Paying for Taxi During Journey Disruption

[Trains06]

Hi All,

On Friday 6th October 2017 me and a friend tried to travel from Hartford to Liverpool Central, via Liverpool South Parkway. We intended to catch the 21:47 service from Hartford, but on arrival at the station we discovered this train and all subsequent trains were cancelled due to a derailment.

As station staff had gone home and we had limited information on availability of alternative transport, we called National Rail Enquiries and they informed us that the London Midland offices were now closed and that their systems had no information of any rail replacement transport available. The agent made no move to contact LM control and said the only option remaining was to arrange our own means of getting to our destination in the form of a taxi, to request a receipt and send the details subsequently to London Midland for compensation. As this was the only advice we received from a representative of the railway, we took a taxi to our destination at a cost of £70.

I sent an account of the above to LM who responded today that they would be unwilling to reimburse me as they had arranged for coaches to operate between Crewe and Liverpool. This however was not communicated to us at the unstaffed station and NRE did not inform us about this either - the only suggestion they made is that we take a taxi. The LM agent said in her response that she’s sent my complaint to NRE and effectively washed LM’s hands of it.

Would you all consider this a satisfactory response? Had LM communicated to us that coaches were available we would have taken this option but again, the only info we received from the railway was to take a taxi and to get it reimbursed. Do you think I should leave the matter here or pursue it further?

Thanks for your time, if you have any questions relating to the incident then I’d be happy to answer.

 

[185143]

I was at South Parkway that night. LM most certainly did NOT arrange coaches as pretty much every taxi from Liverpool was at South Parkway that night taking people to Runcorn, Hartford, Winsford and Crewe! LM were paying for these however-but for passengers travelling Northbound there would have been a considerable delay.

I was put in one with 2 other passengers at South Parkway at 22:40 heading to Warrington. The driver told me he had a job in Crewe-bringing stranded rail passengers to Liverpool. Several taxi drivers were being difficult about going to anywhere other than Crewe as they had fares booked from Crewe already. LM in my opinion are being very unreasonable here and should definately be paying up. I assume they are playing the 'consequential loss' card? And did you already have a rail ticket?

 

[Master29]

Clearly not satisfactory. London Midland had a duty to get you to your destination. As the station was unmanned there is no reasonable way they could have expected you to know whether there had been a derailment or not especially if their offices were closed and there should have been adequate communication at Hartford regarding provision of replacement transport, which it seems there wasn`t. The least you should get is a reimbursement for your taxi journey. There are better informed members than I who can and will help you further.

 

[gray1404]

I too have had London Midland refuse to pay for the taxi when I was left stranded by their late arrival in Liverpool having missed the last Merseyrail service. There were simply no staff to be found at Lime Street to sort out a taxi. I managed to get my taxi fare refunded by London Midland once I asked for the case to be looked at by a Manager. This was looked at by their Customer Relations Supervisor and he sent me a cheque for the cost of the taxi to Formby as a "goodwill gesture."

You need to also follow this step and have it looked at by a Manager. I would set out how they have failed to resolve your complaint correctly and their was zero communication at Hartford and I would also challenge them that there was actually no rail replacement bus services provided.

 

[AlterEgo]

I agree with the thrust of previous posters.

Escalate this within LM and ask them to reconsider. If there is no satisfaction then, you can escalate to Transport Focus.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Just a thought - as with any dispute which is liable to turn on the facts, document everything *now*, before you forget or anything gets lost. While your phone call to NRE may not have been recorded, note when you phoned, what number you phoned on, and how long the call was (if you used your mobile phone, then hopefully the information is still there). Keep the receipt for the taxi. Note which taxi company it was (and ideally which vehicle).

There's a good chance you won't need any of this information. But since LM have already started digging their heels in, they may continue to be difficult, so the more evidence you have of your story in general and of any specific points the better.

 

[sheff1]

I would also challenge them that there was actually no rail replacement bus services provided.

Be careful with this. Unless you are certain that no buses were provided (and a post from someone on an internet forum cannot be classed as providing "certainty") you should stick to what you are certain about i.e. NRE told you to take a taxi.

 

[Coolzac]

The joys of a fragmented railway system! Completely unacceptable from LM. If they want people to know about these supposed replacement buses then they need to have people manning their contact phone lines. Therefore they should refund the £70.

On a further note, if they refuse, and transport focus don't do anything, can the OP take them to court? By selling a ticket LM agreed to get their passengers to a destination and if they won't refund the taxi they have failed in this regard?

