting to show their age and are high on flying hours. I think the plan is eventually to replace them with more A320neos but that's some way off yet.

This is a bit far fetched and extreme, nothing to do with the UK, which whilst no longer the best in the world, still has very good airports. Most people doing International > International and International > Domestic around the world will be subject to security screening when making a connection.

Absolutely. And whilst airport security in many countries is adequate, I think the UK is wise not to trust some of them! And as you've got arrivals from all countries mixed together, because you've got passengers from 'trusted' and 'not trusted' locations mixed, you then have to security screen all of them, so even if the UK did trust security in your origin country it wouldn't make any difference.

 

[cactustwirly]

You have to wonder, then, why BA are removing the G-MEDx series of A321s from their fleet and retaining the G-DBCx series of A319s...

Granted, the A321 is too big to directly replace the A319, but they could easily cascade the 321s onto current 320 services and move the 320s to replace the 319s... too late now, though - those 321s have already left the fleet.

...or did those specific 321s, being ex-BMA themselves, also have the same issue with the cargo holds?

All but 3 are non-standard with the mid haul business class seats.
A321s are expensive to operate from Heathrow because of the noise charges, that's why only 2 A321s are at Heathrow, the majority of which are now Gatwick based.

The G-DBCx A319s are a few years newer than the EUP/O A319s so are being kept as they have a newer cockpit and less flying hours

 

[Butts]

I have around 40 BA Flights under my belt this year, mainly from Edinburgh to somewhere in Europe via Heathrow and back.

The experience normally starts with a complimentary Breakfast in the BA Lounge at Edinburgh having whizzed through Security utilising Fast Track.

I then exit the Airport at T5 for a cigarette or two as there are no smoking facilities.

Going back in utilising The First Wing for a smooth security experience which leads straight into the Galleries First Lounge for more complimentary booze and eats.

I then join my second flight to wherever I am going, having half inched a can of Heineken and packet of crisps to be consumed in my Free Exit Seat on the flight to my onward destination. This acts as a substitute for the parsimonious offering in ET of a 10g pack of pretzels and a bottle of water.

During the course of my flight my Duty Free Bensons will be delivered to my seat having pre-ordered them from the BA Highlife Shop online.

On the return journey Fast Track Security and Lounge Access in the Foreign Airport will be part of the package. Often there will be smoking facilities in the Lounge itself or nearby. On arrival at LHR I reverse the process of the inward journey nipping out for a ciggie before going back in via The First Wing and Lounge to join my flight to EDI.

I normally book a package via BA Holidays for around £300 to £400 for the flights and 2 or 3 Nights in a half decent Hotel.

I have had delays and cancellations but BAH have a special number to contact in the event of difficulties which is normally answered promptly and a solution proffered. I've had a few free "Holiday Extensions" this way. My biggest gripe is the lack of smoking facilities at T5 and EDI come to that.

On the odd occasion my trips have involved departures from T3 a whole world of Lounges opens up in addition to BA's. Namely Qantas, AA 1st Class Lounge and the Cathay Pacific one as well. If you have the time you can do a tour free of charge.

BA opens the world up from Edinburgh at reasonable prices.

 

[306024]

I experienced the new BER airport for the first time a few days ago, for a new airport it is rather disappointing.
One thing I can recommend at BER airport which makes it much easier is Runway security. It's free of charge, it's a dedicated security area with allocated time slots. You can go on to the BER airport website, enter your departure details and book a slot, then simply show up at the allocated time (up to 10 minutes either side) and you're straight through security without queuing.
Also it's worth buying food and drink before border control if you're catching a non-Schengen flight, as the facilities after border control are limited and overpriced.

I learnt both of those the hard way! Security booked this time already, it will be interesting to see how they match supply to demand. I wonder what the rate of ‘no shows’ is for pre-booked security.

Meanwhile back at Heathrow an Italian guy I was talking too last week didn’t rate the food in the BA lounge. Perfectly fine for me so I guess a lot of this is just down to personal preference.

