London 2012: Southeastern publishes new timetable

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Temple

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I travel often on SE and can't say I'm surprised. We've known for a long, long time that High Speed services would change during the Olympics and Paralympics. To be fair, they haven't changed all to much. For me personally, the frequency has gone down from 2tph to 1tph (to Faversham), which isn't a drastic change and also, trains will still run until about 2:30am.

I appreciate that High Speed services will not run to Margate or Dover (I think), but they will still run to Ashford where you can change to services to Margate and Dover. An inconvenience though.

As far as mainline services go, they're not too different. Okay, main stations will be crowded and certain locations will be entry and other locations will be exit inside the station as well as services being very crowded.

In all, they're not a huge surprise, it's to be expected and we've had a lot of warning.
 

Kentish Paul

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Pretty intense on HS1. Odd difference in the dwell times at Ebbsfleet for the 1/2 hourly HS1 service to Ashford. 6 minutes for one and 3 minutes for the other. Maybe the longer stop is to let a Eurostar overtake? Any ideas?
 
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extendedpaul

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There's no HS1 to Medway/Faversham after the 21.18 until 01.17, then two more trains within 40 minutes presumably to get the stock to Faversham for morning commuter services.

Four hours seems a huge gap in service especially with no extra trains to speak of out of Victoria.
 

Temple

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I would have thought the 6 minutes was to allow passengers on or off during busier times. I initially thought it was to let a service overtake, but looking on timetables it doesn't appear so.

4 hours is a long time with no services to Medway/Faversham. But, that time of night, they're normally very empty IIRC. Yeah, I should imagine the 3 services around 1:30am to Faversham are to get the stock their for the morning peak and take people back too.
 

TheJRB

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Changing at Ashford will only take you as far as Ramsgate, so you'd need to change again for Broadstairs and Margate. Having said that, some of the interchanges at Ashford will be same or cross platform.

The Timetables 2 site shows that the 395s will head into the washer at Ashford every so often through the day during the Olympics. Seems like things will be kept nice and shiny!
 

Temple

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Ah, I forgot you could only go to Ramsgate now. I was thinking back to the days when Charing Cross services went all the way to Margate and so you could get a direct service from Ashford to Margate.

Nice to know they're keeping them clean haha!
 

Clip

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They have haad posters up about this change at Margate for seemingly forever now so it is no surprise. If we're honest though most people will now go the Faversham route anyway rather the Ashford as trains from there are all shacks and takes an age and you would have to change again/.
 

telstarbox

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Also note:

Our cycle policy changes during the Games. Because our services are
going to be much busier during this time, only compact folded cycles will
be allowed on our services into and out of London at all times. They must
be folded before entering the station and remain folded for the journey.
 

mm333

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People in the far east of Kent seem quite hard done by if they want to go to the Olympics. The last service [1 Aug] from Stratford Int to Ashford is at 0148 and to Faversham is at 0204. However for Dover and Canterbury it's 2248 and Margate's 2315.

A shame that the late night HS1s couldn't serve these towns.
 

jobbers

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I appreciate that High Speed services will not run to Margate or Dover (I think), but they will still run to Ashford where you can change to services to Margate and Dover. An inconvenience though.

I commute in from Folkestone on a daily basis - I received a letter from Southeastern telling me they were giving me £40 in rail vouchers for the inconvenience.
 

infobleep

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Are any other companies due to issue modified timetables?

Instead of a refund how about offering the season ticket at standard prices or is that more expensive than the £40 you'll get back Jobbers?

I know someone who commutes regularly from Maidstone West to North London. Normally to get to St Pancreas it takes 47 minutes in the morning. During the day when they have to change it goes up to 1 hours 5 minutes.

According to National Rail Enquiries, during the Olympics it will take 1h 29 minutes if they arrive into St Prances earlier than usual or 1h 42 minutes if they aim to get into St. Pancreas around their usual time. That is more than double the amount of time and they are paying more money for the high speed service which isn't going to be high speed for them! I'm sure they will be delighted for this. In addition to that they have to get out of the station, walking to Euston and try and board a train to Harrow and Wealdstone. Whilst they may be able to spend the odd day working at home, it's not a full time option.

