National Express Coaches Discussion

[route101]

I haven't been on a National Express coach for years, but recently I looked into it to get to London while the trains had strike issues. I expected to be able to get a service from Runcorn, which I'm sure was something available in the past. Not anymore, its basically from Liverpool City Centre and thats about it. Very little from Chester or Warrington to London either. Looks like the service has changed a lot since I last took the coach.

The cross country routes have been trimmed back. Birmingham is a hub for them.

Was it ever promoted or advertised?
Has anyone ever seen National Express advertise specific service reintroductions or improvements in local and regional media? For example when service 460 started serving Rugby a few months back, did anyone in the Rugby area see local publicity of any kind?
When the 788 was introduced from Peterborough to Heathrow a few weeks ago, would anyone in that fine Fenland city have the foggiest idea it had begun? Genuinely curious to know.

Its like that for all the big three. There was a 184 Edinburgh to Liverpool service which operated for about five months, blink and you miss it.

 

[Teds]

Was it ever promoted or advertised?
Has anyone ever seen National Express advertise specific service reintroductions or improvements in local and regional media? For example when service 460 started serving Rugby a few months back, did anyone in the Rugby area see local publicity of any kind?
When the 788 was introduced from Peterborough to Heathrow a few weeks ago, would anyone in that fine Fenland city have the foggiest idea it had begun? Genuinely curious to know.

I live in the catchment area for the route and have an NX account which I have not used for several years. I was sent an email about the new service which was useless. This part of the text:

'Our brand new Peterborough to Luton and Heathrow Airport routes travel up to six times a day with stops including Peterborough, Sleaford and Hitchin. With fares from £14.40 one-way we’re making airport travel affordable for all.'

Unfortunately, the route does not service Sleaford and does serve Cambridge which may be the most significant source of traffic.
When I used National Express, I always boarded at Cambridge which is the nearest point for me and also has a pick up at a Park and Ride with free parking for day trips.

 

[frodshamfella]

When services resumed after being suspended for the pandemic, apart from the services between the largest cities, the network is very different, with fewer places served.

I had no idea there seems a much reduced network now.

 

[route101]

I had no idea there seems a much reduced network now.

We would have seen more destinations back by now if the old network was to come back.

 

[Deerfold]

I had no idea there seems a much reduced network now.

When I first started catching National Express coaches, my most common trip was Nottingham to Leeds - that used to run every two hours, increasing to hourly at certain times all on the Bradford - Leicester service group with some going further, with 1 overnight trip on the Halifax to London service. Now theres 5 a day, 2 of them overnight, on 4 different services.

 

[route101]

I wonder if a frequent turn up and go service on busy corridors would like city link do in Scotland

 

[Deerfold]

I wonder if a frequent turn up and go service on busy corridors would like city link do in Scotland

Is this something you're suggesting? They've reduced services between most places. There's around 16 a day between London and Leeds (though on various different services) but only 5 or 6 extend to Bradford with none to Keighley/Skipton/Harrogate.

There's an astounding 31 a day between Birmingham and London on half a dozen different services. There was a half-hourly express service before Covid.

 

[Wilko82]

We would have seen more destinations back by now if the old network was to come back.

Yes many destinations will never come back as even before the pandemic the network, mainly on the cross country routes was gradually getting thinner and thinner. For example a year before Covid, the 315 service that used to go all along the south coast from Helston to Eastbourne had been cut to run from just Plymouth to Bournemouth. Also the 304 which used to run from Liverpool down to Weymouth had been reduced to Birmingham to Weymouth only and even then this truncated route was axed prior to the pandemic. I believe other routes that had already been axed prior to Covid were the 571 Whitehaven to London and the 461 Lichfield to London.

 

[dan5324]

I did say many pages back that many stops and services would never return. They’ve been wanting to trim the network for years. Covid gave them an excuse to accelerate that.

 

[M60lad]

Would a Manchester-Sheffield service ever make a return to the National Express network? I remember when there used to be a a number of services that used to do the route back before COVID continuing to various different places after Sheffield.

 

[Titfield]

I did say many pages back that many stops and services would never return. They’ve been wanting to trim the network for years. Covid gave them an excuse to accelerate that.

Yes indeed, it seems difficult from the perspective of an interested observer to determine what, if any, their route strategy is.

 

[Man of Kent]

There's around 16 a day between London and Leeds (though on various different services) but only 5 or 6 extend to Bradford with none to Keighley/Skipton/Harrogate.

