National to Enhanced question

[WombleGuard]

Hello,

If you've passed all tests and MMI to national standard and you sit them again to try to reach Enhanced what happens to your national standard pass if you fail?

 

[Kayle]

It depends on the score. If you fail enhanced, but still meet national standard pretty much nothing happens, but if you fail to achieve at least national standard then your previous scores will be overwritten unfortunately and you lose one of your lives.

 

[YingYing]

As above. Your most recent result always overwrites previous attempts.

 

[NorthernTech]

As YingYing said, I believe a new attempt overrides any previous attempts. So if you pass to national standard still, but don’t hit the enhanced score that the TOC you are applying to accepts (the enhanced scores differ unlike the national standard), then you don’t lose a ‘life’. But if you fail, you lose one of your two lives and you cannot apply to any trainee driver job for the next six months. If you held a pass previously, it would be gone and you now just hold a fail. Then if you fail a second time its you out, no more chances to apply.

 

[WombleGuard]

Thanks all.

 

[Duffman76]

So... What exactly is the increase in the 'benchmark' so to speak from standard to enhanced??

I was under the impression that some tests were scored on the candidates average on that particular day, as long as it was at a particular pass mark, unknown to candidates.

So what would enhanced be then?

 

[WombleGuard]

So... What exactly is the increase in the 'benchmark' so to speak from standard to enhanced??

I was under the impression that some tests were scored on the candidates average on that particular day, as long as it was at a particular pass mark, unknown to candidates.

So what would enhanced be then?

Good question. It's all a bit of a dark art isn't it

 

[NorthernTech]

So... What exactly is the increase in the 'benchmark' so to speak from standard to enhanced??

I was under the impression that some tests were scored on the candidates average on that particular day, as long as it was at a particular pass mark, unknown to candidates.

So what would enhanced be then?

There is no enhanced mark, there is only the National pass mark. The test marks don’t change as per the standard of the group, well the national pass mark does not. As for the enhanced marks, there are no set standards for this, the companies that want to only accept candidates who pass some of the tests at a higher pass mark, for whatever reason or skill this may be assessing, set the mark they want to accept. They are not the same ‘enhanced‘ level as far as I understand, and only some tests are asked to be at a higher mark, they sometimes ask for extra tests too. But one thing is for sure, you are unlikely to ever find out what the marks actually are, but if you read this forum, you will find out roughly what people think they got and whether they passed or failed.

 

[Jaytrains]

What if you’ve passed at national level and you sit the dfft to get the enhance results, do your test scores start the 5 year validation again?

 

[NorthernTech]

What if you’ve passed at national level and you sit the dfft to get the enhance results, do your test scores start the 5 year validation again?

No idea! Sorry. But normally enhanced pass companies want more than a dfft test as far as I’m aware. Group Bourdon seems to be one test they need at a higher/enhanced level, although you could well have reached that level when you/someone passed it when doing the standard national tests, I’m that makes sense. It’s all rather confusing in some respects, would be so much easier if everyone knew what they were aiming at, but hey..

 

[Jaytrains]

My mate passed at national and only had to sit the dfft and sjt to reach the enhanced level, but he failed the dfft

 

[D Rivers]

In addition to this, sorry to jump on your post. I passed tests to enhanced in 2020. These are valid for 5 years iirc.

If these lapse do I still have 2 lives?? Are they only fail lives? Could I in reality take them every 5 years if I keep on passing??

 

[NorthernTech]

In addition to this, sorry to jump on your post. I passed tests to enhanced in 2020. These are valid for 5 years iirc.

If these lapse do I still have 2 lives?? Are they only fail lives? Could I in reality take them every 5 years if I keep on passing??

Yeah it’s only a fail that would lose a life. But your enhanced score for one TOC/FOC you passed with may not be acceptable to the enhanced score that another may want, as they may want an even higher mark. Enhanced scores are train company specific (I believe), not universal.

 

[Stigy]

In addition to this, sorry to jump on your post. I passed tests to enhanced in 2020. These are valid for 5 years iirc.

If these lapse do I still have 2 lives?? Are they only fail lives? Could I in reality take them every 5 years if I keep on passing??

Bear in mind also that the length of time they’re valid isn’t based on them being national/enhanced. Different TOCs/FOCs allow passes for different lengths of time depending on their policy (from 1 to 5 years - usually 3 or 5 though).

 

[D Rivers]

Bear in mind also that the length of time they’re valid isn’t based on them being national/enhanced. Different TOCs/FOCs allow passes for different lengths of time depending on their policy (from 1 to 5 years - usually 3 or 5 though).

Yeah I know. Northern is 2 which is a bit odd when some of the big boys ie. Xc are 5 years!

 

[CreamNCookies]

Extract from an email I received from Northern states psychometrics are valid for 5 years;

"We would like to remind you that your Psychometric Assessment will remain valid for 5 years from the date taken."

 

[D Rivers]

Extract from an email I received from Northern states psychometrics are valid for 5 years;

"We would like to remind you that your Psychometric Assessment will remain valid for 5 years from the date taken."

Well that’s a bonus. I was told 2!

 

[Owen2323]

Say you're a qualified driver working at a TOC that 'only' required National level and apply for a job with a TOC that requires enhanced. Presumably you'd have to do the tests again or at least the one's you hadn't done to enhanced standard? What if you didn't pass even to the National standard.....?

 

[Marshy]

@Owen2323 once your qualified, you don't have to do any psychometric tests again. You can go to any TOC (as long is your license is clean)

 

[Owen2323]

@Owen2323 once your qualified, you don't have to do any psychometric tests again. You can go to any TOC (as long is your license is clean)

I'd wondered about that for a while - thanks for clarifying

 

[No Fault Found]

I passed at National level 2 years back so still have a valid pass. I went for a Trainee Driver position with a TOC that required an enhanced pass and they allowed me to just do the VSE to make it enhanced. And even that they allowed me to do at home on my laptop.

 

[ComUtoR]

@Owen2323 once your qualified, you don't have to do any psychometric tests again. You can go to any TOC (as long is your license is clean)

You don't need a clean license to change TOC.

 

[Stigy]

You don't need a clean license to change TOC.

No, but some TOCs stipulate you do. I guess it depends on the nature of any incidents, and whether you can demonstrate how you’ve learned from them…if you get as far as interview?

 

[Marshy]

You don't need a clean license to change TOC.

That is true but if you have a bad driving record, most tocs won't take you on. I think Eurostar requires a clean license for 5 years

 

[ComUtoR]

No, but some TOCs stipulate you do. I guess it depends on the nature of any incidents, and whether you can demonstrate how you’ve learned from them…if you get as far as interview?

Just like everything else. Meet the criteria for the job and make sure you are better than anyone else. If you have an incident on your record and someone else doesn't then the choice may be determined on that single aspect.

Many Drivers have an incident on their record somewhere and new Drivers within their first 3yrs are at their highest risk. This is well known industry wide. I've known Drivers who have gone 20+ yrs without incident then suddenly have a couple in a row.

When you change TOC/FOC there will be a request for the incident record to be transferred. It's all part and parcel of switching employer.

 

[Carl98k]

Hello,

If you've passed all tests and MMI to national standard and you sit them again to try to reach Enhanced what happens to your national standard pass if you fail?

I did the tests with GTR. I passed to national standard but failed the DFFT. I need to wait 6 months to do any psychometric tests, and I do I’ll only need to pass the DFFT. This came direct from the recruitment cell.