Platform Tickets

[stut]

Increasingly, the stations I use are becoming gated. Often, I use them to pick up family members who, although not quite in the realm of needing formal assistance (and who would never book it anyway), really could use a friendly face on the platform to help them with luggage and up stairs.

What obligation, if any, do TOCs have to provide you with platform tickets? When I've asked, I usually get a blank look and waved through, which is fine, but all it takes is a shift change and particularly zealous replacement to turn this sour.

What's the official line?

 

[PhilipW]

I don't know the answer to your question, but I do agree with your sentiments.

When my mother was alive and came down to visit, it was standard practice on my part to make sure that she was on the train properly when she left and to be on the platform waiting when she arrived. Technically she did not need assistance but I just felt it was my duty to look after her the best I could and to carry her bags.

If the railway industry now puts any impediment in the way of this respect for your parents, then I feel that it is a real turn for the worse within our society today.

 

[Daimler]

I sent an email to First Great Western about this.

They replied telling me that platform tickets were not available, and that - essentially - I should ask to be let through the barriers in order to go and meet someone.

 

[Crossforth]

The only station I know that issues platform tickets is Leeds

 

[moonrakerz]

I had a very interesting couple of discussions on this subject with SWT staff at Salisbury last weekend. My wife and I went to collect daughter who was travelling down from Kent - normally she would change and carry on to Warminster, but as she had not been well she asked if we could pick her up at Salisbury. On arrival, my wife was told that we needed "valid" tickets to pass through the barriers. I went to the ticket office and enquired about platform tickets, was told "no". When I said that I thought they still existed I was told "they do, but we don't issue them". When I explained my reasons to this "gentleman", his response was basically - your problem, not mine. Good PR !!

We went back to the barrier and asked for the duty manager. She arrived and I explained that we wanted to get onto the platforms, but person A wouldn't let us through, and person B wouldn't sell us platform tickets. She then said that we were only allowed through with valid tickets. When I pointed out that if we had been at Romsey station (for example) we wouldn't have had this problem (no barriers), she said: "ah yes - but we have got that covered", when I asked her to explain what she meant by that, she said that Romsey had ticket machines and we were not allowed to board a train without a ticket !
(Penny dropped here - we were no longer Mum & Dad meeting poorly daughter - we were FARE DODGERS !)

I then explained AGAIN (!) that we didn't want to board a train - just meet our daughter !!!
When I recounted the platform ticket story, she said "we used to sell them but stopped when the barriers were put in" ( Monty Python script!!!). When I pointed out the lunacy of that statement, she changed tack !

Eventually she did let us onto the platforms, but when we came to leave we were given a damned good ignoring by person A - who eventually decided to let us out with as much ill grace as she could muster.

It was obvious that all three members of staff were just "obeying orders", but two of them were surly to the point of rudeness and the third, although perfectly pleasant, was obviously struggling in her attempts to justify not letting us through.
Perhaps SWT would like to put out a notice just explaining what their policy is.................

Not a good day - I could tell you about the SWT web site that day being a total work of fiction - but I won't !

PS: I used to regularly take other daughter to Bristol Parkway with her 3 ton suitcase - the staff there were most pleasant and always let me carry her bag down to the platform. Well done FGW !

 

[hughesfowler]

Manchester Oxford rd will sell you a platform ticket for the grand sum of ten pence

 

[PhilipW]

Oh dear, what a miserable story. One, I fear, that is not unique.

While it may be possible for a middle aged or elderly person to persuade the barrier staff that he is just meeting someone, I doubt that that someone in their 20s meeting their parents or grandparents would be treated with much respect.

My wife had Alzheimer's. In her early stages she would go up and visit my son. I would put her on the train at Fareham, phone up my son to tell him exactly what carriage she was in and he would then go onto the platform at Waterloo and meet her in the carriage.

Could he do that now ? Well, I don't know. I suspect not. Even if he could, it would be with a great deal of hassle.

This is not progress in my book. The technology of the barriers has taken over from human sensibilities.

 

[Ivo]

I would have thought that introducing the barriers would be a reason to introduce platform tickets. I have never needed one, because whenever I have needed (or wanted) to access a platform without travelling, the staff have always permitted it. But the Salisbury example just sounds like them trying to dictate the rules as they please. As far as I know South West Trains have no compulsory ticket areas, only penalty fares. That would permit access to any part of any SWT station without a ticket (within reason obviously).

 

[Lampshade]

I've found stations run by Northern or Virgin will happily issue one, I got one at Manchester Victoria, Oxford Road and Piccadilly without a problem, also at Preston. East Coast seem to have replaced them with gateline passes.

 

[stut]

Interesting responses. Personally, my experience (mostly at Peterborough, Cambridge and Ipswich, occasionally at Hitchin) has been fine - a couple of times I've been given a single ticket to that station (from the stack they've collected) just to make sure I can get out easily - and have been let in/out for such frivolities as coffee (AMT is always worth it) and toilets.

However, Murphy's Law dictates that the one time you really, really need this kind of human helpfulness, you'll get the jobsworth. A proper, timed platform ticket would seem sensible. Perhaps one for Passenger Focus (if they can do anything about it).

