Making e-tickets printable at TVMs etc?

[Bletchleyite]

Translink NI has come up with a nice solution, I think.

If you buy a ticket online, you receive an eTicket in your email, and you can travel with that on your phone. If, for whatever reason, you want to collect your ticket you can the code in the email to collect the ticket from a ticket machine. One ticket format, that is both an eTicket and ToD, depending on the passenger's preference.

I think this is a good idea. It would be a move towards making ticketing medium agnostic. Keep it dead simple - just type in the ticket ID (UTN) at a TVM (or show it to a booking office clerk) and have it able to print it out in e-ticket format on till roll. Ideal if your phone is playing up or battery is low so you don't have to worry any more, or you want to buy one for someone else who doesn't have a phone or doesn't want to use it.

It would require a single source of truth for e-ticket data (i.e. one e-ticket database everyone would be required to feed into) but I think that would be a good thing anyway under GBR.

 

[Helvellyn]

Would likely need the Ticket on Departure system currently used to collect pre-bought tickets online updated to work for eTickets as well as the current orange ones as a first step. Then replace or upgrade TVMs to print eTickets on Paper Roll. Depends for the latter on if it's possible to upgrade existing TVMs and also whether it's affordable. Definitely something for GBR if it happens though.

 

[Ashley Hill]

Then replace or upgrade TVMs to print eTickets on Paper Roll

For cross London and zone tickets paper tickets are not much good. TfL have a problem reading the Aztec code even though the ticket is perfectly valid. There’s a thread on here somewhere about it.

 

[Earle Grey]

Fail to see the logic in this. You've bought the tickets, know or have chosen the delivery system - paper or e ticket, so the responsibility is on you to ensure you can present the ticket when required.

 

[renegademaster]

The whole point of the push towards etickets is the beancounters eventually want to be able to get rid of TVMs, RDG/DfT aren't going to implement something that extends their life

 

[Bertie the bus]

I also don't see what this is a solution to. The only thing I am the slightest bit interested in when I purchase a ticket is is it valid for my journey. What it looks like and its format is of no interest or importance.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The whole point of the push towards etickets is the beancounters eventually want to be able to get rid of TVMs, RDG/DfT aren't going to implement something that extends their life

TVMs will remain, though fewer in number. There always needs to be a way to buy tickets at the station. Not everyone has or will be willing to have a smartphone, or it may have been lost or stolen.

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Fail to see the logic in this. You've bought the tickets, know or have chosen the delivery system - paper or e ticket, so the responsibility is on you to ensure you can present the ticket when required.

It's great when people who never make mistakes post, isn't it?

This would be an effective replacement for ToD (once the TfL issue is sorted) and a good piece of customer service.

 

[Trainbike46]

I also don't see what this is a solution to. The only thing I am the slightest bit interested in when I purchase a ticket is is it valid for my journey. What it looks like and its format is of no interest or importance.

The purpose is to move to one format, instead of the many formats currently in use. Most people would likely use it as an eTicket, but for people who can't or don't want to it would be similar to ToD.

It's not an unusual system, it is (more or less) in use at Translink in NI, and Eurostar uses something to this effect too.

For cross London and zone tickets paper tickets are not much good. TfL have a problem reading the Aztec code even though the ticket is perfectly valid. There’s a thread on here somewhere about it.

Likely this would not come in until the TfL issue has been sorted. I'm surprised that wasn't done as part of a TfL funding settlement.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I assume the same could apply in areas with an internet connection with the ticket numbers below our eticket codes, it's just that scanning it is so much easier than typing, and allows for storage of more data so less internet connectivity is required.

There isn't currently a central database of e-ticket numbers and the associated ticket, so the barcode contains the full encoded ticket. I would like to see us move to a central database which would allow a move to a completely medium agnostic e-ticket system, and I think we are probably within ten years or so of the mobile network (including satellite) being good enough to do that.

 

[transportphoto]

I would love to have the ability to solve the problem of “my phone is about to die, I can’t charge it…”, I’d love to be able to help the older generation who aren’t as confident with their phones by saying “it’s okay, let me give you a paper copy”.

If we can make the central database happen, rather than all the information being held on the barcode, this is a small feature that will help so many.

 

[Starmill]

SNCF has been doing this for years. It's embarrassing it's not possible here...

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Jun 2025 ==

It would require a single source of truth for e-ticket data (i.e. one e-ticket database everyone would be required to feed into) but I think that would be a good thing anyway under GBR.

It doesn't even need that. Most TVMs now have scanners... Literally all it needs to do is read the ticket and copy it to paper.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It doesn't even need that. Most TVMs now have scanners... Literally all it needs to do is read the ticket and copy it to paper.

