London Road crossing, Bicester

[fishwomp]

Any place where two equal roads intersect with traffic lights is closed in each direction for 30 minutes per hour. Obviously not for 5 minutes at a time, more like 1 minute, but the point of how many minutes in the hour can be viewed in that light.

If 10 trains per hour, and estimates of 50 minutes per hour of barriers down, something is seriously being exaggerated to whip up support. A prior post says downtime is just over 90 seconds in one direction, and up to five if stopping and arriving early in the other direction: that could be fixed by changing timetabel to never be early (everything scheduled to leave late means everything leaves as quick as possible).

It all smells like a worst case of 30 minutes, and probably a lot less.

Bicester residents have seen a lot of economic benefit from their connection to Marylebone, and will from new opportunities in Milton Keynes. Pretty sure the benefit outweighs the cost.

 

[jfowkes]

I'm a bit confused by the "if something arrives early then barriers will be down for ages" thing. Surely the barriers only go down when the train is ready to depart the station?

 

[BrianW]

Any place where two equal roads intersect with traffic lights is closed in each direction for 30 minutes per hour. Obviously not for 5 minutes at a time, more like 1 minute, but the point of how many minutes in the hour can be viewed in that light.

If 10 trains per hour, and estimates of 50 minutes per hour of barriers down, something is seriously being exaggerated to whip up support. A prior post says downtime is just over 90 seconds in one direction, and up to five if stopping and arriving early in the other direction: that could be fixed by changing timetabel to never be early (everything scheduled to leave late means everything leaves as quick as possible).

It all smells like a worst case of 30 minutes, and probably a lot less.

Bicester residents have seen a lot of economic benefit from their connection to Marylebone, and will from new opportunities in Milton Keynes. Pretty sure the benefit outweighs the cost.

Oxfordshire County Council don't seem to be helping, with reference to 28 (or 32) minutes per hour of 'closure': https://www.oxfordshire.gov.uk/site...r-projects/Bicester-LondonRdLevelCrossing.pdf

And the current MP is taking time out from her current role as Attorney General to help out: https://www.victoriaprentis.com/news/london-road-crossing-meeting-ewr-march-2024

 

[gallafent]

Not sure if this is likely to be raised tomorrow in parliament at the committee hearing I linked, but possibly (the cost of the various solutions must be in scope at least!), so adding a link to this thread.

 

[The Planner]

I'm a bit confused by the "if something arrives early then barriers will be down for ages" thing. Surely the barriers only go down when the train is ready to depart the station?

No, the strike in point is prior to the station so they go down before they stop.

 

[12LDA28C]

I'm a bit confused by the "if something arrives early then barriers will be down for ages" thing. Surely the barriers only go down when the train is ready to depart the station?

You'd think so but no. On many occasions the barriers have been lowered to road traffic because a London-bound train has arrived at Bicester Village early and the traffic builds up whilst the driver waits departure time.

*Edit - answered by @The Planner in the post above.

 

[jfowkes]

No, the strike in point is prior to the station so they go down before they stop.

You'd think so but no. On many occasions the barriers have been lowered to road traffic because a London-bound train has arrived at Bicester Village early and the traffic builds up whilst the driver waits departure time.

The obvious question then is, can't that be changed?

 

[12LDA28C]

The obvious question then is, can't that be changed?

Not without removing the strike in point and making the LC remotely monitored and controlled by Marylebone IECC, I expect. I'd suggest that's not likely to happen.

 

[jfowkes]

Not without removing the strike in point and making the LC remotely monitored and controlled by Marylebone IECC, I expect. I'd suggest that's not likely to happen.

There seems to be some contention over exactly how much time the LC would be down for when EWR services start, so I guess it depends on exact numbers there.

 

[12LDA28C]

There seems to be some contention over exactly how much time the LC would be down for when EWR services start, so I guess it depends on exact numbers there.

It would rather depend on the timetable. If EWR trains travelling in opposite directions are planned to pass over the crossing at the same time (or as close as possible) then barrier downtime can be kept to a minimum.

 

[midlandred]

Victoria Prentis MP has posted this on Facebook:



On Friday, I welcomed East West Rail’s senior management back to Bicester to sit down with local councillors and discuss their work on the London Road level crossing.

Further studies have concluded that signalling improvements will not be enough to keep the current crossing viable once the line is fully operational between Oxford and Cambridge. This does not come as a surprise given we have all known for some time that barrier down time will only increase as more services begin to run.

EWR are continuing their work on two possible new road bridge options. Two locations remain under consideration: one closer to the current crossing and one further to the east. At the same time, EWR are also producing designs for an additional crossing at London Road in the form of either a smaller bridge or underpass. This would enable pedestrians, cyclists and wheelchair users to access the station more easily from the south.

It is clear that more work remains to be done to refine the proposals. None of the options are straightforward and the impact of a new road bridge in the heart of the town will need to be properly considered. I am pleased that residents will be able to see the options for themselves and share their views in a public consultation this summer.

With the first services expected to run between Oxford and Milton Keynes as early as next year, the councillors and I emphasised the need for EWR to implement a viable design as quickly as possible. I will continue to work with our local representatives and my colleagues in Government until a long-term solution is secured.

 

[BrianW]

It would rather depend on the timetable. If EWR trains travelling in opposite directions are planned to pass over the crossing at the same time (or as close as possible) then barrier downtime can be kept to a minimum.

Good thought, though that's quite a constraint to add into timetabling along with connections, turnround times, etc.

 

[12LDA28C]

Good thought, though that's quite a constraint to add into timetabling along with connections, turnround times, etc.

Indeed, although that's what was attempted with Chiltern Railways services at the same location. I appreciate that EWR trains will have rather more constraints on them, particularly at the Eastern end where trains have to negotiate the WCML between Bletchley and Milton Keynes.