Projects you'd build but will (probably) never happen

[MPW]

A link from dartford/gravesend to Essex. Instead of the new car tunnel. Similar idea floated for kenex tram but direction connection to existing rail lines will offer more connections and faster journeys. Maybe a tram could share the tunnel anyway.

Also, link from fenchurch Street c2c to blackfriars terminating platforms. Tram-train down lower/upper thames Street. One station under CST and/or the bridge near monument. At grade cheapest, cut and cover or partially elevated possible (maybe not). Not too many junctions at road level.

That road has lots of private vehicles but also work vans. Could include path for freight with one or two sidings for loading/unloading.

The thameslink route from Loughborough Junction is quad track and greatly underutilised. This could also free up space in TL core depending what service pattern is chosen.

East Side tunnel between west ham and Limehouse seems to be space for portal in industrial or park land. Options for existing track:
1. Hand over to DLR to fenchurch Street with new stations. Could have former c2c connection at shadwell with improved connections to overground from dlr.
2. Sell off the land where railway currently is to help fund project. Especially between Bank tunnel portal and FS.

Tunnel portal any closer to fs would require demolishing existing structures but might make sense if no desire for DLR and some cost could be recouped from development above tracks.

 

[islandmonkey]

For who? The population along there is tiny, west of Newbury

Langport, Somerton, Devizes, a clock face schedule for Pewsey, people in Bedwyn being able to go west without having to go east.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

HS2 great western, have an OOC - Reading - Bristol - Cardiff - join the classic lines onto swansea, as well as a second branch towards Exeter (so Reading - Newbury - Exeter )

Probably wouldn't be called "HS2 Great Western" though: HS2 refers specifically to the 2nd High Speed route built in Britain, so any subsequent route to the West would be HS3 or even HS4.

When there was talk of the Severn Barrage several years ago, I thought it would be handy as a crossing point for a Great Western High Speed line to serve both Bristol and South Wales with the same train without dumping Bristolians in a car park in South Gloucestershire...

 

[HSTEd]

Langport, Somerton, Devizes, a clock face schedule for Pewsey, people in Bedwyn being able to go west without having to go east.

Going via Bristol saves something approaching a hundred kilometres of high speed line though, a hundred kilometres gets you almost to St Austell via Plymouth, or indeed most of the way to Birmingham from Bristol.
Either option is likely to generate far more traffic than either a few minutes off the Exeter-London journey time or the intermediate station traffic between those places.

 

[Basil Jet]

As others have said, once you are running off five kilometres per minute the time delay from going via the Bristol area would be minimal.

I would suggest going via Oxford rather than Reading though, it would add less than two minutes to the journey time but would open up a significant new market. Reading would only see a few minutes in saved journey time in all likelihood, for Oxford it would be transformational.

London to Bristol via Oxford adds 5 miles over a straight line route... London to Birmingham via Oxford adds 7 miles over a straight route, so if the business case for a high speed station in Oxford was there, wouldn't they have routed HS2 via Oxford?

 

[JamesT]

As others have said, once you are running off five kilometres per minute the time delay from going via the Bristol area would be minimal.

I would suggest going via Oxford rather than Reading though, it would add less than two minutes to the journey time but would open up a significant new market. Reading would only see a few minutes in saved journey time in all likelihood, for Oxford it would be transformational.

How would you propose to have a line going roughly East-West go through Oxford whose current rail corridor is North-South?

 

[HSTEd]

London to Bristol via Oxford adds 5 miles over a straight line route... London to Birmingham via Oxford adds 7 miles over a straight route, so if the business case for a high speed station in Oxford was there, wouldn't they have routed HS2 via Oxford?

HS2s primary design purpose is to move lots of people very long distances at high speed. HS2 was projected to be full at the end of Phase 2 with all 18 paths per hour expended.

The demand projections leave no room for Oxford passengers, assuming the originally envisaged network or something equivalent is built.

On the other hand, a line out towards Cardiff and the South West of England hasn't got a snowball's chance in hell of being filled up by the listed traffic centres.
It needs all the traffic it can get.

How would you propose to have a line going roughly East-West go through Oxford whose current rail corridor is North-South?

Well you would cross under Oxford in a tunnel, turn to the north, surface the line into the station complex, then proceed north into a curve back towards the west (EDIT: North of Wolvercote).

Reading might notionally be pointing in the right direction but its a rather hemmed in ste, there is nowhere to fit the necessary multiple platform high speed station given that it has to serve the classic line to Oxford et al as well. Oxford has an adjacent car park to expand into and would have much less residual, non high speed traffic.

Or you just serve a different station on the outskrits of the city given that the journey tmie would be so much faster than the regular line that it scarcely matters.

EDIT:
The obvious choice being Oxford Parkway, ofcourse.

 

[stuu]

Langport, Somerton, Devizes, a clock face schedule for Pewsey, people in Bedwyn being able to go west without having to go east.

All of those places are absolutely tiny, and the current two hourly semi fast is the best service the line has ever had. There's plenty of capacity now for stations in Langport and Somerton, the line never sees more than 2tph. It would need an extra local service as well, but is there really enough demand between Taunton and Westbury?