As they like to tell me from time to time. Years ago they use to be able to get fast trains to Charring Cross which they say took about 48 minutes and the price wasn't more expensive than any other trains to London. Of course it wouldn't take them north of the river.
 

Clip

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People in the far east of Kent seem quite hard done by if they want to go to the Olympics. The last service [1 Aug] from Stratford Int to Ashford is at 0148 and to Faversham is at 0204. However for Dover and Canterbury it's 2248 and Margate's 2315.

A shame that the late night HS1s couldn't serve these towns.

But what are the last ones back from Victoria? And if your not finished wiht the Olympics by that time of night then there may be something wrong with you
 

Deerfold

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But what are the last ones back from Victoria? And if your not finished wiht the Olympics by that time of night then there may be something wrong with you

There's plenty of events scheduled to finish around 2230 at the main park (e.g. Men's diving 10/08) - if you've then got to get back to the station 2248 could easily be too early. Women's basketball on 28/07 and Men's basketball on 29/07 aren't scheduled to finish until midnight...
 

GodAtum

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But what are the last ones back from Victoria? And if your not finished wiht the Olympics by that time of night then there may be something wrong with you

Well my shift at the Olympics finishes at 0130 on a Sunday so i would miss the last train back from Victoria.

Anyone know when Southern and TFL will publish their Olympic timetables?
 

jobbers

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Instead of a refund how about offering the season ticket at standard prices or is that more expensive than the £40 you'll get back Jobbers?

.

Erm the HS1 annual season ticket is about £1,000 per annum more than a "classic". The letter did say "this amount has been calculated...blah blah" but as Southeatern offer me £19.15 by way of a "full fare" refund for a delay of 2 hours+, yet the true (off peak) fare is £35, I've given up worrying about how they calculate these things (I know there is a calculation which bears no resemblance to a real commuter use)!!
 

Southern

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As usual with any major events, everything east of Ashford ceases after the usual 0100 Dover and 0103 Canterbury departures. I can't really understand the thinking behind this as for the entire two weeks, all morning services are on the move by at least 0500. The Sunday service from Folkestone will start over two hours earlier than it normally would. Those going to one of the later events by train who didn't book the special travel tickets in advance will then have to pay more for a Return instead of a Day ticket, which I suppose is exactly what Southeastern want.

On a side note, I was travelling on a 395 recently and noticed the electronic reservation boards were back in action. Will these be used during the games? It seems the only time they would ever really be needed as I can't see Southeastern offering advance's, now or in the near future.
 

heart-of-wessex

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There is already advances on HS1 or so I though anyway? In Jan 2012, I got a Trowbridge to Ashford advance via HS1, although there was no reservation or time listed on the HS1 leg, the entire price from Trowbridge to Ashford was cheaper than a walk up return from St Pancras!!
 

Southern

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Well my shift at the Olympics finishes at 0130 on a Sunday so i would miss the last train back from Victoria.

Anyone know when Southern and TFL will publish their Olympic timetables?

Noticed the following is showing on OTT for Southern:

Sat 28th/Sun 29th July

Victoria - Dorking increased to 4tph (3tph on 29th)
Victoria - Horsham via Dorking increased to 2tph (1tph on 29th)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
There is already advances on HS1 or so I though anyway? In Jan 2012, I got a Trowbridge to Ashford advance via HS1, although there was no reservation or time listed on the HS1 leg, the entire price from Trowbridge to Ashford was cheaper than a walk up return from St Pancras!!

Yeah, I know what you mean, remember making a similar journey but from Folkestone - Bath, all for £13.50 one way. What I was thinking of were journeys that are made wholly with Southeastern.
 

Clip

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There's plenty of events scheduled to finish around 2230 at the main park (e.g. Men's diving 10/08) - if you've then got to get back to the station 2248 could easily be too early. Women's basketball on 28/07 and Men's basketball on 29/07 aren't scheduled to finish until midnight...

