Heathrow Express travellers defecting to Elizabeth line

[island]

An article in today's Times reveals that Heathrow Express revenue is still a third down on the corresponding period of 2019, which it is attributing to travellers switching to the Elizabeth line. More power to them.

The Times & The Sunday Times

News and opinion from The Times & The Sunday Times

www.thetimes.co.uk

Filings reveal that Heathrow Express, which offers a 15-minute service between London Paddington and Heathrow, has failed to recover to pre-pandemic levels despite flight volumes at the airport returning to near-normal. Heathrow said revenues from Heathrow Express in the first three months of the year were £22 million.

This is an official "share" link provided to me as a subscriber which should open the article directly without a Paywall.

 

[43066]

Is anyone remotely surprised? I’d bet money it’ll be gone within a few years…

 

[zwk500]

Hardly a surprise - getting a seat direct to Central London or Canary Wharf will be attractive even to business travellers.

Will be interesting to see what the responses are - my understanding is that the HEX paths couldn't be easily reallocated to GWR services as they follow trains that Stop at Slough or Maidenhead, and get caught up at Reading by the following fast.

 

[islandmonkey]

Good. What a rip off. Only to be beaten in Europe by the Arlanda Express for rip-off prices.

 

[davetheguard]

Good. What a rip off. Only to be beaten in Europe by the Arlanda Express for rip-off prices.

And the Edinburgh tram to the airport? And the new Luton Airport thingy?

Why should people have to pay a premium just because they happen to be going to an airport anyway?

 

[Gaelan]

And the Edinburgh tram to the airport? And the new Luton Airport thingy?

Both ridiculous, but still far, far cheaper than the Heathrow Express!

Why should people have to pay a premium just because they happen to be going to an airport anyway?

Because they know they can get away with it, is the cynical answer at least.

 

[davetheguard]

Both ridiculous, but still far, far cheaper than the Heathrow Express!

I remember several years ago talking to the Guard on a train in Switzerland. He had just retuned from a trip to London, and even with the strength of the Swiss Franc against the pound was complaining how much a trip on Hex had cost him!

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

I wonder whether there's anything stopping them from charging for the presently free inter-terminal transfers. Presumably Heathrow Airport must pay TfL some amount for this free travel area. Not good optics admittedly but they could force use of a bus.

Individual airlines could negotiate with Heathrow Express to have the transfers included for their passengers etc. Much in the same way that several elite tier airline loyalty schemes allow complimentary first class Heathrow Express travel etc.

Probably a tiny drop in the ocean in terms of revenue impact though.

I'm not convinced it's all Elizabeth line though - business travel simply hasn't recovered to the same level as leisure - and is unlikely to - I suspect that this is mainly because of some recallibration post COVID.

HEX won't go - a premium, world class airport (allegedly) does need that premium link into London. HS2 calling there would have been an interesting scenario too.

 

[Acton1991]

As evident in the morning peak (that corresponds with the peak arrivals at LHR), the Elizabeth line is absolutely chockablock with passengers and their luggage, so I am not surprised!

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Why should people have to pay a premium just because they happen to be going to an airport anyway?

Because the loans to build the thing have to be repaid.
No government money was involved in the Heathrow Express project, same as the Channel Tunnel or various new bridges, or M6 Toll.
And in the case of HEx they were the "faster" option (still are to some destinations).
Heathrow Airport takes an access toll even if you arrive on the Elizabeth Line.

 

[43066]

Why should people have to pay a premium just because they happen to be going to an airport anyway?

Nobody has to pay for any of these methods; other forms of transport are available!

History has shown that people are often willing to pay a premium for a service which is quicker or more convenient than the alternatives - and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. The problem is that, just as many of us expected, EL is proving a good substitute for HEX, to the point where many no longer consider the premium worth it.

 

[Sealink]

Is anyone remotely surprised? I’d bet money it’ll be gone within a few years…

They got rid of lovely trains with an amazing First Class... (Which was pricy)


I think Gatwick Express should be consigned to history too.

And the Stansted Express renamed to remove the word Express

And the Edinburgh tram to the airport? And the new Luton Airport thingy?

Why should people have to pay a premium just because they happen to be going to an airport anyway?

