National Express bringing back double deckers

[the101]

Coach engines are just adapted truck engines thats why it was mentioned.

The only 'adaption' of a truck engine to use it on a coach is a couple of air-con compressors bolted on, and in some cases a higher coolant volume for saloon heating. The engine itself in these coaches is the one that Scania uses in trucks, just as is the case with DAF, Mercedes-Benz, MAN, Volvo and whichever other manufacturers are supplying engines for coaches.

'Notadriver' would do well to understand that the DC-13 is one of the biggest engines available in a coach of any kind. It is not going to be found wanting in NX's double-deckers.

 

[Mwanesh]

National Express is bringing back double deckers after being absent for years, because of the M25 overturning incident with a Neoplan.

It is suggested that from 29th October it will be using Scania Cataeno Levante styled double deckers on the A1 route from London. There have been trials in Birmingham, the info is on the Oxford and Chiltern bus page with pics.

Now if double deckers do make a proper return nationwide with National Express, which makes of double deckers would Parks of Hamilton use? They have been one of the biggest users of double deckers for National Express, and a long history of double decker use out of Plymouth when it was Trathens, as I understand Dennis Parks doesn't like the Cataeno's because they are not a good coach, and some other reasons too, which have heard from various sources, which is why he uses Plaxton Elites out of Plymouth Burrington way depot, and plaxton's in Scotland, I think choices could be Vanhool, VDL, Setra, and though not double deckers could use Elite Interdeckers.

Would people like to see double deckers back with National Express?

Which make would you like?

I might try the Cataeno double-decker out and report on it, and know what other people think too?

Setra does not make any double deckers or tri-axles in right hand drive.Its only the Tourismo now for the UK market.I dont think National Express will go for Van Hool because the Van Hool integral is powered by Daf .

 

[richw]

Setra does not make any double deckers or tri-axles in right hand drive.Its only the Tourismo now for the UK market.I dont think National Express will go for Van Hool because the Van Hool integral is powered by Daf .

I understood Setra don't make anything in RHD now.

Surely there is a history with Parks and the Neoplan Skyliners, but more recently in their non nat-ex they have some Jonckheere double deckers

 

[the101]

The only realistic suppliers of double-deckers for fleet orders such as NX's are Van Hool and Caetano. There is too much to break on a Beulas and Ayats are unlikely to have the capacity to build many, or the interest, but they will build on Scania. Additionally the importer of the new VDL 'decker (which also brings in Beulas) chases margin, not volume.

There are rumours of a Plaxton double-decker in development. If they are true, Souter is a very likely customer.

 

[Robertj21a]

The only realistic suppliers of double-deckers for fleet orders such as NX's are Van Hool and Caetano. There is too much to break on a Beulas and Ayats are unlikely to have the capacity to build many, or the interest, but they will build on Scania. Additionally the importer of the new VDL 'decker (which also brings in Beulas) chases margin, not volume.

There are rumours of a Plaxton double-decker in development. If they are true, Souter is a very likely customer.

Indeed, he might have even encouraged them !

:roll:

 

[westcoaster]

Saw a national express double decker at luton interchange this morning on the A1 service.

 

[talltim]

I'm not sure how long a vehicle is has anything to do with how fast it may or may not go up hills.

Really? A longer coach will be heavier :roll:

 

[Robertj21a]

Really? A longer coach will be heavier :roll:

Not necessarily.

 

[jaig]

Are they in service yet?

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[AnonymousUser1]

Really? A longer coach will be heavier :roll:

given the thicknesses of material required for structural strength and stiffness ness vs the thicknesses for ease of workign and corrosion resistence you might be suprised , it;s al so nearly 20 years since i was tught the calacualtiosn and haven't really used them since

 

[the101]

Really? A longer coach will be heavier :roll:

Perhaps you are not as smart as you think you are. Did you even read the point about torque?

That a 12.8m Plaxton Leopard on a Volvo chassis is substantially lighter (by well over a tonne) than a 12.2m Yutong acts as a good example of how you are wrong. You would also do well to compare the very long integral coaches such as the Futura 2 and Irizar i6 tri-axles to those that are shorter but heavier, such as body-on-chassis Scanias and similar.

Of course, if you have some kind of evidence to show how a vehicle's length directly affects how fast it may climb a hill, please share it with us all.

 

[talltim]

I though rail nerds were bad. :roll:
Of course a longer coach may be lighter than a shorter one, depending on the construction, fittings, etc. However, generally, bigger things are heavier.
Plus a really long coach might have issues going up hills as it couldn't cope with the gradient transitions and would bottom out. So there

 

[SpacePhoenix]

I though rail nerds were bad. :roll:
Of course a longer coach may be lighter than a shorter one, depending on the construction, fittings, etc. However, generally, bigger things are heavier.
Plus a really long coach might have issues going up hills as it couldn't cope with the gradient transitions and would bottom out. So there

Single decker coaches can struggle up hills as it is, let alone a double decker. As you head west out of Bridport towards Charmouth and Chideock single decker coaches really struggle there.

The only double decker coaches that I've ever seen over the last few years have been foreign ones.

 

[AnonymousUser1]

Single decker coaches can struggle up hills as it is, let alone a double decker. As you head west out of Bridport towards Charmouth and Chideock single decker coaches really struggle there.