Didnt realise some were finishing so late. But isnt the 2248 time you mention the last high spedd service?
 

heart-of-wessex

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Yeah, I know what you mean, remember making a similar journey but from Folkestone - Bath, all for £13.50 one way. What I was thinking of were journeys that are made wholly with Southeastern.

Ahhh I see sorry mate, yeah not found an internal piece before, sounds like you could get a Birmingham International to Ashford for a dirt cheap price, and turn up at St Pancras with the last piece. I know you are joining en-route on an advance fare and not actually doing the Birmingham to London bit, but I bet someone is doing that already, knowing no-ones checked if he/she has actually come from Birmingham or not!

Anyway I was surprised to see HS1 having 24 hours service, I guess the ones at 2am - 4am are useful for staff too, is there otherwise any event near 4am? Quite high frequency at night too, on some travel card it would be handy as an overnight move, but then more expensive anyway, the Thameslink or Southern ones would be better!
 

craigwilson

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Ah, I forgot you could only go to Ramsgate now. I was thinking back to the days when Charing Cross services went all the way to Margate and so you could get a direct service from Ashford to Margate.

They reinstated Charing Cross services out to Margate when the Open Golf was on last year. Makes me wonder why they haven't done it this time, especially as the service disruption lasts a lot longer this time round....meaning effectively no direct service to Canterbury for quite a while :|
 

Temple

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They reinstated Charing Cross services out to Margate when the Open Golf was on last year. Makes me wonder why they haven't done it this time, especially as the service disruption lasts a lot longer this time round....meaning effectively no direct service to Canterbury for quite a while :|

That is strange as to why they didn't extend them then. Is there the demand though for it? Seeing as you can just change at Ramsgate? It's not like Margate has lost all links to Ashford, you just have to change and wait.
Because SE will be lengthening other services for the Olympics, maybe it's not feasible to extend them to Margate, I'm not sure.
 

TheJRB

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Because SE will be lengthening other services for the Olympics, maybe it's not feasible to extend them to Margate, I'm not sure.

Speaking of which; when I was at Ashford last week I heard a couple of Charing Cross trains announced with the wrong number of carriages. One was announced as twelve and another ten when both were actually formed of eight. Is this a sign that regular main line services be lengthened during the Olympics or just a mistake?
 

craigwilson

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Speaking of which; when I was at Ashford last week I heard a couple of Charing Cross trains announced with the wrong number of carriages. One was announced as twelve and another ten when both were actually formed of eight. Is this a sign that regular main line services be lengthened during the Olympics or just a mistake?

Could just be what they're supposed to be booked as. One of the peak Victoria services through Margate is supposed to be 10 carriages (and is announced as such) but sometimes isn't.
 

TheJRB

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Could just be what they're supposed to be booked as. One of the peak Victoria services through Margate is supposed to be 10 carriages (and is announced as such) but sometimes isn't.

I thought that too but this was in the late morning at about 11:30. Usually the 12 car 375s start appearing at about 16:00 at Ashford.
 

Temple

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I thought that too but this was in the late morning at about 11:30. Usually the 12 car 375s start appearing at about 16:00 at Ashford.

It could have been a mistake? Although I'm not sure how easy it is to accidentally advertise a service as a 12 car.

Alternatively, they could be preparing to lengthen services all day during the Olympics and Paralympics, and they just happen to have advertised the services a week or two early?

Or, it could have genuinely been a 12 car service, but due to a train fault it could have been reduced to 8 cars?
 

Southern

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Taking a look at OTT, there appears to be some changes when compared with a normal weekday. For instance, the 0951 arrival at Ramsgate today appears to divide, with one portion running ECS and the other working the 1040 to Charing Cross. On the 27th, the ECS is shown as cancelled, which I imagine would then make the 1040 an 8 car. It's possible given what TheJRB heard as this service is booked into Ashford at 1125, before a further 4 coaches are added, departing 1133.
 
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