Lothian group (Network/Route Speculation)

[SoloSR334022]

You could probably call such a division , Eastern Scottish, if you wanted to.

Would seem a bit repetitive but I like your thinking

 

[LothianBusesPh]

Would seem a bit repetitive but I like your thinking

Adding onto this, I don't think Lothian would do that as they like their brands to be consistent and I think the end goal for East Coast Buses is for it to join the Lothian Country brand. Also remember that McGill's own the right to the "Eastern Scottish" name. It wouldn't make sense either as Lothian will only operate in the Lothian's area, not all of Eastern Scotland, although I suppose McGill's didn't either so you could view it in two different ways, I suppose.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Adding onto this, I don't think Lothian would do that as they like their brands to be consistent and I think the end goal for East Coast Buses is for it to join the Lothian Country brand. Also remember that McGill's own the right to the "Eastern Scottish" name. It wouldn't make sense either as Lothian will only operate in the Lothian's area, not all of Eastern Scotland, although I suppose McGill's didn't either so you could view it in two different ways, I suppose.

Exactly, I mean they are called Lothian buses for a reason. I can't imagine East Coast becoming Lothian Country again though. Unless its separated like Lothian Country East or Lothian Country West to make it more unique.

Saying that, the arguement that Lothian can't operate out of Lothian doesn't make 100 percent sense as Border Buses not only operate within Lothian (well.. how else are they meant to get into the borders), but also in England and South Lanarkshire aswell.

 

[frvic93]

The 46 and 48 could easily become ECB. They're only in the city for a small portion of their routes (Newcraighall to the Wisp).

Also why on earth was ECB separate in the first place? They could have kept on being Lothian Country [Buses].

 

[Bus9120UK]

The 46 and 48 could easily become ECB. They're only in the city for a small portion of their routes (Newcraighall to the Wisp).

Also why on earth was ECB separate in the first place? They could have kept on being Lothian Country [Buses].

Musselburgh depot wouldn't fit the vehicles for the 46/8?

 

[frvic93]

Musselburgh depot wouldn't fit the vehicles for the 46/8?

Do the vehicles need to be in Musselburgh depot? Just keep them in Marine.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Also why on earth was ECB separate in the first place? They could have kept on being Lothian Country [Buses].

Correct me if I'm wrong but I am sure it was because of a legal reason they had to have a separate name, Lothian Country was still a thing in East Lothian also with the 113/104 before they became part of the brand later in 2017.

Do the vehicles need to be in Musselburgh depot? Just keep them in Marine.

Just like how Lothian Country could operate some services out of Longstone, East Coast could do the same for Marine, I mean to be fair also the 46/48 could stay as they are. It's not doing any harm and it's not like having it swap brands would do anything in terms of milage.

 

[SoloSR334022]

I know this is off topic, but does anyone know if there is a thread for West Lothian Route Speculation as a whole?

 

[stevenedin]

I know this is off topic, but does anyone know if there is a thread for West Lothian Route Speculation as a whole?

There isn’t but you can create one.

 

[GusB]

I know this is off topic, but does anyone know if there is a thread for West Lothian Route Speculation as a whole?

A speculation thread for West Lothian would too wide in scope. This thread exists mainly because some people were getting fed up with the crayons coming out in the main Lothian thread.

There are existing threads for other operators in the Lothians and these can be found by searching. You can either use the forum's built-in search facility, or use a search engine - enter "site:railforums.co.uk keyword" to make use of this (this works on Google and Bing).

There is also this thread, which you may find useful:

Independent Operators in the Lothians

Didn't want to clog up the Lothian / ECB thread (although they may warrant separating, in which case perhaps this thread could be East Lothian Operators?) For now this is to cover the East Lothian Independent operators e.g. NOT East Coast Buses nor Borders Buses etc. I note from a Flickr...

www.railforums.co.uk

If you decide to start a new thread, please ensure that you have something meaningful to start the discussion off with. If you simply say "this is a thread to discuss <insert subject here>" without actually contributing your own thoughts, it's very likely to meet the cutting room floor.

 

[DespacitoPlayz]

You could probably call such a division , Eastern Scottish, if you wanted to.

I don’t think that would work seeing Eastern Scottish already exists within West Edinburgh, but that company’s fate is unseen.

 

[ChrisPJ]

It was a, tongue in cheek comment, bearing in mind the corpse of the deceased McGills route network is still warm.

How about Southern Scottish.