 

[islandmonkey]

All of those places are absolutely tiny, and the current two hourly semi fast is the best service the line has ever had. There's plenty of capacity now for stations in Langport and Somerton, the line never sees more than 2tph. It would need an extra local service as well, but is there really enough demand between Taunton and Westbury?

Tiny? Devizes has 16k people. Add on West and Market Lavington nearby, make that 20k.

 

[AM9]

Tiny? Devizes has 16k people. Add on West and Market Lavington nearby, make that 20k.

So those three settlements together have about the same population as Stamford in Lincolnshire or Cirencester, and all similar distance from central London.

 

[stuu]

Tiny? Devizes has 16k people. Add on West and Market Lavington nearby, make that 20k.

Yes, that's a small town

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Tiny? Devizes has 16k people. Add on West and Market Lavington nearby, make that 20k.

Langport is under 4k, though being charitable and including neighbouring Huish Episcopi gives a population of around 7.5k. Somerton has 4.6k, so none of these places are a metropolis.

 

[AM9]

Langport is under 4k, though being charitable and including neighbouring Huish Episcopi gives a population of around 7.5k. Somerton has 4.6k, so none of these places are a metropolis.

Langport is irrelevant to Devizes, it's ove 60km awa and not even in the same county so why combine the population of the two?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Langport is irrelevant to Devizes, it's ove 60km awa and not even in the same county so why combine the population of the two?

I wasn't talking about Devizes (though Devizes is hardly a metropolis), it just happened to be mentioned in the post I quoted.
The discussion i was responding to was was essentially:

"These three places could be served"

"But those places are tiny"

"One of them isn't that tiny"

To which my response was "no, but the other two are really tiny."

That's the problem with these discussions on here, a response to a response removes the context of the original point. Apparently it is possible to quote a post and include quotes within that post, but the default on this site is to only quote the most recent post, so context is lost. I don't know if the people in charge can adjust these settings, but it might reduce the need for the dreaded red text.

 

[Trainguy34]

This would be more of a service I would put in Post-HS2, (especially using my crayons here) but it would most likely run London-Manchester(Unsure how)-Bolton-Blackburn-Burnley.

 

[simonw]

To return to the spirt of the opening post, stop faffing about trying to reopen the Portishead line and build a bridge or tunnel across the Avon and connect Portishead to the Avonmouth and Henbury lines. Shouldn t cost more than a billion.

 

[Basil Jet]

Clevedon has nearly the same population as Portishead... I know Portishead has an extant track bed and Portishead to Clevedon was never more than a light railway, but with a noticeable diversion at the Portishead end it doesn't seem that hard to put a track to Clevedon in (served via reversal at Portishead).

 

[jaybles]

You asked...

Run the fasts over the Okehampton line, built for higher speeds to compensate for the reversal at Exeter.
Run additional Devon Metro services to compensate for south Devon not having the intercity services anymore.
New city metro round Plymouth.
A new branch line to Sidmouth.
A couple of new stations outside Devon.
Double the West of England line at least between Exeter and Axminster and from Yeovil Junction to Salisbury.

All of those places are absolutely tiny, and the current two hourly semi fast is the best service the line has ever had. There's plenty of capacity now for stations in Langport and Somerton, the line never sees more than 2tph. It would need an extra local service as well, but is there really enough demand between Taunton and Westbury?

Our planned services

Making vital connections across Somerset and Wiltshire Our proposal for 2025 This shows the route that we plan to operate from the end of 2025 onwards – and which now has the approval of the …

go-op.coop

 

[Bartsimho]

You asked...

Run the fasts over the Okehampton line, built for higher speeds to compensate for the reversal at Exeter.
Run additional Devon Metro services to compensate for south Devon not having the intercity services anymore.
New city metro round Plymouth.
A new branch line to Sidmouth.
A couple of new stations outside Devon.
Double the West of England line at least between Exeter and Axminster and from Yeovil Junction to Salisbury.

View attachment 139378

Our planned services

Making vital connections across Somerset and Wiltshire Our proposal for 2025 This shows the route that we plan to operate from the end of 2025 onwards – and which now has the approval of the …

go-op.coop

This map your doing?
It looks good but I doubt any extension from Barnstaple to Bideford would happen with the Tarka Trail being popular with tourists unless you picked a new alignment which diverges as a line to Ilfracombe would probably take the old Tarka line out of Barnstaple then cross by the Taw Bridge

 

[jaybles]

This map your doing?
It looks good but I doubt any extension from Barnstaple to Bideford would happen with the Tarka Trail being popular with tourists unless you picked a new alignment which diverges as a line to Ilfracombe would probably take the old Tarka line out of Barnstaple then cross by the Taw Bridge

Hah yes. Everyone needs a hobby...

It might be easier to find a new alignment for the cycle way rather than the railway. But I imagine Sustrans will whinge about that. Apparently the only sustainable transport solution involves 2 wheels and some legs.