 

[Butts]

I learnt both of those the hard way! Security booked this time already, it will be interesting to see how they match supply to demand. I wonder what the rate of ‘no shows’ is for pre-booked security.

Meanwhile back at Heathrow an Italian guy I was talking too last week didn’t rate the food in the BA lounge. Perfectly fine for me so I guess a lot of this is just down to personal preference.

Be honest it is a bit like school dinners, but the cheese is okay and the ice cream tubs before they disappeared recently.

More importantly Talisker Surge is available on tap.

 

[cactustwirly]

I have around 40 BA Flights under my belt this year, mainly from Edinburgh to somewhere in Europe via Heathrow and back.

The experience normally starts with a complimentary Breakfast in the BA Lounge at Edinburgh having whizzed through Security utilising Fast Track.

I then exit the Airport at T5 for a cigarette or two as there are no smoking facilities.

Going back in utilising The First Wing for a smooth security experience which leads straight into the Galleries First Lounge for more complimentary booze and eats.

I then join my second flight to wherever I am going, having half inched a can of Heineken and packet of crisps to be consumed in my Free Exit Seat on the flight to my onward destination. This acts as a substitute for the parsimonious offering in ET of a 10g pack of pretzels and a bottle of water.

During the course of my flight my Duty Free Bensons will be delivered to my seat having pre-ordered them from the BA Highlife Shop online.

On the return journey Fast Track Security and Lounge Access in the Foreign Airport will be part of the package. Often there will be smoking facilities in the Lounge itself or nearby. On arrival at LHR I reverse the process of the inward journey nipping out for a ciggie before going back in via The First Wing and Lounge to join my flight to EDI.

I normally book a package via BA Holidays for around £300 to £400 for the flights and 2 or 3 Nights in a half decent Hotel.

I have had delays and cancellations but BAH have a special number to contact in the event of difficulties which is normally answered promptly and a solution proffered. I've had a few free "Holiday Extensions" this way. My biggest gripe is the lack of smoking facilities at T5 and EDI come to that.

On the odd occasion my trips have involved departures from T3 a whole world of Lounges opens up in addition to BA's. Namely Qantas, AA 1st Class Lounge and the Cathay Pacific one as well. If you have the time you can do a tour free of charge.

BA opens the world up from Edinburgh at reasonable prices.

It's now a handmade Cotswolds flapjack in ET

 

[AlterEgo]

Why can overseas airports manage security efficiently but the UK cannot? Not trusting India to provide an adequate security check and having to go through the whole palaver again at Heathrow and risking people missing flights as a result is just old-fashioned racism against a country which in many ways is more technologically advanced than the UK now.

Indian airport security is absolutely well below par. Frustrating and inefficient and mostly managed by the CISF. It’s not racist to point that out. Indians will tell you that themselves.

India also has a very high terror threat level towards its airport infrastructure. I’m not surprised that most developed countries don’t “trust” it and insist on rescreening passengers.

 

[Neptune]

My experiences of BA are that they are poor at best and have never met minimum expectations.

My 2 long haul flights with them have both had major issues.

On my first flight they diverted a case from Heathrow due to students going to Leeds having so many cases that they paid extra for. They said we hadn’t paid for ours and that their cases were priority due to the contents which was why ours was sent elsewhere. When I tried to explain that I had paid for it as it was in the cost of the ticket and that they couldn’t possibly claim that the contents of ours were unimportant as they didn’t know what was in our cases they told me that I was being rude and unfair. They also didn’t appreciate that I was tired after 17 hours on a cramped 747 followed by the usual Heathrow delay. We had to approach them to find out what happened too, no announcement to inform us that our case was not there which they would have known surely. We were eventually reunited with the case 3 weeks later, it went to that place famously 3 weeks from where we live, Newcastle! No apology, no recompense.