The only double decker coaches that I've ever seen over the last few years have been foreign ones.

define ' struggle' as is slow to walking pace ? required 'banking' or to off load pax ?

of doesn;t go up the hill as fast as you can in your appendage substitute teutonic leased vehicle ?

 

[TRAX]

You need to compare what's comparable, ie the same coach models. Even if the model is identical, a 15 m Scania Interlink will be heavier than a 14 m Interlink, and this solely based on length (ie. more chassis, more body, more equipment...)

 

[DD12]

I think if I was buying new bus or coach, I'd want proof that it could get up a 1 in 3 hill, when fully laden with fat passengers, and bottles of duty-free, - on the basis that it's performance is only going to decline with age !!

 

[SpacePhoenix]

define ' struggle' as is slow to walking pace ? required 'banking' or to off load pax ?

of doesn;t go up the hill as fast as you can in your appendage substitute teutonic leased vehicle ?

Couldn't have been much quicker then walking pace, think it might have been partly to do with how the gearing was set up in NX coaches at the time

 

[ooo]

I've noticed one being used on the 040 from Bristol a number of times this week

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[Bungle965]

I've noticed one being used on the 040 from Bristol a number of times this week

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All I believe have been transferred to Edwards due to inability to cope with the amount of luggage on the Airport services.
Sam

 

[D2007wsm]

A lot of the 040s this week have been the double deckers with some operated by single deckers. The 200s and 202s to Heathrow and Gatwick have still been single deckers.

 

[richw]

I've noticed one being used on the 040 from Bristol a number of times this week

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All I believe have been transferred to Edwards due to inability to cope with the amount of luggage on the Airport services.
Sam

A lot of the 040s this week have been the double deckers with some operated by single deckers. The 200s and 202s to Heathrow and Gatwick have still been single deckers.

I don't think saying they've been transferred is correct. Edwards won the contract for that route commencing 1st May and have purchased 30 new deckers for their new contracts. They've also a number of single deckers as well.

 

[swifty]

I don't think saying they've been transferred is correct. Edwards won the contract for that route commencing 1st May and have purchased 30 new deckers for their new contracts. They've also a number of single deckers as well.

They've actually got 24 new Boa Vistas and the 6 that were with Nat Ex ops at Luton have moved to Avonmouth as mentioned above. A lot of the new stock hasn't arrived yet by the look of things, a new batch of tri-axles was mentioned but I've not seen any in use.

 

[Martin1988]

A number of 65 plate tri axle levantes that were with SGBC have now been transferred to Edwards and are being used on their NX routes.

Not all of SGBC's NX diagrams have transferred to Edwards.

Skills(Nottingham) are currently doing the 330 from Penzance to Nottinghan and 337 from Rugby to Paignton, Chalfont are currently doing the 302 from Bristol to Northampton and Lucketts are covering some journeys on the 200 to Gatwick.

Also, the extra weekend journeys on the 040 are currently being covered by Applegates, Bennetts Coaches and rather suprisingly RATP Bournemouth. Bennetts Coaches are also doing the sunday only 318 service from Bristol to Birmingham.

 

[swifty]

A number of 65 plate tri axle levantes that were with SGBC have now been transferred to Edwards and are being used on their NX routes.

I didn't think Durbin had any tri-axles apart from the original 57 plate batch and the 3 of a similar vintage from Nat Ex, and even out of those not all are left?

 

[Temple Meads]

I didn't think Durbin had any tri-axles apart from the original 57 plate batch and the 3 of a similar vintage from Nat Ex, and even out of those not all are left?

Pretty sure this is correct.

The 65 plate two axle batch does appear to have transferred to Edwards though.

 

[j.crocker355]

Couldn't have been much quicker then walking pace, think it might have been partly to do with how the gearing was set up in NX coaches at the time

Oxford Tube Van-hools don't struggle up the gradients on the M40

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[pitdiver]

I have just received information from a source within Nat Ex regarding the tri-axles at Luton.

They have all been transferred to Edwards, This is the information I received "Extremely true. It was a nightmare. We had around 10 drivers off with injuries or back problems. All the Decker's are now with Edwards on the direct London to Bristol service"

 

[DD12]

They've actually got 24 new Boa Vistas and the 6 that were with Nat Ex ops at Luton have moved to Avonmouth as mentioned above. A lot of the new stock hasn't arrived yet by the look of things, a new batch of tri-axles was mentioned but I've not seen any in use.

* Please let me know (anyone) if any of these are to be used on Southbound services from Bristol -
ie - to South-West or Southern England.

Thanks.

 

[Mwanesh]

* Please let me know (anyone) if any of these are to be used on Southbound services from Bristol -
ie - to South-West or Southern England.

Thanks.

I dont think Edwards goes beyond Weston Super Mare corrections if i am wrong.That is Parks territory beyond that hope it helps.

 

[Welshman]

I have just received information from a source within Nat Ex regarding the tri-axles at Luton.

They have all been transferred to Edwards, This is the information I received "Extremely true. It was a nightmare. We had around 10 drivers off with injuries or back problems. All the Decker's are now with Edwards on the direct London to Bristol service"

I may be missing an obvious point here, but what is it about the deckers that has caused injuries and back problems for Luton drivers, but from which Edwards' drivers are immune?