LNER: London Kings Cross to Inverness: no January services?

[Sealink]

I was attempting to book a ticket from London to Inverness, and it appears that they are not operating to Inverness at all, in January.

Initially I thought it was the specific dates I was trying, but a wider search shows that, in fact all dates in January are unavailable.

I then thought it may be engineering works, but the train that forms the Inverness service is operating to Edinburgh as normal, and ScotRail seem to be operating as normal between Edinburgh and Inverness.
Any ideas why? A connecting service is OK but historically have always been more expensive than the direct service. Incidentally, cheapest First Class single is £321.70!

Thanks in advance!

Well, LNER have replied on Twitter...

"Apologies I have just spoken to controls regarding services to Inverness over January and the timetable for this is being evaluated.
Once this has been confirmed there shall be further updates on the website"

Hmm.

 

[RailWonderer]

You can get a return on Easyjet for £50, plus a bit more if you want luggage and seat selection etc but it will be way quicker and cheaper. I know we like to advocate rail here but sometimes when it is so much cheaper to fly it's hard to dismiss this option.

 

[yorkie]

Any ideas why? A connecting service is OK but historically have always been more expensive than the direct service. Incidentally, cheapest First Class single is £321.70!

For which journey/date? I can well believe Scotrail/LNER are asking for that much, but no way would we charge anywhere near that sum! Have you checked our site out? https://tickets.railforums.co.uk; a quick random search for a random date gave fares at least £100 less than that.

 

[Sealink]

Thanks for this.
Would really prefer the direct service, but your site is bringing up cheaper fares than LNER and other TOCs for alternatives.
Hoping for some decent First Class seats as those Azuma ironing boards get uncomfortable around Peterborough!

Billy

 

[mrcheek]

London to Inverness is a looooong journey. About 8 hours.

I know its nice to get a direct service, but for this one I would actually recommend changing if its cheaper. You might be grateful of a break of journey!

 

[Failed Unit]

I wonder if they are reviewing it because of the current driver shortage, I understand that service is resource expensive and very likely to be disrupted in January by the weather. Still concerning irrespective.

 

[Sealink]

I wonder if they are reviewing it because of the current driver shortage, I understand that service is resource expensive and very likely to be disrupted in January by the weather. Still concerning irrespective.

I was thinking same thing re: weather.

 

[43096]

I wonder if they are reviewing it because of the current driver shortage, I understand that service is resource expensive and very likely to be disrupted in January by the weather. Still concerning irrespective.

I was thinking same thing re: weather.

If that is the case about weather, that marks an absolute new low from the railway: cancelling trains for weather that is weeks away and certainly not forecast yet.

 

[JonathanH]

I then thought it may be engineering works, but the train that forms the Inverness service is operating to Edinburgh as normal, and ScotRail seem to be operating as normal between Edinburgh and Inverness.
Any ideas why? A connecting service is OK but historically have always been more expensive than the direct service. Incidentally, cheapest First Class single is £321.70!

If through advances aren't showing for LNER to Edinburgh, and Scotrail to Inverness, it is likely to be the usual issue of quotas not matching up, ie Scotrail not allowing LNER & connections tickets on their services.

£321.70 is the 'walk up' first class single fare.

 

[Watershed]

You can get a return on Easyjet for £50, plus a bit more if you want luggage and seat selection etc but it will be way quicker and cheaper. I know we like to advocate rail here but sometimes when it is so much cheaper to fly it's hard to dismiss this option.

Yep, even when taking into account the time taken to get to the airport, flying is much faster. Of course if the OP is coming from somewhere north of London then the train becomes the better option again.

 

[williamn]

Thing with ‘much faster’ is it presupposes you’ll be doing something incredibly important and productive with the time ‘saved’. I tend to view time on a train as time in which I can do things I don’t get around to otherwise, be it reading, listening to music, doing life admin or just staring out the window and thinking, so it’s not wasted time.

 

[Kite159]

A bit concerning as I'm booked on a service from Inverness to Newcastle during January, I presume if LNER decide to cancel it I will be allowed to use the following Scotrail service & change at Edinburgh for the next LNER.

 

[Stathern Jc]

I was thinking of arranging a day out when things were a bit quieter after the New Year, and having breakfast on the train as you look out at Strathspey and Badenoch is a good start to any day.
So it is disappointing to read that the "Chieftain" is doubtful for January, and any suggestion that the service could be fragile beyond the winter weather is going to be very disturbing.

 

[Millisle]

The security of the future of the Chieftain is a sensitive issue in the north of Scotland, one to let loose in the media and with politicians. A TOC currently under the control of a the British Government planning to cut the only cross-border daytime link between the the Highlands and London would look teally bad.

 

[Sealink]

Yep, even when taking into account the time taken to get to the airport, flying is much faster. Of course if the OP is coming from somewhere north of London then the train becomes the better option again.

I am just sick of airports.

Queuing for bag drop
Queuing for security
Queuing at the gate
Queuing to board
Waiting for luggage at the other end.

I'll be away for two weeks so carry on doesn't work.

The train is so much easier but at the moment the fare difference is insane. Apart from the seated sleeper, but that's a marathon in itself.


My travel starts in Axminster or Weymouth/Dorchester which adds another complication as SWR aren't they reliable these days

 

[Killingworth]

I was attempting to book a ticket from London to Inverness, and it appears that they are not operating to Inverness at all, in January.

Initially I thought it was the specific dates I was trying, but a wider search shows that, in fact all dates in January are unavailable.

