New Brent Cross West (Thameslink) station

[Dima]

Given the low footfall, how justified are the 6 - 8 TPH frequencies, given that the nearby Cricklewood and Hendon get less than that, despite being more popular?

 

[Mikey C]

Given the low footfall, how justified are the 6 - 8 TPH frequencies, given that the nearby Cricklewood and Hendon get less than that, despite being more popular?

The problem with those stations is that their platforms can only take 8 car trains, so the 12 car services can't stop there.

It has created a bit of a daft situation though where a deadly quiet station is far better served than busy ones! Indeed maybe they should just have opened BCW with it solely being served by the 8 car stoppers.

 

[Bald Rick]

Given the low footfall, how justified are the 6 - 8 TPH frequencies, given that the nearby Cricklewood and Hendon get less than that, despite being more popular?

The problem with those stations is that their platforms can only take 8 car trains, so the 12 car services can't stop there.

It has created a bit of a daft situation though where a deadly quiet station is far better served than busy ones! Indeed maybe they should just have opened BCW with it solely being served by the 8 car stoppers.

The ‘semi fast’ trains already have pathing time in them to keep them behind the stoppers. Therefore if the stoppers stop, the choice is for the semi fasts to stop also, or not stp with more pathing time. It’s essentially a ‘free‘ stop journey time wise.

 

[PGAT]

The problem with those stations is that their platforms can only take 8 car trains, so the 12 car services can't stop there.

It has created a bit of a daft situation though where a deadly quiet station is far better served than busy ones! Indeed maybe they should just have opened BCW with it solely being served by the 8 car stoppers.

Well 12 car trains technically can stop there. The overnight Bedford to Brighton trains stop, and on the opening day there were 12 car shuttles between Luton and St Pancras

 

[Dima]

The problem with those stations is that their platforms can only take 8 car trains, so the 12 car services can't stop there.

Luton - Rainham trains that stop at Brent Cross West but not at Cricklewood and Hendon also have 8 coaches.

The ‘semi fast’ trains already have pathing time in them to keep them behind the stoppers. Therefore if the stoppers stop, the choice is for the semi fasts to stop also, or not stp with more pathing time. It’s essentially a ‘free‘ stop journey time wise.

Then why not stop at Cricklewood and/or Hendon instead?

I suspect the schedule will be adjusted soon. It doesn’t make sense to have more frequencies there than at the neighbouring stations.

 

[Kite159]

It will be like Barking Riverside & Meridian Water, quiet until the housing (& other buildings) gets built.

 

[AlastairFraser]

Then why not stop at Cricklewood and/or Hendon instead?

I suspect the schedule will be adjusted soon. It doesn’t make sense to have more frequencies there than at the neighbouring stations.

Because the platforms would need to be extended to take the 12 car semi fasts at Cricklewood/Hendon, or Thameslink would have to install Automatic Selective Door Opening (ASDO) systems there, which aren't cheap.

 

[louis97]

Because the platforms would need to be extended to take the 12 car semi fasts at Cricklewood/Hendon, or Thameslink would have to install Automatic Selective Door Opening (ASDO) systems there, which aren't cheap.

There is nothing stopping 12 car trains calling at either of these stations, I'm fairly sure it must have happened before during service disruption. 700s already have ASDO and use it at many stations they call at.

 

[wagnaga]

There is nothing stopping 12 car trains calling at either of these stations, I'm fairly sure it must have happened before during service disruption. 700s already have ASDO and use it at many stations they call at.

The Cambridge stopping service route has selective door opening as a number of stations have short platforms.

 

[AlastairFraser]

There is nothing stopping 12 car trains calling at either of these stations, I'm fairly sure it must have happened before during service disruption. 700s already have ASDO and use it at many stations they call at.

Isn't ASDO a balise based system that would need to be installed at those specific stations for use?

 

[jon0844]

Isn't ASDO a balise based system that would need to be installed at those specific stations for use?

Yes. If a driver has to select the doors manually, there's a risk of making a mistake - so it would only be for special stop orders and the like, not a regular scheduled service.

But wouldn't all the stations TL can stop at already have these fitted? There are occasions where an 8 car is replaced with a 12 car.

 

[class717]

Isn't ASDO a balise based system that would need to be installed at those specific stations for use?

ASDO on 700s uses GPS at stations where all platforms are the same length

 

[Dima]

Because the platforms would need to be extended to take the 12 car semi fasts at Cricklewood/Hendon, or Thameslink would have to install Automatic Selective Door Opening (ASDO) systems there, which aren't cheap.

To the best of my knowledge, all the trains stopping at Brent Cross West consist of 8 cars.

