NRE or SWR or SER - higher authority on route validity

[hkstudent]

I am planning to get a cross London ticket from north kent line station within Greater London to Surrey.

However multiple sites have different interpretations on the route, with some be valid via Waterloo, some be valid via Paddington and some be only valid via Redhill.

In this case of confusion, which site would be more authoritative?

 

[AlterEgo]

I am planning to get a cross London ticket from north kent line station within Greater London to Surrey.

However multiple sites have different interpretations on the route, with some be valid via Waterloo, some be valid via Paddington and some be only valid via Redhill.

In this case of confusion, which site would be more authoritative?

The Routeing Guide is the definitive source, but if you wish to use a certain route which is not permitted or otherwise not on solid logic, you should use the site which sells a ticket against the itinerary you want (the most favourable one).

 

[Mcr Warrior]

What are the origin and destination stations, in question?

 

[Watershed]

As the consumer in a business-to-consumer contract, you can rely on whichever is most favourable to you - one of these sites, or the Routeing Guide. Accredited retailers are supposed to adhere to the rules set out in the electronic version of the Routeing Guide, so that is the "bible" of routing validity in a sense - but if they don't, that is solely a matter between them and RSP (the division of the Rail Delivery Group responsible for accreditation matters).

If you want to rely on what a retailer such as SWR or Southeastern is telling you, you should buy your ticket from the relevant retailer in conjunction with the itinerary you want to travel on. You would be contractually entitled to travel in accordance with that itinerary.

Similarly, if you want to rely on what National Rail Enquiries is telling you is a valid route with the ticket you hold (or intend to buy), I'd suggest obtaining a screenshot showing the itinerary in conjunction with the fare in question. NRE is referred to in the Routeing Guide as the way you should check any route you are unsure of, so its information clearly also carries contractual weight.

 

[hkstudent]

As the consumer in a business-to-consumer contract, you can rely on whichever is most favourable to you - one of these sites, or the Routeing Guide. Accredited retailers are supposed to adhere to the rules set out in the electronic version of the Routeing Guide, so that is the "bible" of routing validity in a sense - but if they don't, that is solely a matter between them and RSP (the division of the Rail Delivery Group responsible for accreditation matters).

If you want to rely on what a retailer such as SWR or Southeastern is telling you, you should buy your ticket from the relevant retailer in conjunction with the itinerary you want to travel on. You would be contractually entitled to travel in accordance with that itinerary.

Similarly, if you want to rely on what National Rail Enquiries is telling you is a valid route with the ticket you hold (or intend to buy), I'd suggest obtaining a screenshot showing the itinerary in conjunction with the fare in question. NRE is referred to in the Routeing Guide as the way you should check any route you are unsure of, so its information clearly also carries contractual weight.

But strangely, NRE cannot sell tickets by their own. If no any TOCs referred can ever sell that route, would the route from NRE be valid ever?

 

[30907]

But strangely, NRE cannot sell tickets by their own. If no any TOCs referred can ever sell that route, would the route from NRE be valid ever?

Unless the ticket is an Advance (which I doubt), it can be used on any valid route.

I am intrigued at the routing via Paddington, though.

 

[Watershed]

But strangely, NRE cannot sell tickets by their own. If no any TOCs referred can ever sell that route, would the route from NRE be valid ever?

NRE isn't a retailer - it always passes you to a retailer to buy your ticket. If retailers can't process the request passed over to them, that doesn't invalidate what NRE says.

You could always buy the ticket without an itinerary from a ticket machine or office, or one of the handful of online sites that will sell you a ticket without searching for itineraries. Alternatively you could select a different itinerary when buying online, but then rely on what NRE says to validate the route. As mentioned, NRE is referred to as being an authoritative method of checking route validity in the Routeing Guide, so you are contractually entitled to rely on what it says.

 

[hkstudent]

Unless the ticket is an Advance (which I doubt), it can be used on any valid route.

I am intrigued at the routing via Paddington, though.

The ticket mentioned involved a cross london interchange, and in general most SE upto Gravesend or even Ashford to SW flows have removed cross London function to save the payment to TfL.

I feel that electronic data seems not be validated by via point but where the train starts.

 

[paul1609]

The ticket mentioned involved a cross london interchange, and in general most SE upto Gravesend or even Ashford to SW flows have removed cross London function to save the payment to TfL.

I feel that electronic data seems not be validated by via point but where the train starts.

I dont think it actually effects the payment to TFL. Its more likely to be to do with the acceptance of ITSO smartcards or e tickets.

 

[Watershed]

I dont think it actually effects the payment to TFL. Its more likely to be to do with the acceptance of ITSO smartcards or e tickets.

TfL only get paid for tickets that have a Maltese cross marker on them. This is a long-standing routing that predates privatisation.

 

[paul1609]

TfL only get paid for tickets that have a Maltese cross marker on them. This is a long-standing routing that predates privatisation.

I think it's actually a fixed amount based on predicted traffic flows rather than all tickets with a Maltese cross. My journeys from Kent have a Maltese Cross even when I have an advance with a counted place reservation in on hs1 and one out on LNER or MML.

 

[Watershed]

I think it's actually a fixed amount based on predicted traffic flows rather than all tickets with a Maltese cross. My journeys from Kent have a Maltese Cross even when I have an advance with a counted place reservation in on hs1 and one out on LNER or MML.

It's only predicted in the sense that the amount paid to TfL doesn't vary depending on whether or not the Underground is actually used (given they are issued as magstripe tickets, it's essentially impossible to track usage). My understanding is that if a ticket has a Maltese cross, TfL get paid regardless of anything else.

 

[30907]

The ticket mentioned involved a cross london interchange, and in general most SE upto Gravesend or even Ashford to SW flows have removed cross London function to save the payment to TfL.

Most seem to be routed London Not Und but only if interchange via Waterloo E and Main is the obvious route. A random check of a "Victoria" ticket to a destination not far from Reading showed a Maltese Cross.

I feel that electronic data seems not be validated by via point but where the train starts.

Sorry, don't understand.