 

[quarella]

I was working in a large station booking office when gates were installed and we were getting a lot of grief from people who the barrier staff had refused access to the platforms. In the Passenger Information Manual, a hefty folder that was the bible on retail issues back then, I found a section on platform tickets with a price and how to issue them so I started doing that. The manager went ballistic. I showed him the section in the PIM but he ordered me to stop and we went back to getting grief until I was able to escape.

 

[Lampshade]

This is one of, if not the main reason I'm so opposed to barriers unless a proper, unified policy can be agreed to allow platform access for non-travellers with a legitimate reason. They say at some stations to ask the gateline staff but these are invariably miserable jobsworths who got his traffic warden application rejected (or just braindead in some cases). Some are usually very good though, Southeastern, Virgin (occasional manual barriers) and Northern sticking out among the better ones, EMT and SWT being the worst offenders. Barriers change the relationship between the TOC and the public so we're now accountable to them for absolutely everything.

You can forget all this nonsense about how non-travellers wouldn't expect to be allowed airside at airports because there's no border crossings, no passport control and no need for such tight security - in short, railway stations are not airports.

 

[jon0844]

Until society changes, gatelines and staff that are skeptical of every story they're told are going to be the norm.

Even at my local cinema where you can pay £1 for 'premier' seats with more room, almost every time we go there, people are upgrading themselves and waiting to be moved on by staff.

Sadly, people can't seem to be trusted to do what's right on their own.

But, if gates are going to exist, then staff must issue the tickets available to let you go on to the platform. You can't make everyone who is honest have to try and convince ever stricter RPIs and the like.

 

[Chris-P]

Until society changes, gatelines and staff that are skeptical of every story they're told are going to be the norm.

Even at my local cinema where you can pay £1 for 'premier' seats with more room, almost every time we go there, people are upgrading themselves and waiting to be moved on by staff.

Sadly, people can't seem to be trusted to do what's right on their own.

But, if gates are going to exist, then staff must issue the tickets available to let you go on to the platform. You can't make everyone who is honest have to try and convince ever stricter RPIs and the like.

One thing that could be done is, rather than PFing people who get on trains with platform tickets, that the TOC could prosecute for fare evasion, in that case, it's clear that they were deliberately evading the fare and so it would mean the TOCs could get more money.

 

[jon0844]

I agree. PFs are often handed out by lazy staff that should take further action when it's quite obvious there's a deliberate attempt to defraud.

The criminal record part is worse than the fine, and would hopefully be more of a deterrent than a £20 ticket.

 

[Hampshire Unit]

Looking at this thread in a slightly different way, during my time of working on the Platforms and ticket barriers we were encouraged to point people in the direction of the Platform Ticket. Not for the revenue protection aspect but simply because it provided insurance to both the person concerned and British Rail should any mishaps happen. That simple 10p Ticket was you insurance policy.

 

[PhilipW]

The above answer is fine. The question is "Can you buy a 10p platform ticket ?". I see you are from Hampshire. Do SWT sell such tickets ?

Obviously I cannot speak for every station, but my impression is that SWT do not sell platform tickets and are one of the most agressive companies in stopping you from entering a platform without a travel ticket.

I would love to hear what the SWT position is especially in light of some of the personal circumstances that have been raised in this thread.

 

[TheWalrus]

I had a very interesting couple of discussions on this subject with SWT staff at Salisbury last weekend. My wife and I went to collect daughter who was travelling down from Kent - normally she would change and carry on to Warminster, but as she had not been well she asked if we could pick her up at Salisbury. On arrival, my wife was told that we needed "valid" tickets to pass through the barriers. I went to the ticket office and enquired about platform tickets, was told "no". When I said that I thought they still existed I was told "they do, but we don't issue them". When I explained my reasons to this "gentleman", his response was basically - your problem, not mine. Good PR !!

We went back to the barrier and asked for the duty manager. She arrived and I explained that we wanted to get onto the platforms, but person A wouldn't let us through, and person B wouldn't sell us platform tickets. She then said that we were only allowed through with valid tickets. When I pointed out that if we had been at Romsey station (for example) we wouldn't have had this problem (no barriers), she said: "ah yes - but we have got that covered", when I asked her to explain what she meant by that, she said that Romsey had ticket machines and we were not allowed to board a train without a ticket !
(Penny dropped here - we were no longer Mum & Dad meeting poorly daughter - we were FARE DODGERS !)

I then explained AGAIN (!) that we didn't want to board a train - just meet our daughter !!!
When I recounted the platform ticket story, she said "we used to sell them but stopped when the barriers were put in" ( Monty Python script!!!). When I pointed out the lunacy of that statement, she changed tack !

Eventually she did let us onto the platforms, but when we came to leave we were given a damned good ignoring by person A - who eventually decided to let us out with as much ill grace as she could muster.

It was obvious that all three members of staff were just "obeying orders", but two of them were surly to the point of rudeness and the third, although perfectly pleasant, was obviously struggling in her attempts to justify not letting us through.
Perhaps SWT would like to put out a notice just explaining what their policy is.................

