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Prosecution - help please!

vandoorn

New Member
Joined
3 Jun 2025
Messages
1
Location
Yorkshire
Hi everyone.

The other Sunday I received a Travel Incident Report paperslip from a train conductor about 5 minutes into my journey to Manchester via Northern Rail. I'd bought a ticket for an hour earlier that day (12pm), but needed to set off later as I had a flare-up of asthma (mine is classed as a disability as its that bad). I never refunded the ticket, but it was an advance single so it's not like it would have been valid. I travelled instead to the train station which had NO barriers, and completely forgot to get another ticket by the machines as I didn't need one to get to the platform. When I went onto the Trainline app, it was buffering (probably because of my poor data, however I was struggling at home as well), so I assumed I could get a ticket on the train. I'd previously been able to do this on another Northern Rail service with no problems, and this station also had functioning ticket machines etc. Furthermore, the other day, on the same route I was on but going from Manc -> Leeds, a woman next to me was also able to buy a ticket no problems (and Vic definitely has ticket machines).

Anyway, my intention was to ALWAYS tell the conductor as soon as I saw them on the train to explain. About 5 minutes in, a train conductor appears by my side and I ask if I can get a ticket. He immediately pulls out his fine machine thing and refuses to clearly tell me why I couldn't pay on the train or be issued a penalty fare. I mentioned that I had been struggling with the app as my reason, and because I was panicking, forgot to tell him about the earlier ticket I had bought (although it was an advance single - it still shows intent to pay and not to evade the fare). I kept asking him to explain (yes - I understand NOW that I needed a valid ticket..I'm so stupid) and he hardly spoke and just laughed at me.

In the past 6 months, I have counted 64 tickets I have paid for on the Trainline app with almost all being Northern Rail services - I have never been in this instance before and I feel absolutely terrible. I'm a young woman and I've just started working in the legal industry, and have hopes to become a teacher abroad before committing to qualifying as a solicitor, I fear this is going to ruin my life and since yesterday I've been in an absolute state worrying about this. I haven't received a letter from them yet, the man told me they'd investigate about the app issue, but I want to be as prepared as possible to avoid this from going to court. I am willing to pay for a solicitor (I saw on some other threads Manak Solicitors are generally good), but obviously before it gets to that stage, I want to be as clear as possible that my intention has ALWAYS been to pay, I am genuinely remorseful and feel so angry with myself that I could let this happen, my actions were not borne out of malicious intent (I was generally confused, I thought I could get a ticket on the train, but I understand now that I can't as a general rule and won't rely on this presumption again). I wish to ask them to consider to settle out of court and will pay hastily any associated fees alongside the penalty fare and ticket price. I believe it would be wholly disproportionate to brandish me with a criminal record because of my mistake, and would be a waste of their time and resources, and I take full accountability of paying a fee which demonstrates the seriousness of the situation.

I am a bit worried people in the forum will be telling me off - I feel bad enough as it is and am a bit of a mess right now. If anyone could help me out with drafting a letter, and could advise on whether I should include evidence of my ticket-buying 'pattern' (to prove I don't have a history of evasion), alongside photocopying the physical ticket I got the other week when I was able to get a train ticket on board (and my bank statement so they can see that the ticket price is on my statement), I would be REALLY REALLY appreciative!!

Thank you a lot everyone and I genuinely hope for the sake of my future this can be sorted.
 
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RailUK Forums

Hadders

Veteran Member
Associate Staff
Senior Fares Advisor
Joined
27 Apr 2011
Messages
16,374
Welcome to the forum!

Firstly, 'the forum' won't tell you off! What we will do is establish what has happened, explain what (if anything) you've done wrong, the possible outcomes and what you have to do next. We will also try to make sure that the train company has followed the correct procedures when dealing with the incident.

Legally speaking, you must be in possession of a valid ticket when you board the train. Unfortunately, based on what you've told us, you didn't have one. The ticket you purchased was not valid on the train you travelled on and you didn't buy an alternative ticket before boarding. if there are no ticket purchasing facilities at the station where you start your journey then you may board without a ticket and purchase one at the earliest opportunity. We could do with knowing the station where you started your journey, whether there was a ticket machine, and whether it was working. You aren't required to use a mobile phone to purchase a ticket but you must use a ticket machine or open ticket office if you need a ticket.