A slightly more wacky idea that I've had for a while here, but I think would be actually transformative for the area and not too impossible to build, picking up old alignments and crossing the levels.

 

[islandmonkey]

Hah yes. Everyone needs a hobby...

It might be easier to find a new alignment for the cycle way rather than the railway. But I imagine Sustrans will whinge about that. Apparently the only sustainable transport solution involves 2 wheels and some legs.


A slightly more wacky idea that I've had for a while here, but I think would be actually transformative for the area and not too impossible to build, picking up old alignments and crossing the levels.

View attachment 139407

I'm not sure why you need Frome Central, but this is not wacky at all really. If we can't get Langport and Somerton to open especially as stations on the railway, I would like to see some sort of Taunton to Bath/Bristol busway being built that serves Glastonbury/Street/Wells/Shepton Mallet/Midsomer Norton and Radstock.

 

[simonw]

Clevedon has nearly the same population as Portishead... I know Portishead has an extant track bed and Portishead to Clevedon was never more than a light railway, but with a noticeable diversion at the Portishead end it doesn't seem that hard to put a track to Clevedon in (served via reversal at Portishead).

Well yes, thats stage 2 of my proposal.

Stage 3 is reopened the clevedon branch ( requires a level crossing of the m5)

And stage 4 is pushing on from clevedon to Weston to complete the WC&P reopening.

 

[JD2168]

I would build a line from Barnsley to Doncaster direct & extend the line from Skegness to Mablethorpe & Louth.

 

[stuu]

Hah yes. Everyone needs a hobby...

It might be easier to find a new alignment for the cycle way rather than the railway. But I imagine Sustrans will whinge about that. Apparently the only sustainable transport solution involves 2 wheels and some legs.


A slightly more wacky idea that I've had for a while here, but I think would be actually transformative for the area and not too impossible to build, picking up old alignments and crossing the levels.

View attachment 139407

In order to serve Radstock etc, I would be rebuilding the route to Bristol, not to Frome. Wells to Bristol via Shepton Mallet and Midsomer Norton? Must be a TBM coming free from HS2 soon

 

[jaybles]

I'm not sure why you need Frome Central, but this is not wacky at all really. If we can't get Langport and Somerton to open especially as stations on the railway, I would like to see some sort of Taunton to Bath/Bristol busway being built that serves Glastonbury/Street/Wells/Shepton Mallet/Midsomer Norton and Radstock.

Reusing the existing branch at Frome bypasses the current Frome station. You could either reinstate the curve back to Frome station, create a new north/central station or bypass Frome altogether.

In order to serve Radstock etc, I would be rebuilding the route to Bristol, not to Frome. Wells to Bristol via Shepton Mallet and Midsomer Norton? Must be a TBM coming free from HS2 soon

Ideally yes, but the Radstock - Frome alignment is still there. Negotiating north is not so simple.

 

[MattRat]

You asked...

Run the fasts over the Okehampton line, built for higher speeds to compensate for the reversal at Exeter.
Run additional Devon Metro services to compensate for south Devon not having the intercity services anymore.
New city metro round Plymouth.
A new branch line to Sidmouth.
A couple of new stations outside Devon.
Double the West of England line at least between Exeter and Axminster and from Yeovil Junction to Salisbury.

View attachment 139378

Our planned services

Making vital connections across Somerset and Wiltshire Our proposal for 2025 This shows the route that we plan to operate from the end of 2025 onwards – and which now has the approval of the …

go-op.coop

Since a lot of people are replying to this with their own editions, I think it would be fun to add my own. That being completely the triangle near Exeter, with a new station on the line called Exeter Parkway, and maybe integrate it with buses that will go to Exeter town center, allowing trains down to Plymouth via Okehampton, without a reversal at Exeter.

 

[Basil Jet]

Since a lot of people are replying to this with their own editions, I think it would be fun to add my own. That being completely the triangle near Exeter, with a new station on the line called Exeter Parkway, and maybe integrate it with buses that will go to Exeter town center, allowing trains down to Plymouth via Okehampton, without a reversal at Exeter.

.. and another triangle near St Budeaux to create a shorter mainline to Cornwall that avoids Plymouth and Exeter.

 

[stuu]

Ideally yes, but the Radstock - Frome alignment is still there. Negotiating north is not so simple.

Please see thread title!

 

[simonw]

In order to serve Radstock etc, I would be rebuilding the route to Bristol, not to Frome. Wells to Bristol via Shepton Mallet and Midsomer Norton? Must be a TBM coming free from HS2 soon

It is actually a real shame that that track bed and the Midland route to bristol/bath wasn't retained. It would now form useful parts of a Bristol metro. Especially with the line from Radstock to Bath. I'm sure refreshments of Radstock would love a return of level crossings in their town centre.

 

[Silenos]

I would build a line from Barnsley to Doncaster direct & extend the line from Skegness to Mablethorpe & Louth.

What about a power-generating tidal barrage across the mouth of the Wash, with a railway line on the top, joining Skegness to Hunstanton and on to King’s Lynn where it would continue to King’s Cross? (And no, I don’t think it’s a serious proposition, but my crayons needed using up).