Not a good day - I could tell you about the SWT web site that day being a total work of fiction - but I won't !

PS: I used to regularly take other daughter to Bristol Parkway with her 3 ton suitcase - the staff there were most pleasant and always let me carry her bag down to the platform. Well done FGW !

That's the difference - FGW have decency whereas SWT are just b*******!

 

[moonrakerz]

Interesting to read all the posts on this subject. I think I might well write to SWT and ask them exactly what their policy is on this subject. I fear, however, that I may just get the "bed bug" letter in response :cry:

The problem is, of course, that the barriers are seen as a simple and CHEAP way of countering fare evasion. I don't think they are - much better ticket inspection on trains is needed. Walking through the train and saying "any tickets from *****" is completely and utterly pointless, only the honest respond. I actually heard an FGW guard saying "any fare dodgers from *****", on one occasion, it made everyone smile, but it really showed how futile his mission was.
Even when they are checked, it isn't done very well; just a couple of days after the incident I recounted in my earlier post, I gave my ticket to the on board inspector who duly clipped it. When I got to the other end I discovered that I had given him the return half of my ticket - he hadn't noticed !

 

[LE Greys]

Even when they are checked, it isn't done very well; just a couple of days after the incident I recounted in my earlier post, I gave my ticket to the on board inspector who duly clipped it. When I got to the other end I discovered that I had given him the return half of my ticket - he hadn't noticed !

I did that once, and a desperate grip at Bournemouth wouldn't let me back in on the ruddy ticket!!!

Seriously, the only way to get a platform ticket at some places is to buy a return to the next station (£2:50 if you're unlucky). If they reintroduced them, not only would it be a nice little money-spinner (how much would it cost to print them) it would guarantee that you could tell the honest from the dishonest. People who buy them are usually honest people who are at the station for a reason, even if only there to take a few numbers. Updating the software and the TVMs can't be all that hard, they added Corby recently after all.

Apart from the tea at Hitchin (I used to drop in there every now and then, fortunately I went to school with one of the platform staff) there are other silly reasons for going through the barriers. At Newcastle they managed to cordon off the cash machines, which is very awkward if you need to buy a ticket.

Incidentally, the record use for a platform ticket is two years, by an eight-year-old boy in the 1950s who ran away from home, bought a platform ticket, boarded a train and lived on British Railways for all that time. Can't remember the exact details, but I've heard the story many times.

 

[142094]

You wouldn't have to buy a return, just get a single. If there are any problems on the barrier tell them you don't wish to use the train any more.

 

[ChrisCooper]

The problem with things like penalty fares, fixed penalties and police cautions is that they are an easy solution to be handed out in both in cases where harsher punishments are justified, and also in cases where any proper punishment wouldn't stick.

 

[Aictos]

I remember when GNER at Peterborough used to issue platform tickets, this all stopped when National Express took over though.
Now it's a case of just asking if it's okay to meet such and such off a train and the staff are more then happy to let you though, same at my station I've yet to see anyone refused access to the platforms to meet someone.

Still, I'm on nights this week so although I don't deal with tickets will try to read up on the manual.

 

[Deerfold]

Apart from the tea at Hitchin (I used to drop in there every now and then, fortunately I went to school with one of the platform staff) there are other silly reasons for going through the barriers. At Newcastle they managed to cordon off the cash machines, which is very awkward if you need to buy a ticket.

The barriers at Hitchin were an annoyance - when they built them they moved the newsagent's inside the barriers - which meant that if I dropped off drycleaning there it could no longer be picked up by my wife (I'm not saying you might not be able to persuade someone to let you through but I wouldn't fancy banking on it). Wonder if their buisness dropped at all? (there were short-stay parking places just outside the entrance to the station - might have been used by passing motorists.

 

[Peter KS]

I always feeling uncomfortable about this but my 84 year-old mother needs to be helped onto the platform and then onto the right train, she definitely would not travel if I was not there to help her. (She is met at her destination and helped off the train by my daughter.)

South West Trains do not sell platform tickets and so far their ticket collectors have accepted my word that I am helping my obviously frail mother onto the train so I have always been let through the barriers. Getting off the platform a few minutes later has caused difficulties though, not all ticket collectors (if they have changed and don't remember me going through) accept my word that I have only been on the platform and have not travelled on a train.

I would be happy to pay a pound for a platform ticket and save myself the unpleasantness.

My mother's ticket costs about £60 and if I can't take onto the platform in the future she won't travel and South West Trains will lose this revenue.

I am sure I am not alone. It seems a pity to deny our senior citizens the freedom to travel when it gives them so much pleasure.

 

[Aictos]

Well as I saw today, people should have no difficulty in ggetting a platform ticket at any of the GN FCC stations as the ticket machine in the office is already set up to sell tickets priced at 10p each.

Obviously since I don't work on the TL or with LUL, plus they use a different ticketing system to the GN so can't comment on them.

Still, it's surprising how easy it is to issue them - gateline staff however have been told not to sell them but I don't know why.