National Railway Museum Changes

[Gaz67]

Don't think I'll bother visiting a museum full of rusty tin cans with just a board giving very dull technical info about it. Certainly not going to capture the imagination.

What is wrong with some interactivity showing how things work and creating a relationship between what you're looking at and real life?

Rusty tin cans , wow, it's that how you view a Deltic or Mallard, think your on the wrong forum pal.

 

[gswindale]

Rusty tin cans , wow, it's that how you view a Deltic or Mallard, think your on the wrong forum pal.

You've completely missed the point!

As far as I am concerned, a trip to a museum should be fun, interesting and educational for all.

Therefore fine to have a few static, possibly rusting, exhibits with some techno babble signs that means nothing to anybody without a degree in 19th Century engineering.

But, if you want to educate, then create something that actually captures the imagination of those you want to educate.

Having a mk1, mk2 and mk3 carriage at next to each other is interesting in that you can see how designs have changed, but is no different to sitting on a street bench watching cars go by.

Involve people by giving them something to do and then maybe they'll think that this is an industry I'd like to work in.

Leave it as a bunch of static exhibits behind a barrier and they'll just think this is boring - let's go to the cinema next time

 

[Mountain Man]

they are the ones the real people want to see. They don't care about Westerns or D200. They might care about an HST.

You're absolutely correct.

You see it more easily in an equivalent situation. Airshows

At big airshows, every year, it's the red arrows that get the most attention.

Are they rare? No, they are one of a number of Hawk teams, and one of the most easily seen display teams in the UK

Are they likely to be impactful on day to day lives? No, the role demos are showing that more than formation aerobatics.

Are they appealing to enthusiasts? No, they are a convenient break for a drink for a lot.

But the reality is, icons draw the crowds in whatever situation.

Do you go to car museum to see a Ford GT40 or Ford Mondeo?

You cannot both say "the people the NRM need to attract don't care about diesels" and "a Deltic is as much a museum piece as FS and would be something out of the ordinary for most 21st century people". They fundamentally contradict each other.

No it doesn't.

He isn't saying no diesels at all, he is saying not a major focus. He specifically mentioned there should be some, relevant to the overall major history of railways. Which is correct.

Museum , a building where items of historical significance are displayed. Who took it on themselves to totally change the ethos of the NRM?. Take your stem to another venue , it is important but does not need shoehorning into our important collections ( RAF Cosford another victim of this). Seeing comments on here about what belongs and what doesn't based on what you liked as kids , really? . This is about preserving our railway heritage , warts and all , and it's all being sacrificed to attract the tik tok generation, god help us.

Not in the modern world of funding they aren't.

They are competing for discretionary time and spend against entertainment attractions.

Museums that don't focus on visitor numbers and revenue generation shut. That is simple economic reality. Even the big London museums have to sacrifice to a degree.

Preservation costs, and unless you find ways to generate money, it doesn't happen, and for a museum that means footfall of the public not just enthusiasts.

There is no point being idealistic, it's cold economic reality

 

[Russel]

I've always found the NRM to be a bit too focused on steam.

Multiple units have made up the majority of passenger trains in this country for 30+ years and before that, there was huge fleets of 1st generation DMU's, where is this era recognised within the NRM? The way they only sometimes display a rather sorry looking class 108 unit that was, for years, kept in a tent outside of the main museum buildings, tells me a lot about what the NRM perceive to be of historic note.

 

[Gaz67]

You've completely missed the point!

As far as I am concerned, a trip to a museum should be fun, interesting and educational for all.

Therefore fine to have a few static, possibly rusting, exhibits with some techno babble signs that means nothing to anybody without a degree in 19th Century engineering.

But, if you want to educate, then create something that actually captures the imagination of those you want to educate.

Having a mk1, mk2 and mk3 carriage at next to each other is interesting in that you can see how designs have changed, but is no different to sitting on a street bench watching cars go by.

Involve people by giving them something to do and then maybe they'll think that this is an industry I'd like to work in.

Leave it as a bunch of static exhibits behind a barrier and they'll just think this is boring - let's go to the cinema next time

You do realise that the NRM has free entry, therefore comparison with a theme park is moot for me. There is at least some acceptance that it is about preserving our heritage rather than making money.

I agree that museums need to be hands-on where possible, in a railway museum this could be brake van rides, signalling demos, access to cabs and engine rooms.

My first visit to the rail museum was on a schools special (class 40 hauled) from South Manchester in the late '70s; if I had them been guided into a building resembling a science lab run by adults I would have run a mile haha.

Like I said, there is a place for STEM, but they don't have to sacrifice our past. A last word about Cosford, a Jaguar doing undercarriage retractions at the air show last year with everything clanking into place, where would you rather be as a kid, watching that or in a sterile hangar with weekend teachers doing johnny ball impressions.