Northern are entitled to proseucte you in the Magistrates Court if they want to. The good news is that they will normally offer an out of court settlement to people who co-operate with them, and who haven't come to their attention before. What happens next is they will write to you int he next few weeks saying that they have received a report, are considering prosecuting but asking for your version of events before they decide how to proceed. You must reply to this letter and I suggest drafting a short, concise reply that mentions:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

Expect an out of court settlement to cost the outstanding fare at the full Anytime rate plus an admin fee, typically £150. Paying an out of court settlement might feel like paying a fine but technically it isn't a fine - only a court can impose a fine as a punishment upon conviction. You won't have a criminal record as a result of paying a settlement.

When Northern's letter arrives post a redacted copy of it in this thread, along with your draft reply and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.
 

WesternLancer

Established Member
Joined
12 Apr 2019
Messages
10,615
Hi everyone.

The other Sunday I received a Travel Incident Report paperslip from a train conductor about 5 minutes into my journey to Manchester via Northern Rail. I'd bought a ticket for an hour earlier that day (12pm), but needed to set off later as I had a flare-up of asthma (mine is classed as a disability as its that bad). I never refunded the ticket, but it was an advance single so it's not like it would have been valid. I travelled instead to the train station which had NO barriers, and completely forgot to get another ticket by the machines as I didn't need one to get to the platform. When I went onto the Trainline app, it was buffering (probably because of my poor data, however I was struggling at home as well), so I assumed I could get a ticket on the train. I'd previously been able to do this on another Northern Rail service with no problems, and this station also had functioning ticket machines etc. Furthermore, the other day, on the same route I was on but going from Manc -> Leeds, a woman next to me was also able to buy a ticket no problems (and Vic definitely has ticket machines).

Anyway, my intention was to ALWAYS tell the conductor as soon as I saw them on the train to explain. About 5 minutes in, a train conductor appears by my side and I ask if I can get a ticket. He immediately pulls out his fine machine thing and refuses to clearly tell me why I couldn't pay on the train or be issued a penalty fare. I mentioned that I had been struggling with the app as my reason, and because I was panicking, forgot to tell him about the earlier ticket I had bought (although it was an advance single - it still shows intent to pay and not to evade the fare). I kept asking him to explain (yes - I understand NOW that I needed a valid ticket..I'm so stupid) and he hardly spoke and just laughed at me.

In the past 6 months, I have counted 64 tickets I have paid for on the Trainline app with almost all being Northern Rail services - I have never been in this instance before and I feel absolutely terrible. I'm a young woman and I've just started working in the legal industry, and have hopes to become a teacher abroad before committing to qualifying as a solicitor, I fear this is going to ruin my life and since yesterday I've been in an absolute state worrying about this. I haven't received a letter from them yet, the man told me they'd investigate about the app issue, but I want to be as prepared as possible to avoid this from going to court. I am willing to pay for a solicitor (I saw on some other threads Manak Solicitors are generally good), but obviously before it gets to that stage, I want to be as clear as possible that my intention has ALWAYS been to pay, I am genuinely remorseful and feel so angry with myself that I could let this happen, my actions were not borne out of malicious intent (I was generally confused, I thought I could get a ticket on the train, but I understand now that I can't as a general rule and won't rely on this presumption again). I wish to ask them to consider to settle out of court and will pay hastily any associated fees alongside the penalty fare and ticket price. I believe it would be wholly disproportionate to brandish me with a criminal record because of my mistake, and would be a waste of their time and resources, and I take full accountability of paying a fee which demonstrates the seriousness of the situation.

I am a bit worried people in the forum will be telling me off - I feel bad enough as it is and am a bit of a mess right now. If anyone could help me out with drafting a letter, and could advise on whether I should include evidence of my ticket-buying 'pattern' (to prove I don't have a history of evasion), alongside photocopying the physical ticket I got the other week when I was able to get a train ticket on board (and my bank statement so they can see that the ticket price is on my statement), I would be REALLY REALLY appreciative!!

Thank you a lot everyone and I genuinely hope for the sake of my future this can be sorted.
Unfortunately just because some staff happily sell tickets on board a train that all staff will do so. I know this is confusing and unhelpful but there are various reasons why it happens.

There will have been signs telling you to buy a ticket that’s valid before boarding the train at the station.

IIRC even tickets sold on the train have something written on the back of the ticket saying buy before you get on board next time.

It’s vital you get the letter they will send you and reply to it with advice from here. People will check your draft reply for you when you prepare it.

Keep an eye on hard copy post e mail and spam.

Please advice if the journey and stations involved and what train company this is.northern?
 

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