While it involves a change, there's through ticketing via Transdev to Keighley and Harrogate, which offers a much greater frequency than would ever be possible by through coach.

 

[Deerfold]

While it involves a change, there's through ticketing via Transdev to Keighley and Harrogate, which offers a much greater frequency than would ever be possible by through coach.

They do. From Keighley I can pay an extra £6 to get the bus that's £2 if you pay on the bus to Leeds (before the recent drop, it was £3.60). And 87 stops and up to 1 hour 48 minutes later, I'm in Leeds. And which I could have done before. Or for less than £6 and in less than half an hour I can get the train to Leeds (though I do then have to cross the city centre).

The only advantage of the limited services from Harrogate and Keighley was not having to change.

 

[JonathanH]

Yes indeed, it seems difficult from the perspective of an interested observer to determine what, if any, their route strategy is.

The strategy seems reasonably clear to link major centres of population with Airports, London, Birmingham, Manchester and Leeds.

 

[Titfield]

The strategy seems reasonably clear to link major centres of population with Airports, London, Birmingham, Manchester and Leeds.

Thank you. However it has been the comments on this forum about routes been started and then dropped relatively quickly despite seemingly no marketing that has concerned me.

From Bournemouth (my nearest big centre of population) there is a good service to London, LHR and LGW but Birmingham is only twice a day and that is about it.

You used to be able to get to places along the southcoast, south wales (via bristol) and the north of england (Manchester) but those routes seem to have disappeared.

 

[route101]

Thank you. However it has been the comments on this forum about routes been started and then dropped relatively quickly despite seemingly no marketing that has concerned me.

From Bournemouth (my nearest big centre of population) there is a good service to London, LHR and LGW but Birmingham is only twice a day and that is about it.

You used to be able to get to places along the southcoast, south wales (via bristol) and the north of england (Manchester) but those routes seem to have disappeared.

Yes the 160 service is quite limited. The 035 service is fairly frequent and well used.

 

[Titfield]

Yes the 160 service is quite limited. The 035 service is fairly frequent and well used.

Getting from Bournemouth to / from Heathrow it is the mode of choice for me. Beats getting the train to Woking and then the Rail Air Link.

 

[embers25]

Getting from Bournemouth to / from Heathrow it is the mode of choice for me. Beats getting the train to Woking and then the Rail Air Link.

Surely train to Basingstoke then Flightline from outside the station is best now at 4 quid each way only from Basingstoke.

 

[Titfield]

Surely train to Basingstoke then Flightline from outside the station is best now at 4 quid each way only from Basingstoke.

Thanks. I will take a look at that suggestion.

 

[Llandudno]

When I first started catching National Express coaches, my most common trip was Nottingham to Leeds - that used to run every two hours, increasing to hourly at certain times all on the Bradford - Leicester service group with some going further, with 1 overnight trip on the Halifax to London service. Now theres 5 a day, 2 of them overnight, on 4 different services.

Northern’s relatively recently introduced hourly semi-fast Nottingham -Leeds service using new trains has probably taken most of National Express’s passengers.

Mind you standing is a common occurrence on this Northern route as trains consist of only 2 coaches

 

[Deerfold]

Northern’s relatively recently introduced hourly semi-fast Nottingham -Leeds service using new trains has probably taken most of National Express’s passengers.

Mind you standing is a common occurrence on this Northern route as trains consist of only 2 coaches

That's true - when I was doing it, the wait at Sheffield pretty much wiped out any time saving on the train - but the coaches continued a similar timetable until 2020.

 

[frodshamfella]

What coach service are there from Liverpool now, besides London ?

 

[JonathanH]

What coach service are there from Liverpool now, besides London ?

Timetable finder https://timetables.nationalexpress.com/routes suggests

170 and 171 Liverpool to Leeds
175 Llandudno to Manchester

Otherwise, it is 423 / 550 / 551 to London.

 

[markymark2000]

https://bustimes.org/licences/PD0000738 - several routes seem to have been reregistered as local buses from the start of December, my understanding being that all previous registrations were cancelled during COVID. Does anyone know if there's any timetable/route changes coming around that time, or if this is just to allow local tickets to be sold again (or not even that, but I can't think of any other reason to)?

