Passengers self-detrain from LO train 15 July 2019

[Islineclear3_1]

For many many years, many inner suburban trains did not have toilets.

I don't know if a Class 378 falls into the category of an "inner surbaban train" although it does short(ish) journeys with frequent stops

Also, an off-topic suburban EMU class working in SE London also don't have toilets as they too make frequent stops

Anyway this has gone way off thread ...

 

[underbank]

Totally ridiculous and unacceptable in our civilized society where we should be setting example.

As is being trapped in a metal tube for hours. If the rail industry can't work out a way to avoid people being trapped for so long, then they have to provide "facilities" such as toilets, water and heating/cooling.

 

[duffield]

You are

We're meant to be living in a first-world civilized society. You really can't be serious about sitting on and peeing in a bucket-type toilet!? Great, lets have it in the rear cab so that people can form an orderly queue and relieve themselves with some quasi-privacy... How does a person wearing trousers "arrange his/her clothes carefully" in order to do the business?

Totally ridiculous and unacceptable in our civilized society where we should be setting example.

I'm entirely serious *when the alternative is wetting yourself or dangerous detraining*. OK, I get it, you think wetting yourself is 'more civilised' than the bucket. I'll use the bucket. Some others will use it.

And again, I'm not saying *any* of this is right. The situation should not arise. There should be a proper toilet. But *given the current situation* this is where we are on some trains.

I am very explicitly talking about the specific case where there are *no* other choices.

 

[Chris M]

The RAIB have published their safety digest into this incident: https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...vacuating-at-north-pole-junction-15-july-2019

This incident demonstrates the importance of:

• good and accurate communications between staff on the ground, and railway infrastructure and train service controllers
  
  
• effectively supporting the drivers of trains involved in stranding incidents, minimising the time needed to explain things to control centre staff, so that the driver can focus on their passengers and fault finding where practicable (see recommendation 1 of RAIB report 16/2018)
  
  
• undertaking regular and accurate assessments of the situation to understand if it is escalating
  
  
• ensuring that any limitations of equipment, such as GSM-R boundaries, are known and understood by operators with appropriate mitigations in place, or put in place as soon as possible once identified during an incident
  
  
• understanding the risks of passengers remaining in stranded trains for prolonged periods in hot weather without adequate facilities or ventilation
  
  
• regularly updating passengers on a developing situation
  

It shows, once again, a complete lack of anyone taking the lead, no support for the driver who is having to do multiple jobs regarding the train at the same time as trying to manage a train load of increasingly uncomfortable passengers, and failures in whatever emergency planning has been done. It seems the BTP only found out there was a train full of stranded passengers from social media. Even if their presence is not required immediately surely they should be made aware of a situation that has the potential to require their skills (i.e. any train stranded for more than say 10-15 minutes) so they can start preparing their resources so they can be despatched immediately they are required.

This was an incident entirely of the railway's own making and as far as I can see the only reason this was not a full report is that the recommendations from Lewisham (March 2018) and Peckham Rye (November 2017) are still being implemented over a year later.

 

[CentralTrainer]

In summary - “DOO’H”

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Well done to the driver for managing an extremely stressful situation

 

[Taunton]

Kentish Town, Peckham, Lewisham … it just goes on and on. We can add plenty of other examples (eg Pewsey) not on DC lines.

It seems the railway just continues to give no thought to how to deal with straightforward mechanical breakdowns, and particularly none to the impact on passengers. There were 600 passengers in a 5-coach train on a summer evening here which has about 36 seats per coach. That's two-thirds of the passengers standing, real crush-loading. As ever the emergency ventilation and lights failed well before their specified time. Are human beings expected to just be able to stand up for several hours all squashed together with no air supply?

Oh, and well done the poor old, completely unsupported, driver indeed.

 

[PG]

I note that, apparently, according to the ORR all the recommendations of the RAIB report into the Kentish Town incident were met...

They don't seem to have helped in any of the subsequent incidents though. Someone remind me what exactly do the ORR do??

As others have said pity the poor drivers who are struggling without a proper support network whenever these incidents occur.

 

[Taunton]

Ironic isn't it that in the overhead image of the incident point in the report you can see, at the top, the diesel locos standing at Old Oak Common depot. Almost walking distance. However, due to the inane way the railway is organised nowadays, there is zero ability to dispatch any of these to assist the disabled train.