I then thought it may be engineering works, but the train that forms the Inverness service is operating to Edinburgh as normal, and ScotRail seem to be operating as normal between Edinburgh and Inverness.
Any ideas why? A connecting service is OK but historically have always been more expensive than the direct service. Incidentally, cheapest First Class single is £321.70!

Thanks in advance!

Well, LNER have replied on Twitter...

"Apologies I have just spoken to controls regarding services to Inverness over January and the timetable for this is being evaluated.
Once this has been confirmed there shall be further updates on the website"

Hmm.

Paths are in on RTT.

 

[Sealink]

Paths are in on RTT.

The path is there but no one is selling tickets to Inverness on the Chieftain

 

[38Cto15E]

Sealink, I believe that a Newcastle driver takes over the northbound HC at NCL and works the train to Inverness.
The driver then sleeps in an Inverness hotel before travelling passenger to Aberdeen.
Where the driver works the 1452 Aberdeen to Kings Cross service as far as Newcastle.
There is no doubt a similar arrangement in the opposite direction.

 

[43094]

That used to be the case for Drivers, however it’s changed in the new timetable so that the same driver works to Inverness, then back in the morning.

 

[Stathern Jc]

Interesting.
Could a severe delay arriving in Inverness mean an inevitably late departure the following morning to guarantee a minimum rest period?
And how much of a delay to the arrival would present a risk to the morning service's on time departure?

 

[robbeech]

Interesting.
Could a severe delay arriving in Inverness mean an inevitably late departure the following morning to guarantee a minimum rest period?
And how much of a delay to the arrival would present a risk to the morning service's on time departure?

Absolutely. I would think this would be fairly tight.

Monday 30th October it arrived 108L into Inverness. The following morning it left 35L.
Could be unrelated delays of course but it would make sense.

 

[dk1]

That used to be the case for Drivers, however it’s changed in the new timetable so that the same driver works to Inverness, then back in the morning.

That seems so strange and certainly not 12hrs rest. How do they get around this restriction?

 

[The Puddock]

That seems so strange and certainly not 12hrs rest. How do they get around this restriction?

LNER (and Virgin/NatEx/GNER before them) has an agreement with ASLEF for reduced hours of rest - from memory a minimum 9 hours - for lodging turns for the Newcastle lodge link drivers.

I don’t know what is going on with the Inverness service in January but I’ve noticed that LNER has recently become very keen to withdraw services north of Edinburgh at the drop of a hat. It wouldn’t surprise me if they were ended permanently soon.

 

[dk1]

LNER (and Virgin/NatEx/GNER before them) has an agreement with ASLEF for reduced hours of rest - from memory a minimum 9 hours - for lodging turns for the Newcastle drivers.

Thank you.

 

[800001]

Absolutely. I would think this would be fairly tight.

Monday 30th October it arrived 108L into Inverness. The following morning it left 35L.
Could be unrelated delays of course but it would make sense.

If it arrives about an hour late, or later, then it’s normally a minimum 30 late departure from Inverness, however often Network rail make it depart 1 hour late at 08:55 due to pathing on the single tracks sections.

 

[robbeech]

If it arrives about an hour late, or later, then it’s normally a minimum 30 late departure from Inverness, however often Network rail make it depart 1 hour late at 08:55 due to pathing on the single tracks sections.

I did see that even when it has left 35 or so late from Inverness it has quickly ended up dropping further behind and assumed it would be pathing issues. I wonder what percentage of people who catch that one from Inverness are on advances or other single tickets. Must be a lot of delay repay.

 

[dk1]

Down Chieftain terminating at Waverley tomorrow.

 

[800001]

Down Chieftain terminating at Waverley tomorrow.

Speed restrictions imposed by NWR for Thursday on the Highland mainline due to forecasted high winds. Predominately between Perth and Inverness, but also with areas between Edinburgh and Perth.

 

[ainsworth74]

I don’t know what is going on with the Inverness service in January but I’ve noticed that LNER has recently become very keen to withdraw services north of Edinburgh at the drop of a hat. It wouldn’t surprise me if they were ended permanently soon.

I'm wondering if that has more to do with this:

Speed restrictions imposed by NWR for Thursday on the Highland mainline due to forecasted high winds. Predominately between Perth and Inverness, but also with areas between Edinburgh and Perth.

Is it LNER withdrawing the service at the drop of a hat or is more that Network Rail in Scotland will impose speed restrictions much more quickly for bad weather than previous making it much trickier for LNER to be able to operate the service?

As has been mentioned an hour delay into Inverness means a likely hour delay the next morning and a speed restriction on a chunk of the Highland Mainline could easily mean an hour long delay or more (meaning even longer potentially the next day!). Aberdeen probably isn't quite as badly impacted by crewing requirements but its still got to be a factor.

 

[800001]

I'm wondering if that has more to do with this:


Is it LNER withdrawing the service at the drop of a hat or is more that Network Rail in Scotland will impose speed restrictions much more quickly for bad weather than previous making it much trickier for LNER to be able to operate the service?

As has been mentioned an hour delay into Inverness means a likely hour delay the next morning and a speed restriction on a chunk of the Highland Mainline could easily mean an hour long delay or more (meaning even longer potentially the next day!). Aberdeen probably isn't quite as badly impacted by crewing requirements but its still got to be a factor.

Scotland seem to introduce speeds restrictions a lot quicker and often at 40-50mph over vast sections, Carmont certainly changed how NWR Scotland react to the weather.
LNER probably withdraw the service to terminate/start to protect the core route.