On giving them a second chance we encountered delays at Manchester due to a mechanical fault on the inbound flight. This resulted in a missed connection at Heathrow meaning we were 5 hours late at destination. On reply to my claim they said it was due to the weather which was a complete lie so I appealed, lost that and went to the ombudsman and won. They seem really cramped compared to other carriers too. I couldn’t eat on one flight due to the person in front reclining their seat all the way back (it was a Dreamliner). When I explained to the steward why I was unable to eat due to the tray table being unable to lie flat (and I aren’t a large person) the steward didn’t bother to ask the person in front to help out by moving their seat forward a bit, they just said that I was missing out on and nice meal and moved on without saying anything else. Plus I just hate Heathrow. I’ve flown through most of the worlds major hubs and non is as bad as that bearpit. T5 is absolutely soulless and always feels overcrowded.

Will never use them again.

From Manchester I can use Virgin who are decent or the American carriers. Going east and I’ve used Singapore and Qantas who were both very good.

From LBA I can fly to the hubs at Dublin and Amsterdam, far superior airports with far superior carriers. For America Delta are best for me but AA and United are still fine and Aer Lingus are also excellent from Dublin.

Entertainment-wise I just watch things I’ve downloaded on Netflix or Prime and for music I have Spotify. I’ll always scan what’s on the IFE and sometimes there’s something worth watching.

No, never understand the BA love in, they are the worst carrier I’ve ever used including the low cost carriers who at least always meet my expectations.

 

[Wolfie]

Another factor of the experience I didn't mention was that my wife has an assistance lanyard, but the woman policing the long security queue said I couldn't accompany her through the speedy channel which rather loses the point if we have to separate. Our major British airports are shabby and they clearly will not grasp the nettle and completely rebuild, we have lots of patched-up "improvements". Chennai has a beautiful new airport, so does Muscat in Oman, and Doha is pretty good for its huge size.

We flew back with BA throughout precisely because if we missed a connecting flight they couldn't shrug and say it was our fault. Flying with a scheduled European national airline used to be a privilege, now it's an embarrassment and worse than a budget carrier I am told Lufthansa is just as bad. WE have flown with most of the Middle East airlines and the food, service, comfort and entertainment have been good to excellent in every case.

Why can overseas airports manage security efficiently but the UK cannot? Not trusting India to provide an adequate security check and having to go through the whole palaver again at Heathrow and risking people missing flights as a result is just old-fashioned racism against a country which in many ways is more technologically advanced than the UK now.

We flew from Edinburgh earlier in the year and that was pleasant and competent with polite officials, so sometimes it can be OK.

Re your penultimate paragraph let's just say that there are very good reasons which you will, quite rightly, never be told. It might involve information exchanged in confidence and/or obtained by sensitive means.

The UK doesn't trust any other nation's security. While you may be able to complain about British exceptionalism in this case, it's a bit much to call it racism when it affects all nations and races.

Not entirely true but very definitely the case that it is done case by case on a risk assessed basis.

Indian airport security is absolutely well below par. Frustrating and inefficient and mostly managed by the CISF. It’s not racist to point that out. Indians will tell you that themselves.

India also has a very high terror threat level towards its airport infrastructure. I’m not surprised that most developed countries don’t “trust” it and insist on rescreening passengers.

Absolutely, and has been recognised as such by both the Indian government and media.

 

[johncrossley]

I have around 40 BA Flights under my belt this year, mainly from Edinburgh to somewhere in Europe via Heathrow and back.

Are you counting a return trip involving a change in Heathrow as four flights?

 

[Bald Rick]

Agree about BA.

Disagree about Heathrow. Its fine. busy, but fine.

 

[cactustwirly]

I don't get the BA hate personally, Wizz, Ryanair and easyJet are worse.
The punctuality isn't bang on but I've rarely been delayed by more than an hour.
The planes are clean and the seats are comfortable

 

[DanNCL]

I learnt both of those the hard way! Security booked this time already, it will be interesting to see how they match supply to demand. I wonder what the rate of ‘no shows’ is for pre-booked security.

They have a screen straight outside the Runway Security area showing how many spaces there were still free for each slot, alternating between English and German. There were 60-something free for my slot as well as the two slots either side of it, so I think usage (possibly knowledge?) of it is low.

