Merseyrail Class 777 introduction updates

[TRAX]

As a ride is experienced by an individual, whether it is viewed as inferior or not can only be a personal opinion.

It depends. Some people prefer a softer or firmer ride.
If I prefer a softer ride, a softer bogie will be a superior ride quality to me.

 

[Vespa]

As a ride is experienced by an individual, whether it is viewed as inferior or not can only be a personal opinion.

The questions then being : do most/many people share the view? And if so are they bothered?

I've ridden on it I can say the ride is smooth, however because of the increased acceleration I seem to notice the rail joints more.

Class 331 has a much smoother ride then it's a much heavier train, whereas the 777 is a much lighter train, the idea behind it is lighter trains use less energy which saves money.

Overall the ride quality is not an issue for me, seat comfort is more important, I hope the 777 seats will soften over time as its quite firm.

 

[transportphoto]

Hello… apologies if I’ve missed this, but are the new units out on specific diagrams? Is there any predictability?

 

[TheSel]

Hello… apologies if I’ve missed this, but are the new units out on specific diagrams? Is there any predictability?

Please see posts #3812 and #3947. 777009 on it today.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've just found out that Merseyrail have gone for level boarding at 960mm.

UK standard platform height is 915mm.

Thus, if these units do ever operate more widely e.g. past Ormskirk to Preston, there won't be level boarding unless a dedicated platform is used.

Madness. What's the point in a standard if you don't follow it? What is it about Merseyrail and their utter inability to follow National Rail standards? It's like HS2 all over again.

 

[Meerkat]

I've just found out that Merseyrail have gone for level boarding at 960mm.

UK standard platform height is 915mm.

Thus, if these units do ever operate more widely e.g. past Ormskirk to Preston, there won't be level boarding unless a dedicated platform is used.

Madness. What's the point in a standard if you don't follow it? What is it about Merseyrail and their utter inability to follow National Rail standards? It's like HS2 all over again.

Do we know why they chose that? What they already had, or what Stadler wanted to build???
Whats the impact if they raised non Merseyrail platforms - having to gauge clear everything else that might go there?

 

[Sam 76]

I've just found out that Merseyrail have gone for level boarding at 960mm.

UK standard platform height is 915mm.

Thus, if these units do ever operate more widely e.g. past Ormskirk to Preston, there won't be level boarding unless a dedicated platform is used.

Madness. What's the point in a standard if you don't follow it? What is it about Merseyrail and their utter inability to follow National Rail standards? It's like HS2 all over again.

David Powell says this on his Twitter if this helps … https://twitter.com/davidpo22194359/status/1622728910529069057?s=46&t=VF8CQKi-etxTGR12Y6hNNA

 

[Bletchleyite]

Whats the impact if they raised non Merseyrail platforms - having to gauge clear everything else that might go there?

Freight loading gauge is the usually quoted issue as to why we can't do level boarding just by raising existing platforms to normal UK train height, and why HS2's 1100mm is absolutely nuts.

I suppose you could get away with it by e.g. dedicating P4C at Preston or the bay at Wigan Wallgate, for example of likely extensions. But if Wapping came about and the City Lines became mixed-use you'd lose level boarding.

David Powell says this on his Twitter if this helps … https://twitter.com/davidpo22194359/status/1622728910529069057?s=46&t=VF8CQKi-etxTGR12Y6hNNA

Roughly paraphrased as "We're Merseyrail, we do our own thing".

 

[class387]

I've just found out that Merseyrail have gone for level boarding at 960mm.

UK standard platform height is 915mm.

Thus, if these units do ever operate more widely e.g. past Ormskirk to Preston, there won't be level boarding unless a dedicated platform is used.

Madness. What's the point in a standard if you don't follow it? What is it about Merseyrail and their utter inability to follow National Rail standards? It's like HS2 all over again.

Could it be that it's easier to fit electrical components under the train and have a more level floor with the slightly higher door height?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Could it be that it's easier to fit electrical components under the train and have a more level floor with the slightly higher door height?

I'm sure it is - the point is that standards are standards, to be complied with, not things to be ignored if it's a bit difficult.

 

[Skie]

I've just found out that Merseyrail have gone for level boarding at 960mm.

UK standard platform height is 915mm.

Thus, if these units do ever operate more widely e.g. past Ormskirk to Preston, there won't be level boarding unless a dedicated platform is used.

Madness. What's the point in a standard if you don't follow it? What is it about Merseyrail and their utter inability to follow National Rail standards? It's like HS2 all over again.

I think you're making a mountain out of a small step. The Merseyrail platforms were all adjusted to the NR standard. There is still a small step up to the train, but the platform filler fills the gap and makes it easy to get onboard.

 

[Sam 76]

I think you're making a mountain out of a small step. The Merseyrail platforms were all adjusted to the NR standard. There is still a small step up to the train, but the platform filler fills the gap and makes it easy to get onboard.