 

[SoloSR334022]

I've thought about was there ever a local service between Livingston/Whitburn and Queensferry (Apart from the 7 ran by Horsburgh and not X51 as it's not really local.)
Here is my attempt

75 - South Queensferry (Scotstoun) - Livingston Bus Terminal
via S. Queensferry, Ferrymuir Retail Park, B9080, Kirkliston, Omitting Winchburgh, Broxburn, Uphall, A899, St. John's and Livi Stadium

76 - South Queensferry (Scotstoun) - Whitburn/Bathgate
via S. Queensferry, Ferrymuir Retail Park, B9080, Kirkliston (Eliston Loan & Kirklands Park Street), Winchburgh, Winchburgh School Campus, Broxburn, Uphall, Dechmont, Tesco Distribution, Boghall, Bathgate, (Armadale (Between 1pm and 6pm))

And just thought of this one on the spot

77 - South Queensferry (Scotstoun) - Linlithgow
via S. Queensferry, Ferrymuir Retail Park, B9080, Kirkliston, Winchburgh, Bridgend, Threemiletown, Kingscavil, Linlithgow Cross

 

[TheEastCoaster]

75 - South Queensferry (Scotstoun) - Livingston Bus Terminal
via S. Queensferry, Ferrymuir Retail Park, B9080, Kirkliston, Omitting Winchburgh, Broxburn, Uphall, A899, St. John's and Livi Stadium

76 - South Queensferry (Scotstoun) - Whitburn/Bathgate
via S. Queensferry, Ferrymuir Retail Park, B9080, Kirkliston (Eliston Loan & Kirklands Park Street), Winchburgh, Winchburgh School Campus, Broxburn, Uphall, Dechmont, Tesco Distribution, Boghall, Bathgate, (Armadale (Between 1pm and 6pm))

And just thought of this one on the spot

77 - South Queensferry (Scotstoun) - Linlithgow
via S. Queensferry, Ferrymuir Retail Park, B9080, Kirkliston, Winchburgh, Bridgend, Threemiletown, Kingscavil, Linlithgow Cross

Only ones I could see working are the 75 or 77! granted the 75 could just work by extending the 72 but at this point the route is too long, unless Lothian Country decide to split it in the new future.

72 Fauldhouse to Livingston
75 Livingston to South Queensferry.

The services could interchange.

The 76 section between Broxburn and Whitburn is already covered by the X18 so don't really see that happening in the near future.

I figured if there was to be a Queensferry to Linlithgow service it would run via Newton and Philpston, personally though I would go with the 77 idea and extend it further to Bathgate/Whitburn via Torphichen and Whiteside and offer more links.

If LCB take on the Queensferry to Gyle service this could also bring upon further links for the west part of the city.

So far it seems LCB have been hoovering up all the passengers on the new services to this can be a sign of good things to come.

 

[SoloSR334022]

Only ones I could see working are the 75 or 77! granted the 75 could just work by extending the 72 but at this point the route is too long, unless LCB decide to split it in the new future.

72 Fauldhouse to Livingston
75 Livingston to South Queensferry.

The services could interchange.

The 76 section between Broxburn and Whitburn is already covered by the X18 so don't really see that happening in the near future.

I figured if there was to be a Queensferry to Linlithgow service it would run via Newton and Philpston, personally though I would go with the 77 idea and extend it further to Bathgate/Whitburn via Torphichen and Whiteside and offer more links.

If LCB take on the Queensferry to Gyle service this could also bring upon further links for the west part of the city.

So far it seems LCB have been hoovering up all the passengers on the new services to this can be a sign of good things to come.

The only reason I didn't put the 77 through Newton & Philipstoun is I don't feel there'd be enough passengers from those areas, as well as the width of the roads considering the buses that Lothian Country have/might have in future.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

72 Fauldhouse to Livingston
75 Livingston to South Queensferry.

The numbering would be the other way round as the 72 is the tender between Livingston and Kirkliston, the extended section is commercial.

 

[SoloSR334022]

On the topic of route numbers do you think Lothian will use 70 and 71 for any further expansion in West Lothian?

 

[TheEastCoaster]

The only reason I didn't put the 77 through Newton & Philipstoun is I don't feel there'd be enough passengers from those areas, as well as the width of the roads considering the buses that Lothian Country have/might have in future.

To be fair I wouldn't think there would be much point either, I just thought if they were to do a Queensferry to Linlithgow service they would just go direct.

On the topic of route numbers do you think Lothian will use 70 and 71 for any further expansion in West Lothian?

I don't see why not, clearly the 200 series is discontinued within West Lothian, be interesting to see what they come up with next.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

To be fair I wouldn't think there would be much point either, I just thought if they were to do a Queensferry to Linlithgow service they would just go direct.

If for some reason they went via Newton and Philipstoun, it would almost certainly be tendered by West Lothian Council.

 

[LiviCrazy]

The Queensferry to Linlithgow service would basically just be the old Davidsons service (474) that ran Bathgate>Linlithgow>Springfield>Newton>Sth Queensferry.

If I remember rightly, we used to have the 431 Livingston to Linlithgow via Bridgen, 432 Livingston to Linlithgow via Philpstoun (may be the other way around), and the above service. They have all been partly combined into the longwinded current SD Travel 31 service.

Just found it in the map link below.

W Lothian Bus & Rail Map | PDF | Edinburgh | Bus Transport

This document provides a summary of public transport services in West Lothian, Scotland. It includes a map showing bus routes and timetables for over 50 bus services operating throughout the area, connecting towns like Bathgate, Livingston, Whitburn, Broxburn, and Linlithgow. The services are...

www.scribd.com

 

[mb88]

The Queensferry to Linlithgow service would basically just be the old Davidsons service (474) that ran Bathgate>Linlithgow>Springfield>Newton>Sth Queensferry.