My 2 long haul flights with them have both had major issues.

On my first flight they diverted a case from Heathrow due to students going to Leeds having so many cases that they paid extra for. They said we hadn’t paid for ours and that their cases were priority due to the contents which was why ours was sent elsewhere. When I tried to explain that I had paid for it as it was in the cost of the ticket and that they couldn’t possibly claim that the contents of ours were unimportant as they didn’t know what was in our cases they told me that I was being rude and unfair. They also didn’t appreciate that I was tired after 17 hours on a cramped 747 followed by the usual Heathrow delay. We had to approach them to find out what happened too, no announcement to inform us that our case was not there which they would have known surely. We were eventually reunited with the case 3 weeks later, it went to that place famously 3 weeks from where we live, Newcastle! No apology, no recompense.

On giving them a second chance we encountered delays at Manchester due to a mechanical fault on the inbound flight. This resulted in a missed connection at Heathrow meaning we were 5 hours late at destination. On reply to my claim they said it was due to the weather which was a complete lie so I appealed, lost that and went to the ombudsman and won. They seem really cramped compared to other carriers too. I couldn’t eat on one flight due to the person in front reclining their seat all the way back (it was a Dreamliner). When I explained to the steward why I was unable to eat due to the tray table being unable to lie flat (and I aren’t a large person) the steward didn’t bother to ask the person in front to help out by moving their seat forward a bit, they just said that I was missing out on and nice meal and moved on without saying anything else. Plus I just hate Heathrow. I’ve flown through most of the worlds major hubs and non is as bad as that bearpit. T5 is absolutely soulless and always feels overcrowded.

Will never use them again.

You've had two very poor and very unusual experiences. Thankfully neither are the norm. Indeed, the 747s have now gone, and there is now a policy that luggage will travel on the same flight as the passenger, circumstances where that doesn't happen are incredibly rare. They definitely wouldn't send your luggage to a different airport now, worst case scenario now it would be on a later flight to your destination but even that is very rare.
The Dreamliner is a poor offering but that's an issue with the aircraft type rather than the airline, 787s with the other airlines are just as cramped in economy, even on Qatar and Etihad.
I can understand why you wouldn't want to use BA again but I can assure you that what you experienced isn't the norm and that you were incredibly unlucky.

No, never understand the BA love in, they are the worst carrier I’ve ever used including the low cost carriers who at least always meet my expectations.

Part of the issue with some people being disappointed by BA is that they turn up expecting it to be like the Middle East carriers. If you expect it to be like Emirates or Qatar you're going to be disappointed. But they're leagues ahead of the likes of Easy Jet who will happily abandon you the second things go even slightly wrong.

Not entirely true but very definitely the case that it is done case by case on a risk assessed basis.

As far as flight connections at Heathrow go everywhere that isn't in one of the four UK nations (including CTA destinations in Ireland and the Channel Islands) has to be treated as 'not trusted' as arriving passengers from all international destinations mix. The CAA have got their own list but for the purposes of flight connections all have to be treated as 'not trusted'.

The punctuality isn't bang on but I've rarely been delayed by more than an hour.

The worst I've had was 5 hours and a diversion. But to give BA some credit for that, that was down to a fire at Newcastle Airport which shut the airport completely, and every other airline chose to cancel their flights instead of diverting to Teesside which is only 40 miles south!

 

[Tetchytyke]

They have a screen straight outside the Runway Security area showing how many spaces there were still free for each slot, alternating between English and German. There were 60-something free for my slot as well as the two slots either side of it, so I think usage (possibly knowledge?) of it is low.

It must also be a relatively new development. When I was at BER last year it didn’t exist as an option except as “fast track” for premium customers. The normal BER security line was an absolute zoo, far far worse than anything you see even at Manchester.

If you expect it to be like Emirates or Qatar you're going to be disappointed

Emirates do good advertising, but in reality no amount of gold-style paint will stop a 10-abreast 777 being an absolutely awful experience.

