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Is there any point running train services on some lines at present

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deltic

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With passenger numbers down by 95% and lots of picture of empty trains is it worth mothballing some lines. For example, the mid Cheshire line from Manchester to Chester is now down to 2hrly which doesnt seem very useful for essential workers. Given the low numbers it would probably be cheaper to just run taxis as and when required on some routes.

Are there any routes which are carrying no-one at present?
 
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Ianno87

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I’d argue any, semi-frequent, service is useful for essential workers.

Although it's probably at the point on some routes where providing a taxi for every key worker using the train is probably cheaper, and also exposes individuals to less risk overall.

Casually watching Ipswich-Cambridge trains pass, 2 passengers is currently what counts as a 'busy' train.
 

ChiefPlanner

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About 4 on a standard GTR train through St Albans - but the service needs to run as speaking to staff , users are Police Officers, NHS staff etc and ones going to the rather important Crick Institute at St Pancras.

The railway needs to be kept open and functional , free from vandals and trespassers etc - the fact the they trains are light is a reflection of the Governmental advice.

Not to mention freight of course. Yes - we do have them on the MML.
 

Bletchleyite

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Although it's probably at the point on some routes where providing a taxi for every key worker using the train is probably cheaper, and also exposes individuals to less risk overall.

I have a feeling that's being done on the Marston Vale, they did ask people to contact them if affected.
 

Saint66

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About 4 on a standard GTR train through St Albans - but the service needs to run as speaking to staff , users are Police Officers, NHS staff etc and ones going to the rather important Crick Institute at St Pancras.

The railway needs to be kept open and functional , free from vandals and trespassers etc - the fact the they trains are light is a reflection of the Governmental advice.

Not to mention freight of course. Yes - we do have them on the MML.

Indeed, on my evening walks around St Albans you still see a few 'commuter' types who are key workers travelling back from the station. In fact just this morning Thameslink added a 7:42 service from Bedford to St Pancras following feedback from key workers.
 

bramling

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Indeed, on my evening walks around St Albans you still see a few 'commuter' types who are key workers travelling back from the station. In fact just this morning Thameslink added a 7:42 service from Bedford to St Pancras following feedback from key workers.

To be fair GTR haven’t been at all bad through all this. What they’ve advertised has generally tended to run.
 

js1000

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With passenger numbers down by 95% and lots of picture of empty trains is it worth mothballing some lines. For example, the mid Cheshire line from Manchester to Chester is now down to 2hrly which doesnt seem very useful for essential workers. Given the low numbers it would probably be cheaper to just run taxis as and when required on some routes.

Are there any routes which are carrying no-one at present?
My personal opinion is that there has to be a 'shadow service' of some sort for a host of reasons.

There will be some key workers who need to still use public transport. This can range from healthcare workers, social workers, construction workers on 'critical schemes', supermarket workers etc. The provision to get from A to B if they do have access to a car needs to exist.

I'd argue there are longer term benefits for the railway industry by retaining a shadow service. The trains need to be maintained. Railway staff need to remain trained. In contrast, the airlines are going to have big problems bringing planes out of cold storage. Getting staff to re-qualify as they potentially haven't flown for months. Many pilots and airline staff approaching retirement age will undoubtedly take it now which will leave experience and skills gaps in the airline industry. It's completely in the railway industry's need to remain operational and active to avoid similar problems when some semblance of normality resumes.

To drivers and conductors, if you're working a couple of days view it as exercise and a chance to get outdoors - even for a couple of days a week. Running an empty train is one of the best jobs to have at the moment. I know many who have been furloughed and they are struggling physically and mentally to cope being housebound and with an uncertain future.
 

ChiefPlanner

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To be fair GTR haven’t been at all bad through all this. What they’ve advertised has generally tended to run.

The performance stats , are very good - and the attention given to internal cleaning of the trains likewise - every one that turns round at SAC (and no doubt elsewhere) ,is given a thorough clean on touch points and so on. Besides - there will need to be a gradual ramp up of services in the hopefully non - too distant future.

