National Rail: Moved on or stuck in the past?

Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by Dave A, 22 Jun 2005.

Has National Rail moved on, gone backwards or frozen to a moment in the past?

  1. Moved On

    100.0%
  2. Gone backwards

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Frozen in time

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Dave A

    Dave A Established Member

    Messages:
    1,163
    Joined:
    7 Jun 2005
    IMO: National Rail has got stuck in the past to when computers had Windows 95 on them. This is when technology was advancing at a steady speed. When some things seemed "Like a good idea at the time".

    But the ONLY thing that seems to have "improved" is the New rolling stock (their words not mine!) But even they haven't improved, "cough" Virgin Pendolinos "cough" ;). So what has? Vandalists run riot in this age of hightened security, trains now have more delays and by the looks of things, nothing has moved on!

    What seems to of happened is the Rail Network has moved on to fast. When the "new" technology came out in the mid 90's, the rail network picked it up in the late 90's and early 2000's. Then guess what happened?, technology moved on at a staggering speed. With millions invested in the "latest" technology, it all moved on!

    Is a long period shut down of the rails the only way of putting things right, because remember, while 1 train is out of service because of vandalism another is doing twice the work which eventually leads to that train braking down and so on costing a lot of money and doing the same, if not more, amount of damage as a long-period shut down would.

    So what do you think. Has the National Rail Moved on, gone backwards or is it frozen in time somewhere?
     
  2. Registered users do not see these banners - join or log in today!

    Rail Forums

     
  3. AlexS

    AlexS Established Member

    Messages:
    2,890
    Joined:
    7 Jun 2005
    Location:
    Just outside the Black Country
    Trains aren't delayed as often as they were under BR.
     
  4. yorkie

    yorkie Administrator Staff Member Administrator

    Messages:
    44,622
    Joined:
    6 Jun 2005
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    Can we have an "it varies by line" option? As some lines (e.g. the ECML, Chiltern) are much better off, some are little changed and some are worse off.

    The economy is doing better now than under BR, there are more people travelling generally, so you'd expect there to be more services.

    Some companies have done a good job catering for this growth and even encouraging it, eg GNER and Chiltern.

    Unfortunately on some routes unreliable trains have replaced reliable trains and that puts people off travelling.

    Big ticketing pros such as more choice and impartial ticketing are offset by negatives such as ridiculous anomalies, more complex fare structures (and they want to make it worse with 'congestion charging'!) etc. The introduction of the routeing guide may have cleared up some routeing issues but it has also caused many new problems, anomalies and is a nightmare to use.

    The new trains in use vary widely from the best being GNERs 'White Rose', to the worst being the hopelessly unreliable Junipers (and any other units that have abysmal reliability).

    BR were forced to use cheap Pacers by the Tory Government at the time, but now there is no 'lack of funding' excuse for unreliable trains costing far, far more money than the Pacers did.
     
  5. yorkie

    yorkie Administrator Staff Member Administrator

    Messages:
    44,622
    Joined:
    6 Jun 2005
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    On which lines?

    Bear in mind that these days railways are being renewed at a much greater rate than BR was allowed to achieve. With modernised signalling, tracks etc you would expect there to be less delays.

    Unfortunately when delays do happen they can cause more problems to passengers these days due to lack of priority given to express trains and few attempts to maintain connections.

    Yes there may be slightly less delays but how many are due to the stopper being let out ahead of the express so that "only one train is late", leaving dozens of passengers severely delayed as a result?
     
  6. Dave A

    Dave A Established Member

    Messages:
    1,163
    Joined:
    7 Jun 2005
    Plus the fact that the pay 2 to 3 times more anyway. The stoppers problem is quite big on my local line WAGN because you've got GNER's AND semi-fast WAGN. I use to see quite often a HST doing something like 40mph through New Southgate both ways :shock:
     
  7. Guinness

    Guinness Established Member

    Messages:
    3,737
    Joined:
    13 Jun 2005
    I guess there weren't as many delays then because there weren't as many services now! XC had irregular trains, the WCML was stuck with different trains going at different speeds. WCML and ECML are really quite different. For one the WCML has many more curves on it than the ECML as thats more flat and straight.

    Technology has rapidly moved on since BR thanks to Mobile Communication on the Internet. Alstom built the Pendolino but had to use TASS (Tilting Stuff) and the Pendo had many more electrics and computers than Mk3s and HSTs for example Toilets are computerized and so is the bogies. If one thing goes wrong it can be very inconvient for the passengers. Some BR Technology was good though. Without the APT there would be no Tilting on Britains Railways nor would be Mk4 Coaches! NR benifits from Technology too. Without it there would be no IECC or SimSig! (Don't quote me on it though as I'm not sure when IECC came :lol:). Going back to Alstom, there resent trains are proberly why the Washwood Heath Plant closed. For example, Class 175s they couldn't be put into service because they had many problems with the Brakes. Some trains went on a runaway where as others their Brakes melted away. After 4 years or so since they were built, they are now excellent trains IMO :). But unforantly they never learned from there mistakes as we can see in some early cases on the Pendolino. So overall my vote would have to go for its moving on. :)
     
  8. Dave A

    Dave A Established Member

    Messages:
    1,163
    Joined:
    7 Jun 2005
    Bring back the good old slammers! The first train I remember going on is a slammer to Clacton-on-sea. First "new" EMU I went on was a 375, the air con was broken :roll: After many years I get on a slammer replacing a 375/7, what happens? "The train in front has broken down", and guess what train it was? That's right a 375/7! :roll: :P. We should go back to modernising the old trains, non of this "computerised toilets" :?: ROFL :mrgreen:
     
  9. Coxster

    Coxster Established Member

    Messages:
    9,244
    Joined:
    9 Jun 2005
    No we shouldn't - they're too old. The only cost effective thing to do is buy the new trains. The old trains were not good for disabled people - if they could get on, they had to sit in the guards van. A right bummer if they need the toilet!
     
  10. Dave A

    Dave A Established Member

    Messages:
    1,163
    Joined:
    7 Jun 2005
    Not to start an argument but I have never seen a disabled person get on a National Rail train. Besides they have their coach trips and special buses. What about the 314's - 317's. Hardly ever hear of a problem with them :) :?:
     
  11. Guinness

    Guinness Established Member

    Messages:
    3,737
    Joined:
    13 Jun 2005
    If your a manager of a TOC. How would you be able to get around....

    a) All slammers must be gone by the end of the year
    b) Disabled Discrimination Act

    Now are TOCs going to scrap multi-million pound trains? In favour of the slower, ageing ones. Also the fact that half the slammers have been scrapped.... :roll:
     
  12. AlexS

    AlexS Established Member

    Messages:
    2,890
    Joined:
    7 Jun 2005
    Location:
    Just outside the Black Country
    Bearing in mind from personal experience that the trains I use personally are now usually on time to 10 mins late, compared to the previous 10 mins to 30 mins under BR, which we expected. Admittedly Birmingham to North Wales services have got worse, with every train I have seen going that way this week registering a 10 minute delay or more. To work it all out, I guess we would have to list every line.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page