It seems like they are just permitting local travel again. Journeys booked online showing from £2 fare but to buy onboard it's more expensive such as Worthing to Brighton is £5.40 which is not competitive at all considering the 700 is £2. I am really baffled by NatEx decisions to start registering the services again if they are just going to go back to their ways of charging stupid fares for short distance travel.

There's some routes where the local travel makes sense both from the perspective of connections but also filling gaps in the transport network such as the Forest over to Gloucester (albeit fares for local travel should be much more reasonable when bought onboard) but some of the registrations are just pure barmy. Oxford Gloucester Green to Thornhill on the 210 for example, given the amount of local buses running and you have the Tube and Airline running 24/7, why is anyone at all going to use NatEx? Oxford isn't enough of a NatEx hub either for people to use the 210 to connect to/from other routes at Gloucester Green. Similarly, the 707 will permit local journeys from January next year for journeys between Northampton Town Centre and Northampton London Road. What is the actual point? As the registration doesn't extend to Milton Keynes, I am sure that it would still mean that local journeys can't be taken between these stops at Milton Keynes Coachway so the whole thing I think is a bit of a waste in these instances.

 

[johncrossley]

Before Covid, some coach fares used to undercut local bus fares. Also, because of their 7 day a week timetable, they offered early morning travel opportunities on Sunday. It was often cheaper to split fares at the nearest big city.

 

[markymark2000]

News coming out today that Edwards Coaches have bought 68 new Scania Levante 3As and 10 VanHool Altano overdeckers for National Express work.

Edwards to add 86 new coaches for holidays and NatEx work - routeone

Edwards Coaches will add 82 new vehicles to its National Express and holidays fleets under a number of current orders, it has revealed.

www.route-one.net

Edwards Coaches has announced details of a huge fleet investment plan. It will result in the arrival of 86 new coaches in an investment of over £32 million as the South Wales business observes “a positive outlook in 2024.”

The bulk of that total is accounted for by 68 Caetano Levante 3A models built on tri-axle Scania chassis that will be deployed on Edwards’ National Express services. That represents a spend of £25.7 million. The first Levantes were delivered towards the end of 2023 for use from depots in Llantrisant and Swansea. The remainder will arrive “throughout the course of 2024,” the operator says.

In a notable further development, Edwards has ordered 10 Van Hool Altano overdeck coaches, also for use on National Express work. Such a purchase marks a return to the National Express fold for Van Hool after many years away. Each of the Altanos will cost £480,000 and they are expected to arrive in June.

 

[Butts]

I had a good experience travelling on National Express Service 210 from Heathrow Terminal 5 to Birmingham International on Friday December 22nd at 1330 and back to T5 from Digbeth Coach Station at 0030 in the early hours of Boxing Day.

Both services were lightly loaded and on time. I booked the Coach due to the uncertainty of Rail Services (or unavailability Boxing Day)

Seat 2A is definitely the premier bookable seat (just behind the single disabled one) with acres of legroom. A snip at £3 each way. .

 

[paul1609]

I've done Victoria to both Exeter and Cheltenham in the past couple of weeks. The Exeter trip down was going on to Penzance and was about 25 mins late by Exeter due to congestion around Bristol, it was probably the latest coach I've been on for some years. Coming back I was on a Totnes starter which was very busy but on time at Victoria. The Cheltenham services were on time both ways. I was surprised at the Cheltenham journey time; 2hr 30 is pretty good.

 

[route101]

I've done Victoria to both Exeter and Cheltenham in the past couple of weeks. The Exeter trip down was going on to Penzance and was about 25 mins late by Exeter due to congestion around Bristol, it was probably the latest coach I've been on for some years. Coming back I was on a Totnes starter which was very busy but on time at Victoria. The Cheltenham services were on time both ways. I was surprised at the Cheltenham journey time; 2hr 30 is pretty good.

I took the 590 from Glasgow to Birmingham last week and we were nearly an hour late. As it is a single manned service, the driver takes a break at Digbeth so no chance to claw time back.

 

[paul1609]

I took the 590 from Glasgow to Birmingham last week and we were nearly an hour late. As it is a single manned service, the driver takes a break at Digbeth so no chance to claw time back.

Interestingly the London to Penzance service i did down to Exeter did a driver change at Sedgemoor (Weston super mare ish) services on the M5. The oncoming driver wanted to push on but the ex London driver had already announced a 20 min break. if theyd skipped the break it would have been almost on time at Exeter. I prefer Megabus services from london to Glasgow now because they dont take all the services breaks.