LnW/TfW Only Shrewsbury -> Euston

[Shotton]

Hi all, I hold an advance single as an e-ticket for travel from Aberystwyth to Shrewsbury on Monday 6th November.

I want to travel onwards to London using the following fare: https://www.brfares.com/!faredetail?orig=SHR&dest=EUS&rlc=YNG&rte=371&tkt=OPS

(Super off peak single routed LnW/TfW only from Shrewsbury to Euston, £13.35 with my railcard).

I note that it has been mentioned in other threads by @yorkie that the restriction code on this ticket is not implemented correctly in journey planners, ie there is blanket ban on all departures at any station from 15:59-19:01 despite the fact the human-readable restriction is quite clear in stating the only relevant station is the origin on the ticket - I intend to depart Shrewsbury 14:32 (changing at BHM, and eventually arriving Euston 18:17), which, as I understand it would be perfectly valid.

I would prefer to buy this ticket as an e-ticket that can be added to my Google wallet, to match with my original ticket in case of a delay, but I have a few questions...

I) is there a website from which I can buy this ticket and add it to my Google wallet without selecting an itinerary?


II) If not, and, even if so, if I buy the ticket with a different (or no) itinerary and attempt to use it as I intend, am I likely to encounter any issues if scanned (ie, will the ticket come up as invalid to an inspector)?

III) In the event of disruption if I end up with a paper ticket, or a ticket as above, am I likely to encounter issues claiming delay repay (and in the event of a delay on the first leg to the extend that I would be leaving Shrewsbury after 15:59, would I likely be able to demonstrate previous delay to show that the journey would still be valid)?

IV) If someone from London Northwestern Railway is reading this, could you fix this restriction code? It has been highlighted multiple times by Yorkie on this forum, and if I was to buy a ticket normally I would be overcharged for my travel.

 

[Watershed]

I) is there a website from which I can buy this ticket and add it to my Google wallet without selecting an itinerary?

The only websites I'm aware of that allow you to buy tickets without an itinerary are the On Track Retail operated sites - i.e. GTR's brands (SN/TL/GN) and Southeastern.

You have to first find the ticket you want (on any itinerary at any date or time), then press the Favourite button to save it. That then allows you to buy it for any selected date without having to search for itineraries.

Unfortunately I don't think that you can add e-tickets bought through these sites to Google Wallet, but I'm happy to be corrected.

II) If not, and, even if so, if I buy the ticket with a different (or no) itinerary and attempt to use it as I intend, am I likely to encounter any issues if scanned (ie, will the ticket come up as invalid to an inspector)?

Very unlikely - e-ticket scanners don't determine the validity of walk-up tickets using the reservations/itinerary. That would only be the case on an Advance ticket.

III) In the event of disruption if I end up with a paper ticket, or a ticket as above, am I likely to encounter issues claiming delay repay (and in the event of a delay on the first leg to the extend that I would be leaving Shrewsbury after 15:59, would I likely be able to demonstrate previous delay to show that the journey would still be valid)?

Probably not - if you encounter any issues, it's likely to be the result of more general problems with Delay Repay processing, rather than anything related to the issues with this ticket's restriction code.

IV) If someone from London Northwestern Railway is reading this, could you fix this restriction code? It has been highlighted multiple times by Yorkie on this forum, and if I was to buy a ticket normally I would be overcharged for my travel.

It would be a lot of work for them to fix it, since the electronic time restrictions data structure doesn't allow the implementation of a "journeys begun at a valid time may be continued"-type rule. They would effectively need a different restriction code for every station to station combination, which simply wouldn't be feasible given the limitations of 2-digit restriction codes.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Not directly linked to the OP's question, but would this Shrewsbury-Euston TfW/LNR ticket allow travel via Crewe, using the LNR Trent Valley services?
I don't see any route restriction on brfares.

 

[Bletchleyite]

This restriction issue has existed for over 15 years now on all WMT Off Peaks and Super Off Peaks, staff are well aware of it and won't cause you any problem.

While fixing the whole problem would be hard, they could at least manage to split "towards London" and "away from London"...

 

[Watershed]

Not directly linked to the OP's question, but would this Shrewsbury-Euston TfW/LNR ticket allow travel via Crewe, using the LNR Trent Valley services?
I don't see any route restriction on brfares.

No route restriction and via Crewe is, in principle, a mapped route (and indeed generally the fastest way of using only TfW and LNR services). There is a negative easement which prevents journey planners from offering itineraries via Crewe, but I doubt that staff on the ground are aware of this.

 

[miklcct]

Unfortunately I don't think that you can add e-tickets bought through these sites to Google Wallet, but I'm happy to be corrected.

It's correct. But you can download the .pkpass file and add it into a wallet app which support it.

 

[TJM]

No route restriction and via Crewe is, in principle, a mapped route (and indeed generally the fastest way of using only TfW and LNR services). There is a negative easement which prevents journey planners from offering itineraries via Crewe, but I doubt that staff on the ground are aware of this.

I did once have a member of staff on a TfW service between Shrewsbury and Crewe challenge me on this due to their handheld device claiming it's not a valid route, but they seemed to give me the benefit of the doubt when I highlighted the text of the restriction did not appear to preclude it?

I wonder if it's valid via Hereford too on TfW/WMT - once had to go that way when flooding closed most of the lines out of Shrewsbury, but tickets were never checked.

 

[Shotton]

The only websites I'm aware of that allow you to buy tickets without an itinerary are the On Track Retail operated sites - i.e. GTR's brands (SN/TL/GN) and Southeastern.

You have to first find the ticket you want (on any itinerary at any date or time), then press the Favourite button to save it. That then allows you to buy it for any selected date without having to search for itineraries.

Unfortunately I don't think that you can add e-tickets bought through these sites to Google Wallet, but I'm happy to be corrected.


Very unlikely - e-ticket scanners don't determine the validity of walk-up tickets using the reservations/itinerary. That would only be the case on an Advance ticket.


Probably not - if you encounter any issues, it's likely to be the result of more general problems with Delay Repay processing, rather than anything related to the issues with this ticket's restriction code.


It would be a lot of work for them to fix it, since the electronic time restrictions data structure doesn't allow the implementation of a "journeys begun at a valid time may be continued"-type rule. They would effectively need a different restriction code for every station to station combination, which simply wouldn't be feasible given the limitations of 2-digit restriction codes.

Thank you for your detailed answers; will buy the ticket off GTR, then at least I have the 2 pdfs. It's a shame that it seems like the issue is not an easy fix, it would be nice if they at least implemented some text in retail sites such that when you buy a more expensive LnW (/tfW only) ticket you are informed that there may be a valid cheaper ticket (perhaps with advice to ask at a ticket office).

As for the later question about the Crewe route, funnily enough I actually asked about that on this forum, and indeed managed to eventually find the negative easement myself. Afaik, Hereford is not a valid route for Shrewsbury to London so would definitely not be valid on this ticket, though happy to be corrected on this.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It would be a lot of work for them to fix it, since the electronic time restrictions data structure doesn't allow the implementation of a "journeys begun at a valid time may be continued"-type rule. They would effectively need a different restriction code for every station to station combination, which simply wouldn't be feasible given the limitations of 2-digit restriction codes.

I don't think they'd quite need one for each station, just groups of stations based on the direct services LNR operate. That wouldn't give you a totally perfect interpretation, e.g. it would show potentially wrong ticket information if someone wanted to change unnecessarily, but to get itineraries working for most ilkely combinations where people aren't making unnecessary changes off direct trains you would only need about 10 codes. I did try to work them all out but haven't got all day to find the holes