 

[gswindale]

You do realize that the NRM has free entry, therefore comparison with a theme park is mute for me. There is at least some acceptance that it is about preserving our heritage rather than making money. I agree that museums need to be hands on where possible, in a railway museum this could be brake van rides, signalling demos , access to cabs and engine rooms. My first visit to the rail museum was on a schools special(40 hauled) from South Manchester in the late 70s, if I had them been guided into a building resembling a science lab run by adults I would of run a mile haha. Like I said there is a place for STEM but they don't have to sacrifice our past. A last word about Cosford, a jaguar doing undercarriage retractions at the airshow last year with everything clanking into place, where would you rather be as a kid , watching that or in a sterile hangar with weekend teachers doing johnny ball impressions.

Where did I compare to a theme park?

On your last point, somewhere between the 2. I'd have much rather seen real world examples of the action, but with somebody who knows what they're talking about explaining what is going on.

 

[Gaz67]

Where did I compare to a theme park?

On your last point, somewhere between the 2. I'd have much rather seen real world examples of the action, but with somebody who knows what they're talking about explaining what is going on.

What you mean like a flight sergeant( or whatever the rank is) supervising RAF recruits, then the jag on jacks is for you I suspect.

 

[yorkie]

.... where would you rather be as a kid, watching that or in a sterile hangar with weekend teachers doing johnny ball impressions.

I don't understand what this means, or the relevance of a comparison related to air shows. Kids clearly have a lot of fun at Wonderlab; the video shows that.

What you mean like a flight sergeant( or whatever the rank is) supervising RAF recruits, then the jag on jacks is for you I suspect.

I don't understand what this means or the relevance of it either; perhaps you can elaborate?

 

[jupiter]

Been several times pre-refurb. I’ve seen a lot of steam engines. I’m more interested in diesels particularly 1st generation DMUs. I’m interested in signalling and there’s a lovely old training system tucked away. I think making more of those aspects (sorry) would be good.

 

[Gaz67]

I don't understand what this means, or the relevance of a comparison related to air shows. Kids clearly have a lot of fun at Wonderlab; the video shows that.

I don't understand what this means or the relevance of it either; perhaps you can elaborate?

Think it's self explanatory to be honest. As I said in an earlier post there is a place for STEM and it's at every primary school in the country. Once kids enter secondary education they are being prepared for the workplace. We need the future engineers/ technicians to maintain our buses, trains and trams, look after the national grid and utilities, get our fighter jets into the air etc. I know this is a NRM thread but I found it easier to use Cosford to make my point. Imagine a hangar at Cosford with say 4 jaguars in or even Typhoons that are to be taken out of service soon, call it Flight line and run it as it would in the RAF with proper demos a couple of times a day and allowing the kids to get close up and live it, the same thing at NRM with a modernish emu with say a traction motor lifted out . Living relevant museums run by people who have been in the RAF or worked in the rail industry. From what I've seen of stem it has very little relevance to the jobs we want these kids to be doing. Last point, the reason our F 35 force is wafer thin is largely down to trained engineers, pilots and airframes too but mainly engineers, what's going to attract these kids, seeing an F35 in the hover at Cosford or sending washing up liquid bottles to the ceiling of a dull corporate looking hangar. Sorry to go off topic but as I said I find it easier to make my points having experienced this at Cosford airshow last summer. Also a previous point about the tik tok generation was unfair and made late at night after a few beers, apologies.

 

[SimplyLlama]

The signalling section and the viewing balcony are back open! Link:https://www.railwaymuseum.org.uk/whats-on/viewing-balcony

 

[Russel]

Looking forward to the station hall reopening, I'd like to visit again but no point going while only half the museum is open!

 

[Leedsbusman]

Had a pleasant visit to NRM today.
It was very busy indeed which was good to see with people of all ages enjoying the museum.

I understand Flying Scotsman’s display ended today - does anyone know if it’s moving somewhere? It was a great idea to split the loco and tender with a viewing platform in between.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I understand Flying Scotsman’s display ended today - does anyone know if it’s moving somewhere?

I think it's off to the NRM's other location at Shildon until the new locomotive management contract is awarded.

 

[Mat17]

I guess the take home from this is - we all want different things.

A museum only had so many spaces/resources etc. and has to prioritise what it aims to achieve. A guess a ramshackle collection with no overall direction brings in some people but doesn't really have a key audience and will never really do well.

A museum that has a focus and a key overall view will attract one type of visitor and totally put off another.

There is no doubt that many do go to the NRM to see steam - Mallard, Flying Scotsman etc. I will admit myself, that I always pay Mallard a visit. I see the importance of its history. I also see the importance of a 2-BIL and 4-COR even though I've never been on a third rail unit in my life. History is found in many places.

My favourite exhibit is probably the most boring for many people but I always wander by the lonely class 76 - historically very important, of local interest to me, yawn for most visitors.

Likewise I like the 108, many happy memories of first gen DMUs - and there's the nostalgia draw.

 

[LBMPSB]

My favourite exhibit has always been the sectionalised Merchant Navy no. 35029 Ellerman Lines.

 

[75A]

Me too, but then I am a Southern man.