The whole thing about keeping "mother railway" going is incredibly important - the service is there for now , and for the future. As a retired manager -I always make the point of (when I talk to the staff - from a social distancing point of view) - thank them for their efforts in keeping the show running.
 

pdeaves

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Are there any routes which are carrying no-one at present?
There are no services on many of the odd chords used by what we colloquially call parliamentary services (see http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/2020.html). Also no service on the Watford-St Albans line, Settle-Carnforth, Morecambe/Heysham branches, Ellesmere Port-Helsby, Barton-on-Humber branch and no doubt others.
 

ChiefPlanner

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There are no services on many of the odd chords used by what we colloquially call parliamentary services (see http://www.psul4all.free-online.co.uk/2020.html). Also no service on the Watford-St Albans line, Settle-Carnforth, Morecambe/Heysham branches, Ellesmere Port-Helsby, Barton-on-Humber branch and no doubt others.

You can add , for example , Hereford to Worcester to this list .....not exactly a "Parliamentary" .....but there we go.....
 

cav1975

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Ryde Esplanade to Ryde Pier Head & back is probably ECS apart from the train crew as the ferries aren't running.
 

DA1

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I’ve heard recently that they are expecting 80% of services running from mid May and full service from end of June. Don’t know whether this is TOC specific though so make of that what you will.
 

JonathanH

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I’ve heard recently that they are expecting 80% of services running from mid May and full service from end of June. Don’t know whether this is TOC specific though so make of that what you will.

Doesn't that depend on external factors - ie what the government is doing to continue or ease thr lockdown. I can understand why what you have indicated could be the plan but doesn't mean it will turn out like that.
 

DA1

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Doesn't that depend on external factors - ie what the government is doing to continue or ease thr lockdown. I can understand why what you have indicated could be the plan but doesn't mean it will turn out like that.

Definitely depends on the overall plan and how the numbers are progressing. I can see many of the lines which aren’t currently running becoming operational again and whilst the number of services may increase as a whole I expect the Government to still keep a tight grip on the number of travellers.
 

JonathanH

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Definitely depends on the overall plan and how the numbers are progressing. I can see many of the lines which aren’t currently running becoming operational again and whilst the number of services may increase as a whole I expect the Government to still keep a tight grip on the number of travellers.

Yes, I agree there will be directions to that effect. (I am personally not expecting to be able to travel on a train again this calendar year as I can't foresee having any reason to make an essential journey.)

I think the point is to measure and try to estimate the likely number of essential journeys likely on any route and the level of discretionary travel and match supply to the former. Routes which have a disproportionate level of staff requirement relative to demand might be more difficult to justify restoration in an 'essential travel only' situation.
 
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ValleyLines142

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Cardiff Bay Line is still running, surprisingly, at a frequency of every 24-36 minutes! Absolutely pointless when Cardiff Bus are operating the 6 every half an hour.
 

Bald Rick

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If services stopped completely wouldn't all drivers have to undergo route knowledge re-learning?

This is already an issue, as many operators have reduced route coverage by some driver depots. Regaining the route knowledge is a non trivial exercise.
 

pdeaves

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This is already an issue, as many operators have reduced route coverage by some driver depots. Regaining the route knowledge is a non trivial exercise.
At least one TOC (probably all the others too!) has crew training requirements already built into its 'ramp up services again' plan.
 

317 forever

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With passenger numbers down by 95% and lots of picture of empty trains is it worth mothballing some lines. For example, the mid Cheshire line from Manchester to Chester is now down to 2hrly which doesnt seem very useful for essential workers. Given the low numbers it would probably be cheaper to just run taxis as and when required on some routes.

Are there any routes which are carrying no-one at present?

Cheaper to run taxis maybe, but then there would have been the matter of proximity between taxi drivers and passengers.
 
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