Out of interest also surely many platforms would need to be adjusted in order for trains like the 777s. It just so happens Merseyrail have gone first in adjustments and I’m sure any places they use will be moved to this. So like you say it’s probably not a big thing and has almost certainly been discussed in terms of extensions

 

[Skie]

Out of interest also surely many platforms would need to be adjusted in order for trains like the 777s. It just so happens Merseyrail have gone first in adjustments and I’m sure any places they use will be moved to this. So like you say it’s probably not a big thing and has almost certainly been discussed in terms of extensions

The beauty of it is they just need to make them compliant with a Network Rail standard. It won't take them out of gauge doing it, because all trains should handle those heights fine. And then a 777 can rock up and have level boarding.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think you're making a mountain out of a small step. The Merseyrail platforms were all adjusted to the NR standard. There is still a small step up to the train, but the platform filler fills the gap and makes it easy to get onboard.

So the platforms are 915mm, the sliding step is sort of in the middle, and the floor is 960?

Are the Greater Anglia units the same then?

The difference between 915 and 960 is 45mm, I guess that'd be two 20-25ish mm steps up? Is the top of the step about 20mm below the fioor? It does look about that, in which case my massive apologies to the train designer for misunderstanding!

 

[Vespa]

45mm is 1.77 inches, not exactly a big difference, its manageable.

That said dedicated platforms in Wigan or Preston can be adapted, assuming Wapping gets opened up to use the City line the platforms can be adapted as well, as for the current mainline fleet EMU like class 331 or TPE you still have to step up for them anyway, never seen a level boarding on any of them, ramps are still needed.

 

[MattRat]

45mm is 1.77 inches, not exactly a big difference, its manageable.

That said dedicated platforms in Wigan or Preston can be adapted, assuming Wapping gets opened up to use the City line the platforms can be adapted as well, as for the current mainline fleet EMU like class 331 or TPE you still have to step up for them anyway, never seen a level boarding on any of them, ramps are still needed.

I think the first to be looked at adapting should be Helsby, as it's the most logical extension outside of the current commitment at Headbolt lane when it opens.

 

[Phillipimo]

So the platforms are 915mm, the sliding step is sort of in the middle, and the floor is 960?

Are the Greater Anglia units the same then?

The difference between 915 and 960 is 45mm, I guess that'd be two 20-25ish mm steps up? Is the top of the step about 20mm below the fioor? It does look about that, in which case my massive apologies to the train designer for misunderstanding!

The sliding step also hinges down slightly when stepped on. This brings the edge down to platform level.

 

[py_megapixel]

I think mountains are being made out of molehills here. The 745s, 755s, 231s and 756s all have floor heights of 960mm, and offer level boarding at UK standard platforms.

The links are to Stadler press release things. They're in German - "Fussbodenhöhe, Niederflur" in the "Fahrzeugdaten" section refers to the height of the low-floor sections, and in all cases they show 960mm. If you dig around on Stadler's website I think you can find English versions as well, but Google found the German ones more easily for whatever reason.

 

[DJH1971]

Heard 777018 made its working debut today

 

[Liverpool 507]

Heard 777018 made its working debut today

Yesterday, on Friday

 

[D821]

Where are they up to with 8-car working with the units? Someone said there were problems that needed to be ironed out, a while back.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Where are they up to with 8-car working with the units? Someone said there were problems that needed to be ironed out, a while back.

There's a closure of Liverpool Central coming up to rejig a few things there for it including the reversing siding I believe. The platforms also need lengthening at Southport - has that been done yet? Kirkby, if needed, will be dealt with by moving to Headbolt Lane (though I don't think there are any Kirkby line 6-car sets now?) Ormskirk will probably need a signal moving as I'm fairly sure the 6-cars went right up to it. Any others?

 

[LA50041]

Good morning, is there a 777 on the usual diagram today?

Edit To answer my own question, 009 is indeed out

 

[jamesst]

Where are they up to with 8-car working with the units? Someone said there were problems that needed to be ironed out, a while back.

They aren't at the moment, there's a problem depending on where the units were built of them basically not talking to each other.

 

[Amos]

Would anyone know if they are out today? I am hoping I may be able to catch one on the way to the game.

 

[Liverpool 507]

There's a closure of Liverpool Central coming up to rejig a few things there for it including the reversing siding I believe. The platforms also need lengthening at Southport - has that been done yet? Kirkby, if needed, will be dealt with by moving to Headbolt Lane (though I don't think there are any Kirkby line 6-car sets now?) Ormskirk will probably need a signal moving as I'm fairly sure the 6-cars went right up to it. Any others?

Southport is currently being done, with little bits each night and some Sunday possessions up to Hillside. All the sidings have been occupied over the weekend, something I've certainly not seen before.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

They aren't at the moment, there's a problem depending on where the units were built of them basically not talking to each other.

Is that because half of them speak Polish and the other half Romansch?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Would anyone know if they are out today? I am hoping I may be able to catch one on the way to the game.

777 009 is reported as being out today - two posts above yours.

 

[Amos]

777 009 is reported as being out today - two posts above yours.

Thanks,the 18.05 looks perfect timing.

 

[Vespa]

Is Central station Northern line closed only on weekends ?