Mmi failure

Jon1930

Member
Joined
15 Jun 2019
Messages
48
I’m confused now. So have you had an MMI before? I assume if so, this just ‘timed out’, As you say you have met the standard before?

It’s not necessarily the fact that the examples weren’t strong enough, in fact, judging by your feedback, it sounds like they were good examples? It’s how you communicate the responses to any probing questions that counts just as much.
He is NOT the OP, similar usernames.
 
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4F89

Member
Joined
17 Aug 2018
Messages
428
I’m confused now. So have you had an MMI before? I assume if so, this just ‘timed out’, As you say you have met the standard before?

It’s not necessarily the fact that the examples weren’t strong enough, in fact, judging by your feedback, it sounds like they were good examples? It’s how you communicate the responses to any probing questions that counts just as much.
2 choos, 3 choos.... Good for 10
 

ratbag

Member
Joined
22 May 2019
Messages
34
Some of the tests to become a train driver, I believe was peer reviewed by a cauliflower. The peer review world is corrupt. I know, because I worked in advertising, before becoming a research fellow at a Think-Tank. Nothing is what it seems, and there are frauds, and dishonest people everywhere. Businesses today that are zombies, who can barely make their interest payments are valued at over $45 billion, are only going concerns purely because the Central Bank is intravenously feeding them QE, but to the public the narrative is "all is well and good".

I don't trust the OPC, due to its opaqueness. They have a monopoly, and it's in their interest to have a revolving door or clients. The days of taking people, politicians, and companies at face value was over circa 1990. They lie in their own self interest. Don't judge a company by its words, but by its deeds. From my perspective the opaqueness of the OPC's scoring for testing is one of concern. Nobody knows what they officially are, and the OPC never lets on. Why?

If you want to be a member of the SAS special forces, you know from the outset, what fitness level, shooting accuracy, pain threshold etc you need to attain. You want to be a typist, you'll know they want a minimum of 60 words per minute. The same applies in multiple fields. You want to know how many lines to achieve, and incorrect answers to achieve an enhanced Group Bourdon score, and it's shrouded in secrecy greater than the riddle of the Sphinx. You fail a computer test, and their is no feedback, or computer verification what your score was, IE: The attainment score needed was 78/100, and you scored 76, followed by a print-out of the questions you got right, and the ones you got wrong.

This gives the OPC enormous power, with zero oversight. They could be running a rigged ship, and nobody would know. Then we come back to that magic word, TRUST! There's an old saying, Trust, but verify. With the OPC, no verification can be done. You simply have to take their word for it. Any testing procedure where negligible, to zero feedback is given, where it's either a pass or fail, and you are not even told where you failed is not a good system.
 

Applepie356

Member
Joined
23 Sep 2019
Messages
67
Location
Swanley
I don’t think OPC is out there to fail you. They most likely do the MMI ‘by the book’.

While if you do the MMI with an in-house assessor employed by the TOC, then they’d probably be a bit more lenient/relaxed, just a bit though. You obviously still need relevant experience to answer the Q’s and they by no means spoon feed you the answers.

That’s just an assumption.
 

4F89

Member
Joined
17 Aug 2018
Messages
428
Some of the tests to become a train driver, I believe was peer reviewed by a cauliflower. The peer review world is corrupt. I know, because I worked in advertising, before becoming a research fellow at a Think-Tank. Nothing is what it seems, and there are frauds, and dishonest people everywhere. Businesses today that are zombies, who can barely make their interest payments are valued at over $45 billion, are only going concerns purely because the Central Bank is intravenously feeding them QE, but to the public the narrative is "all is well and good".

I don't trust the OPC, due to its opaqueness. They have a monopoly, and it's in their interest to have a revolving door or clients. The days of taking people, politicians, and companies at face value was over circa 1990. They lie in their own self interest. Don't judge a company by its words, but by its deeds. From my perspective the opaqueness of the OPC's scoring for testing is one of concern. Nobody knows what they officially are, and the OPC never lets on. Why?

If you want to be a member of the SAS special forces, you know from the outset, what fitness level, shooting accuracy, pain threshold etc you need to attain. You want to be a typist, you'll know they want a minimum of 60 words per minute. The same applies in multiple fields. You want to know how many lines to achieve, and incorrect answers to achieve an enhanced Group Bourdon score, and it's shrouded in secrecy greater than the riddle of the Sphinx. You fail a computer test, and their is no feedback, or computer verification what your score was, IE: The attainment score needed was 78/100, and you scored 76, followed by a print-out of the questions you got right, and the ones you got wrong.

