Well it goes without saying a payrise is needed. But unlike certain other sectors, most drivers I speak to would be more than happy with 4 percent (provided no daft strings attatched). Sorry if that doesn't fit with the medias "greedy train driver" narrative.
Why is this view the one that’s always taken? The government seem happy to be doing just that also, in many ways other than just encouraging industrial action in many sectors. Where’s the criticism there?
We've clearly been watching different news channels.
I know my definition of rich isn't "not doing badly". That is a *very* long way away from "the rich", and I'd find it impossible to agree with anyone who thinks £60kpa equates to the sort of money "the rich" have, because it's an order of magnitude - no, several orders of magnitude - removed from that.
My definition of rich doesn't touch most people in the top 10th percentile. Neither would many sensible people's. Lumping together people who earn £60,000 (and that's actually at the upper end of train driver salaries), with those earning the same in a month is a real stretch to make a point.
That narrative is out there though!!
I can only talk about my patch (western region) and the consensus is 4 percent with zero strings would probably get through. And I'm confident a Labour government will offer that. Its just a shame we will have another year of this sh*t in the meantime whilst the unelected Sunak continues throwing his weight around trying to look powerful infront of the unions.
Because some people think that railway staff (see also teachers, doctors, nurses, bin men, in fact anyone who isn't them) should be inconvenienced for the rest of their lives to prevent very occasional inconvenience for others.
Does nobody here understand what an anecdote is? I already quoted the stats and yes I agree 1.8 billion of a total of 17 is 10% ish. But stick those extra journeys on the road. Many of them long distance journeys and see what effect it has. Not to mention the time added in a journey from say, Leeds to London.
Try putting yourself in the shoes of someone on the median income, or on minimum wage. Yes, top 10th earners are a long way from the top 1%, but pleas of poverty will fall on deaf ears.
I think my area (Midlands) would accept it too....there is an element of fatigue setting in.
Nobody's pleading poverty, nor crying that train drivers are poorly-paid. But if you think "the rich" starts with people on £60kpa, you're simply detached from reality.
Well if we are talking about productivity, let's talk about what might actually be productive, ie letting GWR drivers drive Voyagers and XC drivers drive IETs where they have the relevant route knowledge. There are many productivity savings to be had, its just the government only want to pick and choose the ones they know will be rejected outright by train drivers and Aslef.......
Indeed, the anti rail staff vibe on here really is odd and thankfully doesn't seem to reflect wider public views. I find the travelling public to be extremely supportive and polite to us in the real world and I've had people come up to me saying they support our action. I am of course referring to "normal" people here, not enthusiasts, just normal every day travellers who can see that we are just doing our jobs and 4 years with no payrise whatsoever is never going to be fair in the current climate.
The public sector pay rises were as a result of the pay review body recommending below inflation rate payrises, and the Government accepted the recommendation because it would have looked terrible if they hadn't! That money won't be new money either, it will be saved from existing budgets.
Nobody is claiming poverty but get real. If you don't know how people build their lives around an income and its ability to fund mortgages, pay loans on cars etc and the effect that inflation yearly has on the ability of a wage to meet those payments as well as paying for the basic needs of a family then I can't take the point seriously.
So why does every other industry not need a self funding payrise, despite the fact none of them contribute a penny to GDP?
Indeed. I risk losing my home next year due to living to my means which have now drastically changed thanks to Tory mismanagement. But hey, I'm just a greedy train driver so no worries.
No I forget you're privy to every public sector union negotiation in the last 24 months
That would just not be possible with the current model, which is still set up as a franchise model even if it isn't really run by franchises these days. Who trains the drivers to drive the other companies stock? What sort of mammoth time consuming project would that be?
You don't think the health service, teachers or the emergency services contribute a penny to GDP????
I agree with you. But if we are serious about cost savings in the long run these are the roads we must look at going down. Not trying to introduce Victorian working practices.
The railways generate wealth for the economy , those industries less so ( though of course they are still absolutely vitally important ). But why are they not expected to make cost savings to fund their 5 or 6 percent payrises?????
3 hour service gaps on the GN. Halved stopping services on the TL route. Rainham services almost removed entirely. GTR customers might just find your assertions ridiculous.
Which assumes... As may seem intent on doing so here... That the DfT is at all open to such negotiations. When the PM tells junior doctors and other public sector workers that he's not interested in negotiating further no matter how much they strike or complain you might want to think a little bit about how his DfT might approach industrial relations.
I am a GTR customer, or I am when they are running. But the point was about the effect on the roads which was basically nil.
So the largest TOC in the country. Facilitating 340 million journeys across the southeast? Let's just cancel that and it'll have no effect that bothers the government. I really can't take a lot of these comments seriously. It's like being camped outside the national conservative convention.
Indeed. I find it amazing there are any Conservative voters left in this country, but hey , clearly there are!