 

[hawk1911]

Northern did a similar thing last weekend. See my post here.

 

[Trains06]

LM in my opinion are being very unreasonable here and should definately be paying up. I assume they are playing the 'consequential loss' card? And did you already have a rail ticket?

Seems like it was a bit of a shambles. Have done some digging and on the evening NRE tweeted at 21.36 that LM had "requested" buses to run, but whether these turned up or not I've no idea. Yes I had a paper ticket.

As the station was unmanned there is no reasonable way they could have expected you to know whether there had been a derailment or not especially if their offices were closed and there should have been adequate communication at Hartford regarding provision of replacement transport, which it seems there wasn`t.

Exactly my point, Hartford isn't staffed at that hour and the departure screens just listed all scheduled services as 'Cancelled'. The only way I could see to speak to a member of staff at that hour to try and get more info was via NRE telephone line and they told me there was no info on rail replacement transport (I specifically asked if this was being provided) and the best option would be to get a taxi and subsequent reimbursement from LM.

You need to also follow this step and have it looked at by a Manager. I would set out how they have failed to resolve your complaint correctly and their was zero communication at Hartford and I would also challenge them that there was actually no rail replacement bus services provided.

Did you just email back and request it to be escalated? Exactly as you say there was no notice of buses being provided so whether they ran or not I don't know how they expected passengers to know they were coming!

I agree with the thrust of previous posters.

Escalate this within LM and ask them to reconsider. If there is no satisfaction then, you can escalate to Transport Focus.

Thanks for your input!

Just a thought - as with any dispute which is liable to turn on the facts, document everything *now*, before you forget or anything gets lost. While your phone call to NRE may not have been recorded, note when you phoned, what number you phoned on, and how long the call was (if you used your mobile phone, then hopefully the information is still there). Keep the receipt for the taxi. Note which taxi company it was (and ideally which vehicle).

I have indeed managed to document all you've suggested above (2 minute call at 21:29 on 06/10/17 to 08443069145) and indeed included it in my original message to the TOC. Have of course kept the receipt very safe!

Be careful with this. Unless you are certain that no buses were provided (and a post from someone on an internet forum cannot be classed as providing "certainty") you should stick to what you are certain about i.e. NRE told you to take a taxi.

I've really no idea whether the buses every materialised. Sounds like they might not have done but definitely not certain of this.

The joys of a fragmented railway system! Completely unacceptable from LM. If they want people to know about these supposed replacement buses then they need to have people manning their contact phone lines. Therefore they should refund the £70.

Fingers crossed I can get the money back! If there had been any form of communication a bus was being provided or had NRE been made aware and told me about it on the phone we would have waited for it to arrive.

Northern did a similar thing last weekend. See my post here.

Interesting case. How did they respond to the three arguments you used?

 

[hawk1911]

Interesting case. How did they respond to the three arguments you used?

They suggested I got in touch with their Customer Service number. However, as I wasn't directly affected, I've left to those affected to pursue. And as I know one of those affected, I'll no doubt get an update at some point.

 

[gray1404]

Yes, I emailed back quoting my case reference number, name and address. I asked for it to be looked at by a Manager and stated why I was unhappy with their first reply and what I would like them to do to resolve it. You can also include any new information that has come to light.

I would do this as soon as possible. Given LM have forwarded your complaint to NRE too - as in essence LM are saying that you were misinformed by NRE, it will be interesting what they say and if they say that LM didn't provide them with any information on replacement buses.

 

[185143]

Southbound at least, there were no buses-but everyone was being put in taxis at South Parkway. If you already had a ticket-then definately put pressure on LM until they pay

 

[Tetchytyke]

London Midland lie to get out of paying compensation- they did it to me on more than one occasion- so you'll need to document everything and keep all receipts.

I'm sure they'll try the consequential card too, but remember that the law does also allow consequential loss claims where a service is not run with reasonable competence. And a derailment is pretty incompetent...

Just remind them it isn't consequential loss, you were following the instructions of their authorised representatives.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

LM will be claiming the delay repay off NR anyway so I cannot see what the rejection was justified. If hartford is unstaffed how is the information supposed to be passed on? Were there any help points at Hartford? Should be...

Buses from request often take over 2 hours to materialise and is a painfully slow process to get rolling.

Chase this up for higher management. And copy passenger focus into it. This is unfair given your circumstances