This gives the OPC enormous power, with zero oversight. They could be running a rigged ship, and nobody would know. Then we come back to that magic word, TRUST! There's an old saying, Trust, but verify. With the OPC, no verification can be done. You simply have to take their word for it. Any testing procedure where negligible, to zero feedback is given, where it's either a pass or fail, and you are not even told where you failed is not a good system.
Yeah, give out the answers first, I'm sure that will find suitable candidates....

The gatorate is strong today, no?
 

Paulm36

Member
Joined
5 Jun 2017
Messages
127
I’m confused now. So have you had an MMI before? I assume if so, this just ‘timed out’, As you say you have met the standard before?

It’s not necessarily the fact that the examples weren’t strong enough, in fact, judging by your feedback, it sounds like they were good examples? It’s how you communicate the responses to any probing questions that counts just as much.
I think the confusion is coming from to very similar user names
 

Choooochoooo

Member
Joined
28 Mar 2020
Messages
6
Location
Middlesbrough
Thanks for the comments chaps, much appreciated. A few days later and I’m still totally gutted at the fail in the mmi on “communication”
I can only think that I’ve either spoke to much with not enough detail or not structured things correctly. That said during the interview I was stopped a number of times within a sentence or two of starting speaking about something and asked a question. I found this off putting in a way as I kind of put you off and lead you away from what you were saying.
As some have stated in this thread I don’t think the OPC fail people on purpose however with the mmi there is obviously the human element and I would be surprised if the assessors get it right 100% of the time. Anyhow I will wait my six months and then I will go again and hopefully pass second time around even if I have to sit the assessment privately. Still bemused as to what “communication” is though And I find it strange that they don’t give you a clear answer as to why you have failed
 

4F89

Member
Joined
17 Aug 2018
Messages
428
That said during the interview I was stopped a number of times within a sentence or two of starting speaking about something and asked a question. I found this off putting in a way as I kind of put you off and lead you away from what you were saying.
That is 90% of what the MMI is about, throwing spanners in the works, making sure you can stay on message. Its by far the hardest part of the process. High tension situation, just like real life when poo and fan collide.
 

HLE

Established Member
Joined
27 Dec 2013
Messages
1,326
They do that to put you under pressure and see how you react. How you come across on the back of it seems to me how they score it.

Its why the MMI is a challenge with constant interruptions. The DMI is the complete opposite, they won't prompt you, interrupt you etc. on the competency questions. Its all written down so go slow on the talking. Current bobbies are the favourite by then if you pass the MMI so go slow when answering.
 

HLE

Established Member
Joined
27 Dec 2013
Messages
1,326
That is 90% of what the MMI is about, throwing spanners in the works, making sure you can stay on message. Its by far the hardest part of the process. High tension situation, just like real life when poo and fan collide.
Depends on the TOC from what I see on here, and what I'm told on the railway by those involved in it all, both sides of the desk. The DMI is the hardest bit for some TOCs.
 

EssexGonzo

Member
Joined
9 May 2012
Messages
485
I think there are another few things to remember about any recruitment process. You seem to have nailed the technical and non-human side of the process.

Firstly, they're not infallible or perfect. Often judgemental. They could have got it wrong. You could be the right candidate but - in this case - the process has not identified that. This happens.

Secondly, the "soft" skills. I don't know what MMI is but I'm guessing that it involves some sort of interaction with a human being. Maybe they didn't warm to you? Maybe they picked up on some edge or attitude that raised their eyebrows? You've put the word "failed" in inverted commas as if it's "alleged" or "so-called". Does this indicate some sort of entitlement or bitterness from the first failure to get through the process? Could that have come across to them?

And finally, this is not a democratic process. You being successful depends upon one or a very few number of people and it's down to them. There is no comeback, recount or appeal.Suck it up and move on.

Sounds like you're nearly there - take what you know and turn it around. Good luck next time.
 

Bucephalus

Member
Joined
5 Feb 2018
Messages
287
OP
Firstly, good luck for next time. You're clearly very close to cracking this.

My thinking is that in order to pass all six questions in an MMI you effectively just have to answer all six questions right?

I appreciate the answers require detail and need to be solid examples but doesn't passing these merely confirm that the candidate has sufficient work / life experience to be a train driver - essentially verification of the paper sift?

When I received feedback for my SWR interview I was told, amongst other things, that I didn't communicate clearly or make enough eye contact.

In my Tramlink interview I was halted mid-sentence with additional questions, something that certainly threw me off.

My point (and assumption) is that, should a good train driver find themselves in a situation where they are bombarded with information, they will still communicate clearly and concisely. I think the MMI is just a sneaky way of simulating the real job
 
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