 

[Neptune]

You've had two very poor and very unusual experiences. Thankfully neither are the norm. Indeed, the 747s have now gone, and there is now a policy that luggage will travel on the same flight as the passenger, circumstances where that doesn't happen are incredibly rare. They definitely wouldn't send your luggage to a different airport now, worst case scenario now it would be on a later flight to your destination but even that is very rare.
The Dreamliner is a poor offering but that's an issue with the aircraft type rather than the airline, 787s with the other airlines are just as cramped in economy, even on Qatar and Etihad.
I can understand why you wouldn't want to use BA again but I can assure you that what you experienced isn't the norm and that you were incredibly unlucky.

Yes the reason I gave them a second chance was due to fact that the 747’s were gone and the luggage policy seemed to have changed. However the second occasion we were delayed by something which was down to BA and they lied to us as they didn’t want to pay out (they had to once I got a third party involved). The only other airline that has blatantly lied to me due to a delay that was their fault is Air Canada so I simply won’t use them again either. I can cope with many things and am prepared to give second chances but the second I’m lied to then that’s last chance gone.

Part of the issue with some people being disappointed by BA is that they turn up expecting it to be like the Middle East carriers. If you expect it to be like Emirates or Qatar you're going to be disappointed. But they're leagues ahead of the likes of Easy Jet who will happily abandon you the second things go even slightly wrong.

I never expect them to be like the Middle East carriers. I compare them more to comparable carriers like American Airlines and they don’t even come close to them in any way shape or form.

They may be leagues ahead of EasyJet but it’s a low bar having to compare the national carrier to a low cost airline. For what it’s worth I have flown dozens of times with Jet 2 and EasyJet and in times of disruption they have always set a higher bar than BA for me.

 

[Butts]

Are you counting a return trip involving a change in Heathrow as four flights?

Yes, because it is !!

It's now a handmade Cotswolds flapjack in ET

The size of a matchbox ?

 

[Airline Man]

The answer is that the UK has no control over the level of security checks carried out in other countries. Each country has their own standards so international transfer passengers have to go through UK security as do UK originating passengers transferring flights in other countries.

UK Domestic passengers don't have to go through security at T5 as they’ve already cleared security at the starting off point.

 

[Bald Rick]

I don't get the BA hate personally, Wizz, Ryanair and easyJet are worse.

I agree about Ryanair, and have never flown Wizz so can‘t comment. However easyjet knocks spots off BA in my experience.

My dislike of BA is not the aircraft, nor the fying experience generally, but the customer service at the airport / back office. They have screwed me over every time I’ve flown with them this century, and when I have complained via their website (every time) they have not repsonded at first, had to be chased, and then offered a completely inadequate apology / compensation arrangement. And then not repsonded when chased again.

Just useless.

In around 50 flights with EZY this century they have screwed up twice, both times resolved immediately, and in one case significnatly exceeding my compensation expectations.

 

[Clayton]

BA are fine, certainly better than the low cost carriers. I just read a book and take a sandwich.

 

[Neptune]

I’m hearing plenty of people comparing BA favourably with the low cost carriers who they’re not really in competition with but nobody seems to want to compare them to direct competitors such as AA, Virgin, Qantas etc…. Is that because they can’t compete with these carriers?

As I said before, if we have to use the low cost carriers as a bar to make favourable comments about BA then it is quite damning to say the least.

As I’ve said, I’ve used them twice and had appalling customer service including being lied to, allowed to suffer discomfort when complaining on board for what I can only explain as fear of upsetting the person in front of me who turned their seat in front to a flat bed on my lap, a case which seemingly went on a world tour to travel 100 miles home, self inflicted heavy delays which they tried to worm out of recompensing and a general feeling of not giving a damn. As an economy or Premium economy passenger I still expect a decent level of customer service which I’ve never had.

Only Air Canada have come close to this rubbishness of not wanting to pay for a self inflicted delay although their onboard staff were excellent and attentive.

