No ticket, placed under caution

[nonewthing99]

Hi guys,

This morning I got off the train at Liverpool ST station and didn’t have a ticket because I thought I’d be able to tap through the barriers, whilst trying that I couldn’t get through and GA worker pointed out to another staff member who came over and showed me her badge which looked like a police badge and cautioned me.
To cut a long story short she said I will be expecting a letter as I didn’t have a valid ticket and do not ignore it.
Does anyone have an idea of what the fine will be or what I can expect from it? Obviously don’t want this to go to court so will pay the fine but wanted to get an idea of what I should expect.
FYI, I started my journey at wickford

 

[Snow1964]

If you cooperate, apologise, and haven't come to their attention before then likely to offer you a fixed amount (no negotiation) of full price ticket value plus an admin fee of about £150. Say £200 in total.

If you dont pay, don't reply, then expect it to go to court where you will almost certainly be found guilty, and get a court fine and victim surcharge added (so nearer £500) plus criminal record

 

[nonewthing99]

If you cooperate, apologise, and haven't come to their attention before then likely to offer you a fixed amount (no negotiation) of full price ticket value plus an admin fee of about £150. Say £200 in total.

If you dont pay, don't reply, then expect it to go to court where you will almost certainly be found guilty, and get a court fine and victim surcharge added (so nearer £500) plus criminal record

Very stupid mistake, thanks for letting me know

 

[swt_passenger]

Very stupid mistake, thanks for letting me know

Will TfL records show any history of touching out at Liverpool St without a corresponding touch in? I’m wondering exactly why you couldn’t touch out? Was this a contactless card, or a conventional Oyster PAYG?

 

[JBuchananGB]

A few questions come to mind. What did you attempt to tap with? AFAIK the only device you could tap for a journey from Wickford to Liverpool Street would be a Greater Anglia Smartcard. What made you think that tapping with whatever you used would get you through? As they now have your details, they may well look into online ticket purchasing systems to find out whether there any other anomalies which might interest them. Otherwise you just have to wait for their letter.

 

[nonewthing99]

A few questions come to mind. What did you attempt to tap with? AFAIK the only device you could tap for a journey from Wickford to Liverpool Street would be a Greater Anglia Smartcard. What made you think that tapping with whatever you used would get you through? As they now have your details, they may well look into online ticket purchasing systems to find out whether there any other anomalies which might interest them. Otherwise you just have to wait for their letter.

This was a one off I usually get tickets via Trainline but didn’t today. Learnt my lesson

 

[AlterEgo]

This was a one off I usually get tickets via Trainline but didn’t today. Learnt my lesson

Then you should be careful with how you phrase your “mistake” to Greater Anglia. You can’t pay for that journey on contactless bank card and that should be obvious when you started your journey, as you didn’t tap in. I’d recommend just not mentioning any form of “mistake” or a belief you could pay using contactless and just apologising for not having a valid ticket, which is pretty bland and limits any damage to you.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

Just to confirm what will happen is that Greater Anglia will write to you in the next few weeks. The letter will use quite threatening language and say that they have received a report and are considering prosecuting you. You must not ignore this letter, it is your opportunity to give any information you want Greater Anglia to take into account before they decide how to proceed. You might want to include the following in your reply:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

Greater Anglia are usually prepared to offer an administrative settlement (commonly known as an out of court settlement) to people who engage with the process and who haven't come to their attention before. We cannot guarantee this and they are would within their rights to prosecute you in the magistrates court should they decide to do so.

A potential aggravating factor will be if you have done this before. If they can show that you regularly exit at Liverpool Street without touching in then they will likely want to ask you questions about this and will probably want to include these occasions when calculating the amount of a settlement.

If you are offered a settlement the amount tends to be around £150 plus the outstanding fare at teh full Anytime fare with no credit given for your uncompleted PAYG journey. An out of court settlement might appear to be a fine, but it isn't and you won't have a criminal record as a result of accepting one.

Feel free to post a copy of the letter once it arrives (with personal details redacted) along with your draft reply in this thread and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[JBuchananGB]

If you want to legitimately economise and use Oyster or contactless you could "step-back" at Shenfield. For example you could catch the 0931 from Wickford arriving Shenfield 0946 (with a valid ticket of course), then get off, exit the barrier, tap in with contactless or Oyster and board the 0953 Greater Anglia to London. You only lose 5 minutes on your journey, I'll leave it to you to work out whether it saves you money.