I read somewhere that people are buying tickets to the stop before the airport (Ingliston?) where it is an easy walk to Edinburgh Airport

 

[fandroid]

Is anyone remotely surprised? I’d bet money it’ll be gone within a few years…

Heathrow Airport Limited "only" received £22 million from Heathrow Express during Jan to Mar this year. While they may be disappointed, they're not going to throw that cash cow away while customers are willing to pay, as they seem to be. Remember that their main customer base was always assumed to be those who would take taxis anyway, and are doing it to/from Paddington rather than direct to/from Heathrow

 

[Grumpy]

Is anyone remotely surprised? I’d bet money it’ll be gone within a few years…

Well that would free up a couple of platforms. Paddington presumably must have other capacity as a result of the Elizabeth line taking much of the suburban traffic. So dont bother with Old Oak Common and Euston, simply run HS2 trains into Paddington. Save £ billions

 

[Samzino]

Please don't entertain any more farcical HS2 changes. Literally wouldn't be surprised any somewhat sounding ideas will suddenly reach the wrong person with the right power

 

[Gaelan]

Nobody has to pay for any of these methods; other forms of transport are available!

Although it’s not a fully informed decision - at least the last time I was there (before EL through running), all the prominent signage (“Direct trains to London!”) pointed HX-ward - to get anywhere else, you’d need to know beforehand what to look for.

 

[Revilo]

And the Edinburgh tram to the airport? And the new Luton Airport thingy?

Why should people have to pay a premium just because they happen to be going to an airport anyway?

Supply and demand. If enough people pay the higher prices to make it profitable then someone will provide it

 

[miklcct]

Although it’s not a fully informed decision - at least the last time I was there (before EL through running), all the prominent signage (“Direct trains to London!”) pointed HX-ward - to get anywhere else, you’d need to know beforehand what to look for.

Most transport providers have big ads at Luton Airport, including EMR, Thameslink for trains, and National Express and Green Line for buses, so everyone is fully informed.

 

[Samzino]

Hex will always use the same argument that was there before the Lizzy line when it was questioned against the Piccadilly line of which was that it was said to compete with Black Cabbies to Heathrow both in pricing, ease of use and timing. Whilst the Elizabeth line has its pros its been notoriously unreliable for some time after the whole central core running which if the signaling issues that are an ongoing issue aren't fixed will get worse when the Shenfield trains(which were already one of the biggest causes of the delays) end up on all 3 signal systems in May as the line bolsters up to 24 trains an hour with Shenfield's running past Paddington to Heathrow and co.

It all depends honestly on the traveler, I personally already plan my journeys that include traveling fees, when you've just had a long haul flight in after delays etc you're most likely looking for a bit of comfort and somewhere to store luggage and a journey into London that is as fast as possible if need be. Ofc if you have time to burn, don't mind possibly sharing a train that will start getting packed up into Paddington and need to go past London towards Canary Wharf, stratford etc then the Elizabeth Line makes more sense price and comfort wise as you'll be seated at least well before Paddington.

All depends, doubt HEX is going anywhere too soon.

 

[alistairlees]

Is this correct for return travel prices (no railcard):
- Elizabeth Line £24.40 (two £12.20 singles)
- Heathrow Express £11.00 to £37.00 (depending on when booked / availability - two £5.50 singles to a £37.00 return)
- Underground £11.20 (two £5.60 singles)

 

[jdxn]

Hardly a surprise - getting a seat direct to Central London or Canary Wharf will be attractive even to business travellers.

Will be interesting to see what the responses are - my understanding is that the HEX paths couldn't be easily reallocated to GWR services as they follow trains that Stop at Slough or Maidenhead, and get caught up at Reading by the following fast.

Not an issue after the May timetable change.
Almost all the stops on the mains have gone at Slough.

 

[3RDGEN]

Two further Elizabeth Line Heathrow services per hour from May timetable change to come too.

 

[Failed Unit]

Hex will always use the same argument that was there before the Lizzy line when it was questioned against the Piccadilly line of which was that it was said to compete with Black Cabbies to Heathrow both in pricing, ease of use and timing. Whilst the Elizabeth line has its pros its been notoriously unreliable for some time after the whole central core running which if the signaling issues that are an ongoing issue aren't fixed will get worse when the Shenfield trains(which were already one of the biggest causes of the delays) end up on all 3 signal systems in May as the line bolsters up to 24 trains an hour with Shenfield's running past Paddington to Heathrow and co.

It all depends honestly on the traveler, I personally already plan my journeys that include traveling fees, when you've just had a long haul flight in after delays etc you're most likely looking for a bit of comfort and somewhere to store luggage and a journey into London that is as fast as possible if need be. Ofc if you have time to burn, don't mind possibly sharing a train that will start getting packed up into Paddington and need to go past London towards Canary Wharf, stratford etc then the Elizabeth Line makes more sense price and comfort wise as you'll be seated at least well before Paddington.