AA, Aer Lingus, Virgin Atlantic, Air France, KLM, Delta, United, Thomas Cook and TUI who I’ve also used for trans Atlantic flights are all far superior. Any issues on flights with these carriers were resolved and the only other firm I’ve needed recompense from for a heavy delay are TUI who automatically paid me whilst I was in the air. No issues whatsoever.

Oh yes and the low cost carriers BA fans love to compare them to have always met my expectations and if any recompense was needed (only once each with EasyJet and Jet2) it was paid, no qualms and more importantly no lying to try and squirm out of paying up and forcing me to go through a third party wasting all our times.

 

[superalbs]

It sounds great in principle but you lose the significant benefit of through-ticketing, so if BA is late from Manchester and causes you to miss a BA connection, that’s BA’s issue to solve. If the train is late, then that’s your issue and it could get costly…

You only lose that benefit if you choose to lose it.

HS2 to Heathrow could always allocate flight numbers to trains, a practice already done in Germany (among quite a few others).

 

[cactustwirly]

I’m hearing plenty of people comparing BA favourably with the low cost carriers who they’re not really in competition with but nobody seems to want to compare them to direct competitors such as AA, Virgin, Qantas etc…. Is that because they can’t compete with these carriers?

As I said before, if we have to use the low cost carriers as a bar to make favourable comments about BA then it is quite damning to say the least.

As I’ve said, I’ve used them twice and had appalling customer service including being lied to, allowed to suffer discomfort when complaining on board for what I can only explain as fear of upsetting the person in front of me who turned their seat in front to a flat bed on my lap, a case which seemingly went on a world tour to travel 100 miles home, self inflicted heavy delays which they tried to worm out of recompensing and a general feeling of not giving a damn. As an economy or Premium economy passenger I still expect a decent level of customer service which I’ve never had.

Only Air Canada have come close to this rubbishness of not wanting to pay for a self inflicted delay although their onboard staff were excellent and attentive.

AA, Aer Lingus, Virgin Atlantic, Air France, KLM, Delta, United, Thomas Cook and TUI who I’ve also used for trans Atlantic flights are all far superior. Any issues on flights with these carriers were resolved and the only other firm I’ve needed recompense from for a heavy delay are TUI who automatically paid me whilst I was in the air. No issues whatsoever.

Oh yes and the low cost carriers BA fans love to compare them to have always met my expectations and if any recompense was needed (only once each with EasyJet and Jet2) it was paid, no qualms and more importantly no lying to try and squirm out of paying up and forcing me to go through a third party wasting all our times.

Since when have AA and Virgin Atlantic flown on short haul routes across Europe?

 

[Neptune]

Since when have AA and Virgin Atlantic flown on short haul routes across Europe?

If you read what I said I compared the carriers that I have flown transatlantic with as that’s my main BA experience. All of them beat BA for me on the overall experience.

However if we want to compare the domestic bits I’ve done with BA (LBA and Manchester - Heathrow and return for connections) then I will compare them with domestic American flights of a similar length (for instance San Francisco - LAX or Boston to New York). I have flown United, Delta, Jet Blue, Alaska and South West and again all of these left a better impression than BA on these routes as these short hauls are where I had the biggest issues with BA.

What I’m saying with regard to comparing BA with easyJet, Ryanair, Wizzair etc…. it is setting BA a very low bar to beat to prove that they are a superior carrier. However my experience is to the contrary.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I’m hearing plenty of people comparing BA favourably with the low cost carriers who they’re not really in competition with but nobody seems to want to compare them to direct competitors such as AA, Virgin, Qantas etc…. Is that because they can’t compete with these carriers?

BA’s short-haul market is competing with Ryanair and EasyJet and the likes.

BA’s long-haul market is competing with Qantas, Virgin, etc.

Most airlines are terrible when things go wrong. During Covid Virgin were the slowest of the lot to process refunds. Qantas is in quite a lot of bother in Australia for selling tickets for flights they’d already cancelled, and then refusing refunds. And it’s always worth remembering you lose protection if you fly with a non-UK airline as EU/UK261 doesn’t apply on their flights to the UK.