That too. But in the interests of widening the market, allowing a non-smartphone user to book a ticket on a PC, scrawl the UTN on a piece of paper and print it at a TVM by typing that in is another useful use case. Home printers are dying out as a thing.

A further one that would be of benefit in terms of the "single source of truth" would be that one could scan any e-ticket or enter its code at a TVM and use the TVM to rebook it, upgrade to first class, reserve or change a seat or request a refund if desired. My ultimate goal would be for it to be possible to carry out all retail actions on a ticket at all points of sale, be that a website, a phone app, a TVM, a booking office (if any are left) or even a guard or other ticket inspector on board.

 

[Starmill]

That too. But in the interests of widening the market, allowing a non-smartphone user to book a ticket on a PC, scrawl the UTN on a piece of paper and print it at a TVM by typing that in is another useful use case. Home printers are dying out as a thing.

A further one that would be of benefit in terms of the "single source of truth" would be that one could scan any e-ticket or enter its code at a TVM and use the TVM to rebook it, upgrade to first class, reserve or change a seat or request a refund if desired. My ultimate goal would be for it to be possible to carry out all retail actions on a ticket at all points of sale, be that a website, a phone app, a TVM, a booking office (if any are left) or even a guard or other ticket inspector on board.

Absolutely, yes. The SNCF machines do link you by the surname of any passenger and the reference number. Your suggested aftersales are therefore available.

 

[HSTEd]

The whole point of the push towards etickets is the beancounters eventually want to be able to get rid of TVMs, RDG/DfT aren't going to implement something that extends their life

I'd argue the push is against ticket offices, not against TVMs.

TVMs printing on till roll cost essentially nothing to operate. Staff are expensive.

 

[Energy]

I'd argue the push is against ticket offices, not against TVMs.

TVMs printing on till roll cost essentially nothing to operate. Staff are expensive.

TVMs on till rolls are an even cheaper capital investment, as the railway can use off-the-shelf kiosks that KFC, McDonald's, etc. use, rather than needing rail industry-specific ones to print on CCST.

Fail to see the logic in this. You've bought the tickets, know or have chosen the delivery system - paper or e ticket, so the responsibility is on you to ensure you can present the ticket when required.

Passengers are paying customers, and being able to print an e-ticket on paper is a useful, cheap-to-run facility. It also helps separate those who intentionally evade fare and those who genuinely have run out of charge.

 

[Devonian]

That too. But in the interests of widening the market, allowing a non-smartphone user to book a ticket on a PC, scrawl the UTN on a piece of paper and print it at a TVM by typing that in is another useful use case. Home printers are dying out as a thing.

A further one that would be of benefit in terms of the "single source of truth" would be that one could scan any e-ticket or enter its code at a TVM and use the TVM to rebook it, upgrade to first class, reserve or change a seat or request a refund if desired. My ultimate goal would be for it to be possible to carry out all retail actions on a ticket at all points of sale, be that a website, a phone app, a TVM, a booking office (if any are left) or even a guard or other ticket inspector on board.

Hear hear. Someone unfamiliar with GB rail ticketing might well be surprised that there is no central "single source of truth" already, and the notion that each ticket is somehow locked to one particular delivery method only is really a bit odd to the layman.

 

[Helvellyn]

I

For cross London and zone tickets paper tickets are not much good. TfL have a problem reading the Aztec code even though the ticket is perfectly valid. There’s a thread on here somewhere about it.

Never said stop printing the orange ticket on TVMs. I could have said "as well" for the paper roll ticket.

 

[HSTEd]

At this point, if Transport for LOndon remain unable to use Aztec tickets, it would likely be cheaper to buy single use paper contactless tickets than continue with magstripe. Such tickets are available for single digit US cents each and have several advantages over magstripe.

But now we have till roll tickets operating well, little point in trying to displace them on Network Rail.

 

[JonathanH]

Would likely need the Ticket on Departure system currently used to collect pre-bought tickets online updated to work for eTickets as well as the current orange ones as a first step. Then replace or upgrade TVMs to print eTickets on Paper Roll. Depends for the latter on if it's possible to upgrade existing TVMs and also whether it's affordable. Definitely something for GBR if it happens though.

A number of TVMs now print barcoded paper tickets instead of orange ticket stock, if the flow is enabled, so that upgrade has already happened.

I think the change being requested in this thread is to be able to print one such ticket, as well as it being issued as an e-ticket to the phone, in the same way that someone could have printed the e-ticket on their home printer.