All depends, doubt HEX is going anywhere too soon.

I do agree with your concerns, the over-crowding is a problem (A nice one to have) - lets see how going to every 15 minutes (t4) helps the Elizabeth line.

But I have use the HeX for the last time, not only because of price but also speed.

Using Hex,
Hex to Paddington
Walk to Hammersmith and City line
Tube to Kings Cross
Train to Welwyn Garden City.

(I could also Tube to Finsbury Park which can feel to take about the same time if I get a bad transfer from Paddington)

Now,
Train to Farringdon / Liverpool street
Train to Welwyn Garden City.

The journey is much quicker and less trouble. Farringdon is easier to change at as the walk at Moorgate feels long, but is OK.

I am sure readers can give many example where they can get to their destination with a single change now. We may not be the target customers for HeX, but I can’t see anyone that can now do a single change at Farringdon / Liverpool Street going back to HeX.

Will it go, probably not, will it remain at every 15 mins, probably no either.

 

[lachlan]

Presumably if Heathrow Express isn’t gone by the time HS2 opens, it will push even more passengers towards Crossrail thanks to the easy interchange at Old Oak Common

 

[miklcct]

Heathrow Express remains the fastest way to go to my local station (Cricklewood) by changing a bus from Paddington, but the alternative of boarding the Elizabeth line at Acton comes not far behind. The reason is because going via Farringdon is a huge detour.

 

[zwk500]

Not an issue after the May timetable change.
Almost all the stops on the mains have gone at Slough.

Ooh that's interesting, do you know then if the HEX paths would be able to be used by GWR for something long-distance?

 

[JonathanH]

Not an issue after the May timetable change.
Almost all the stops on the mains have gone at Slough.

Ooh that's interesting, do you know then if the HEX paths would be able to be used by GWR for something long-distance?

No, because even though the Didcot trains will actually stop on the reliefs at Slough, the path is still needed to get them from the main to the relief at Dolphin Junction (at 40mph).

Some of the Maidenhead calls on the peak services are on the main, with the crossing at Ruscombe. There are also a small number of fast line calls at Twyford on services towards Newbury.

Finally, there are still 110mph workings to Newbury.

Therefore, the utility of having the Heathrow services branching off is still being well used.

 

[Horizon22]

No, because even though the Didcot trains will actually stop on the reliefs at Slough, the path is still needed to get them from the main to the relief at Dolphin Junction (at 40mph).

Those paths are the former Bristol semi-fast services.

Theoretically if HEX was to go, the fast paths could be used for something else. Although HEX will only go once Heathrow Airport Limited (HAL) decide it is no longer in their interests / profitable to run. Despite the downturn, I would suggest we are not at that stage yet. Although anything that drives it in that direction should be welcomed.

What will be an issue is overcrowding for stations Hayes - Acton Main Line otherwise; this is more for speculative discussion but the Relief line has no more capacity so you'd need to try and find a way to get trains into the Crossrail core but run on the Main Line if HEX disappeared - an awkward crossover is the only way to do that at somewhere like Ladbroke Grove.

Is this correct for return travel prices (no railcard):
- Elizabeth Line £24.40 (two £12.20 singles)
- Heathrow Express £11.00 to £37.00 (depending on when booked / availability - two £5.50 singles to a £37.00 return)
- Underground £11.20 (two £5.60 singles)

From where?

Heathrow Airport Limited "only" received £22 million from Heathrow Express during Jan to Mar this year. While they may be disappointed, they're not going to throw that cash cow away while customers are willing to pay, as they seem to be. Remember that their main customer base was always assumed to be those who would take taxis anyway, and are doing it to/from Paddington rather than direct to/from Heathrow

Revenue, not profit of course. Although they own the infrastructure in the tunnels so there's a big track access charge not required!

Your high-flyer business types still might take HeX and a taxi anyway (although direct to Canary Wharf is not to be sniffed at), but the average traveller will probably enjoy the convenience, pricing and only slight time disbenefit otherwise.

 

[JonathanH]

Those paths are the former Bristol semi-fast services.

Didcot is only xx13 / xx43 off-peak. At other times, the slower workings are still timed in front of a Heathrow service.

 

[alistairlees]

From where?

London Paddington.