 

[jon0844]

To the best of my knowledge, all the trains stopping at Brent Cross West consist of 8 cars.

There are some 12 cars during the night I think.

 

[Dima]

There are some 12 cars during the night I think.

Yes, but those also stop at Cricklewood and Hendon.

 

[Basil Jet]

I don't understand how the canopy on the fast platforms ever got built, when it will get so little use. Do we know the BCR for that canopy? Was it just because the developer was paying, so lets have bells and whistles and who cares about the cost?

 

[NSE]

I don't understand how the canopy on the fast platforms ever got built, when it will get so little use. Do we know the BCR for that canopy? Was it just because the developer was paying, so lets have bells and whistles and who cares about the cost?

I can’t imagine it cost much in the grand scheme of the whole project.

 

[jon0844]

Yes, but those also stop at Cricklewood and Hendon.

So those stations must support ASDO then.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I don't understand how the canopy on the fast platforms ever got built, when it will get so little use. Do we know the BCR for that canopy? Was it just because the developer was paying, so lets have bells and whistles and who cares about the cost?

Presumably they thought the fast platforms would get some use, otherwise why build them at all? And I guess if you're going to build them, a canopy is small change next to the cost of building the platforms (including presumably moving track to accommodate the platforms)?

 

[talldave]

Thanks for all the photos/video links. It looks a bit Rochestery. I feel an explory trip to check it out during the school holidays coming on!

No great surprise there. The surrounding area is basically part building site part wasteland! No doubt numbers will increase substantially once new flows to and from the shopping centre establish themselves, and given how many monstrosities blocks of flats are being built locally.

I gather the cement works behind CWD depot is closing, to be turned into yet more flats.

Architect designed apartments, please !!

I wonder how many people are using Brent Cross West to go to Wing Yip? The station has direct Thameslink services to and from Sutton, which has a substantial Hong Kong community.

I feel a Thameslink food thread is needed, as we've previously done a trip to Romford for Cosmo!

 

[Bald Rick]

Then why not stop at Cricklewood and/or Hendon instead?

Because when passenger numbers do take off at Brent Cross West (which they will do), you would have to then take the stops off Cricklewood and/or Hendon. And thats a pretty difficult thing to do politically.

I suspect the schedule will be adjusted soon. It doesn’t make sense to have more frequencies there than at the neighbouring stations.

It wont be.

The station has only been open 2 weeks!

 

[Recessio]

The station has only been open 2 weeks!

And two weeks immediately before Christmas at that!

 

[Sunil_P]

Brent Cross West starting to make its presence felt on London's rail maps!

1) Big Rail and Tube Map
2) "Tube" Map (also shows Thameslink)
3) Farringdon destination "next fastest train" to lost
4) St Pancras platform indicator
5) GoVia Thameslink map at St Pancras
6) Simple Thameslink map at St Pancras

 

[PGAT]

Interesting that they've updated number 5 to show Brent Cross West, but haven't removed Thameslink to King's Cross

 

[Benjwri]

Interesting that they've updated number 5 to show Brent Cross West, but haven't removed Thameslink to King's Cross

there are services to/from it throughout the day on Sundays, and early/late every day.

 

[JKF]

It will be like Barking Riverside & Meridian Water, quiet until the housing (& other buildings) gets built.

I guess it might get some traffic from people employed in the construction of the new housing and offices. Got to be good for that at least.

 

[AlastairFraser]

ASDO on 700s uses GPS at stations where all platforms are the same length

So potentially some platforms would need modification?

Yes. If a driver has to select the doors manually, there's a risk of making a mistake - so it would only be for special stop orders and the like, not a regular scheduled service.

But wouldn't all the stations TL can stop at already have these fitted? There are occasions where an 8 car is replaced with a 12 car.

I'm not sure that it was universally implemented with the Thameslink Programme overruns.

 

[class717]

So potentially some platforms would need modification?

I'm not sure that it was universally implemented with the Thameslink Programme overruns.

ASDO is already implemented either by GPS, or at stations where different platforms have different lengths and also within the core, by use of balise. All that was required for BCZ was an update of the database. All other stations they stop at regularly (including up to Kings Lynn) are already in the database.

 

[talldave]

Today's trip to see the new station scuppered by a signalling meltdown. I think we'll be doing something bus-based instead!!

 

[AlastairFraser]

ASDO is already implemented either by GPS, or at stations where different platforms have different lengths and also within the core, by use of balise. All that was required for BCZ was an update of the database. All other stations they stop at regularly (including up to Kings Lynn) are already in the database.

Ah OK, it's strange to think they wouldn't stop the 12 cars at Hendon/Cricklewood.