My experience of EasyJet is that, during disruption, you can’t speak to anyone. But if you sort yourself out they’re good to pay out. During the UK ATC issues in August I had to take a ferry back home and EasyJet had refunded my ferry fare within a week. Can’t say fairer than that.

 

[Bald Rick]

I’m hearing plenty of people comparing BA favourably with the low cost carriers who they’re not really in competition with

BA are very much in competition with low cost carriers across most of the main UK - Europe flows.

What they can offer, which easyjet etc can‘t (or at least, not easily) is a wealth of connections across the world, and particualrly North America. I think they have the most destinations in North America of any non-US carrier, and with relatively dtraigthforward connections through T5 that must make it attractive for much of europe.

 

[nlogax]

In my experience BA are.. fine. Certainly nothing to write home about. Long-haul they get the job done as best they can. Short haul feels a little less robust at times and if you're not wedded to EC and tier points then you may as well go for a competing low-cost carrier, there's precious little to differentiate them. I've done First on BA just once and wouldn't consider it again if I had to pay full whack. It's not worth the money when Club Suites exist and are being rolled out to A380s and 777s.

A few high points;

- T5 takes the edge off if you're departing or connecting through LHR and are able to use B-gates Club lounge. A-gates Club lounges are ridiculously busy and looking pretty shabby, imo not worth bothering with. Also T5 arrivals are speedy (if your flight is lucky enough to get to its gate on time) and Border Control e-gates are plentiful.
- LCY flights are *really* good and I personally find them extremely convenient for work purposes. E190s are great little planes and the whole CityFlyer experience feels quite set apart from 'core' BA.
- WT+ seems to have improved a fair bit and I'll happily use it for most long haul daytime flights. Good cheap(ish) way of racking up the points and miles and you don't emerge from your seat resembling a piece of flat-pack furniture at your destination.

Big low points are when things go dramatically wrong. One recent experience would be flying in to LHR from Berlin (BER was fine btw, I quite like it). Arrived at T5 early evening, IT failure had knocked out all departing flights and the customer service queue was a mile long. BA had barely any staff and zero answers.. I ended up renting a car and driving to Scotland that night.

 

[306024]

That's a fairer assessment based on my experience. I'd describe BA as the Ford Focus of Flying these days. Certainly LCY every time if the price differential isn't significant.

Meanwhile BER has gone up in my ranking. Pre-booked security was fine, friendly even!

 

[cactustwirly]

I treat BA like easyJet plus, basically the same service but more comfortable seats and a better luggage allowance.
Also the boarding experience is less stressful, it's more relaxed and you don't get the hand baggage gestapo at the gates.

The fares from Gatwick are very reasonable and only slightly more than easyJet

 

[RailWonderer]

Some exhaustive responses here but I'll add mine. It isn't BA necessarily but the fact Heathrow is over capacity and many flights have to circle so they are dealyed in and out of Heathrow, leading to knock on delays. There was also some short staffing which seems to have improved, having used BA at T5 a few times so far this year. Customs queues not a problem outside of the summer peaks.

You have to wonder, then, why BA are removing the G-MEDx series of A321s from their fleet and retaining the G-DBCx series of A319s...

Granted, the A321 is too big to directly replace the A319, but they could easily cascade the 321s onto current 320 services and move the 320s to replace the 319s... too late now, though - those 321s have already left the fleet.

...or did those specific 321s, being ex-BMA themselves, also have the same issue with the cargo holds?

BA have 8 A321 neos on order, 11 A320neos, 2 more A350s as well as 777-9s and 787-10s for long haul.

 

[Chester1]

I have only flown with BA once because it is London Airways and serves most of the UK badly. The only time I used BA was for work on a corporate booking. My local airport is Manchester and there is no point flying to Heathrow for any destination served by Manchester, which is a large number. Even when a stopover is required BA has never been the cheapest option.