If I remember rightly, we used to have the 431 Livingston to Linlithgow via Bridgen, 432 Livingston to Linlithgow via Philpstoun (may be the other way around), and the above service. They have all been partly combined into the longwinded current SD Travel 31 service.

Just found it in the map link below.

W Lothian Bus & Rail Map | PDF | Edinburgh | Bus Transport

This document provides a summary of public transport services in West Lothian, Scotland. It includes a map showing bus routes and timetables for over 50 bus services operating throughout the area, connecting towns like Bathgate, Livingston, Whitburn, Broxburn, and Linlithgow. The services are...

www.scribd.com

Incredible to think what we once had compared to the bare bones network now.

 

[SoloSR334022]

Got an idea for a Airport bus Between Bathgate and Edinburgh Airport. Could it re-use the old 300 from Lothian?

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Got an idea for a Airport bus Between Bathgate and Edinburgh Airport. Could it re-use the old 300 from Lothian?

One thing I wondered about having an Airport service from West Lothian is what would the fare structure be for the service?

Bathgate to Ingliston runs through 4 zones, and Ingliston P&R is within the City Zone making it 5 zones, so far it would be £5 for a single ticket.

A single to the Airport on Airlink/Skylink is £5.50, so technically it could work in terms of Single Fares, question being how much would a return ticket be? Maybe I'm thinking too much into it at this point.

Also would it still be branded as Skylink despite being a West Lothian service?

Anyway enough of the questions, how would the new 300 get to the Airport?

 

[LothianBusesPh]

One thing I wondered about having an Airport service from West Lothian is what would the fare structure be for the service?

Bathgate to Ingliston runs through 4 zones, and Ingliston P&R is within the City Zone making it 5 zones, so far it would be £5 for a single ticket.

A single to the Airport on Airlink/Skylink is £5.50, so technically it could work in terms of Single Fares, question being how much would a return ticket be? Maybe I'm thinking too much into it at this point.

Also would it still be branded as Skylink despite being a West Lothian service?

Anyway enough of the questions, how would the new 300 get to the Airport?

Perhaps just have a flat fare through the whole route (including the Airport section) to avoid passengers not going to the airport then? I don't like this idea but it's the best I have.

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Perhaps just have a flat fare through the whole route (including the Airport section) to avoid passengers not going to the airport then? I don't like this idea but it's the best I have.

Like the Airlink 100?

To be fair with the 912 serving Livingston, they do have the link between the Airport and the Centre, so this 300 has no need to serve the centre unless they want to compete.

 

[SoloSR334022]

One thing I wondered about having an Airport service from West Lothian is what would the fare structure be for the service?

Bathgate to Ingliston runs through 4 zones, and Ingliston P&R is within the City Zone making it 5 zones, so far it would be £5 for a single ticket.

A single to the Airport on Airlink/Skylink is £5.50, so technically it could work in terms of Single Fares, question being how much would a return ticket be? Maybe I'm thinking too much into it at this point.

Also would it still be branded as Skylink despite being a West Lothian service?

Anyway enough of the questions, how would the new 300 get to the Airport?

Would probably be a local service, the way I would do it is via Dechmont, Uphall, Broxburn, Newbridge, Ratho, Hermiston Gait, Edinburgh Park Station, The Gyle and Ingliston P&R. Almost like the old 555 that E&M Horsbugh used to run, even though it goes back via the city zone it should be alright because it doesn't go through the country zones till Ratho and Newbridge.

 

[gomango]

A suggestion here, has anyone ran a Falkirk to Livingston bus via Polmont, Maddiston Bathgate etc as I see lots of people in the Falkirk area wanting a direct link to Livingston by bus. Would it even be profitable? Would lothian even be allowed to operate a service to Falkirk? Just wondering

 

[SoloSR334022]

A suggestion here, has anyone ran a Falkirk to Livingston bus via Polmont, Maddiston Bathgate etc as I see lots of people in the Falkirk area wanting a direct link to Livingston by bus. Would it even be profitable? Would lothian even be allowed to operate a service to Falkirk? Just wondering

Probably unlikely that Lothian operate outside the West Lothian, City of Edinburgh, Mid Lothian and East Lothian areas. If it were to run it would probably just be an extension of the 29 Between Falkirk and Avonbridge/Bathgate

 

[LothianBusesPh]

A suggestion here, has anyone ran a Falkirk to Livingston bus via Polmont, Maddiston Bathgate etc as I see lots of people in the Falkirk area wanting a direct link to Livingston by bus. Would it even be profitable? Would lothian even be allowed to operate a service to Falkirk? Just wondering

There's a difference between being allowed and wanting to, though.

 

[stevenedin]

A suggestion here, has anyone ran a Falkirk to Livingston bus via Polmont, Maddiston Bathgate etc as I see lots of people in the Falkirk area wanting a direct link to Livingston by bus. Would it even be profitable? Would lothian even be allowed to operate a service to Falkirk? Just wondering

The 9 used to go this way from Falkirk to Livingston. It is a the current route of the 29 up to Bathgate and then extended to Livingston. It was run by Larbert.