Prosecution

[abuskid]

Hello everyone I need some advice
I’m 20 year old and I normally get a child ticket when I’m broke so one day I get caught by a ticket inspector so they fine me for £100 within 21 days I have to pay the fine before 21 days I have already payed the fine, weeks later I got an email from an organization called digital fraud team on the email it’s says I was caught on a child ticket by a ticket inspector and now they’re charging for other tickets I have purchased in the past, they are requesting for a prove of age or evidence of my age now they are giving me an option to pay another fine of £800 or 3 months in jail i was so scared when I saw this email then I didn’t reply so I got another email weeks later saying (As we have not heard from you, we are now reporting you to our Prosecutions team and British Transport Police, this will incur further fees) pls I don’t know what to do I need some advice cus I don’t have the money

 

[notmyrealname]

Hi.

I'm sure the experts will be here soon.

It sounds as if the railway company have looked at your ticket history and found other occasions of you buying a ticket that you weren't entitled to use.

It's highly unlikely you'll go to prison but you need to start co-operating with the TOC.

 

[Pushpit]

First thing, is you are not going to prison. Theoretically possible, but it just doesn't happen.

Secondly - we've seen this happen before in this forum, but to some extent the digital fraud team need more than just evidence of you buying child's tickets, they need evidence of you actually travelling using that ticket, which they may have, but without your co-operation it is uncertain. With your co-operation you may give them this evidence and then they will either prosecute or adjust the £800 offer.

My personal view is that either you regard £800 as the cost of getting yourself out of trouble, if you have that money (or can negotiate a repayment plan). Or you sit tight, say nothing, and see what happens next. That's is a risky approach, since it may - or may not - result in a prosecution. Now given that you say you can't pay £800, but a court would normally allow a 1 or even 2 year repayment plan (perhaps for a higher figure than £800), you may not have much choice but to see what happens next and avoid self incrimination.

You may think the above is harsh, but somehow the system has to ensure that at least in your case, crime does not pay. In the mean time it is vital you pay in full for each and every rail journey.

If you want more precise advice, you best share the two emails, redacting personal details and reference numbers. Given that we know that investigators read this forum you mustn't say in this forum anything specific about your previous rail journeys.

 

[Puffing Devil]

Please post copies of all the letters/emails you've received, with name/address/references blanked out. This will help give the best advice.

Whatever happens, unless you have a history of evading fares or other criminal activity, it is very unlikely that you will be sent to prison.

They will go to court on the basis that you have a history of buying child tickets and have been caught using a child ticket for a journey.

The good news is that they can only go back 6 months from the current date for a prosecution.

Post the documentation!

 

[AlterEgo]

The good news is that they can only go back 6 months from the current date for a prosecution.

Is that so? It depends what they prosecute for, surely. A Bylaw prosecution would be bound to fail, wouldn’t it? You need to basically catch people in the act to mount a case.

 

[Puffing Devil]

Is that so? It depends what they prosecute for, surely. A Bylaw prosecution would be bound to fail, wouldn’t it? You need to basically catch people in the act to mount a case.

The 3 Months imprisonment mentioned by the OP suggests the Regulation of Railways Act, which is summary only. Hence, the Magistrates’ Courts Act 1980 limitation of time applies.

I think they would present a history of child tickets purchased and used, coupled with the instance that the OP was caught using a child ticket. Given the history, they would suggest that it's beyond reasonable doubt that the OP used the tickets purchased in contravention of the act.

However, the clock is ticking on when they must bring this to court.

 

[JBuchananGB]

The TOC is making the very reasonable assumption that any Child rate tickets which you have bought in the last 5 years were not valid due to your being over 15. They expect you now to pay the full adult anytime single fare for each journey which you made without a ticket. This is not a fine. This is payment of the unpaid fares plus an amount to cover their administration costs. It is a criminal offence to travel without a valid ticket. They are entitled to prosecute you, and the question is, what evidence can you produce that the tickets you bought were not used by you to defraud them by travelling on their trains. On the other hand what evidence can they produce to say that you did travel? You can choose to pay what you owe, or plead not guilty at court and let the magistrate decide by comparing your evidence with theirs.

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello everyone I need some advice
I’m 20 year old and I normally get a child ticket when I’m broke so one day I get caught by a ticket inspector so they fine me for £100 within 21 days I have to pay the fine before 21 days I have already payed the fine, weeks later I got an email from an organization called digital fraud team on the email it’s says I was caught on a child ticket by a ticket inspector and now they’re charging for other tickets I have purchased in the past, they are requesting for a prove of age or evidence of my age now they are giving me an option to pay another fine of £800 or 3 months in jail i was so scared when I saw this email then I didn’t reply so I got another email weeks later saying (As we have not heard from you, we are now reporting you to our Prosecutions team and British Transport Police, this will incur further fees) pls I don’t know what to do I need some advice cus I don’t have the money

This isn't a good situation - but advice here is good and should help you weigh up the options.

I suspect that if you can pay the money they want it resolves the issue, but as yo indicate it's a lot and if you are skint that might not be possible. It's usually advised on here that if they offer these sums as out of court settlements you have to pay it in full quickly. However, there have been a small number of cases on here where ticket evaders have said they have been offered payment plans to pay in installments. You could ask if they will consider that. You would have to be 100% sure to stick to the payment plan or they would probably go to court if you missed a payment.

The alternative is to let it go to court - I think that could result in you paying more than this (and the court WILL find a way to get their money - court bailiffs etc not to be messed with) BUT by declaring your income and explaining financial circumstances you would get to pay the fines and costs from the court in installments I think - but you'd end up paying more.

The one thing I think you are best advised to do is to start engaging with / replying to the railway company - because if you don't things will get worse and it will cost more I think.

The reason this has happened is that Railway company knows that people they find with wrong tickets and issue Penalty Fares are often not due to first time they have done the wring thing, so they are increasingly using computer systems to check previous ticket buying records from wherever you have bought the tickets and this is how they have worked out you have been evading fares over a long time.

 

[aviationgeek]

Please post copies of all the letters/emails you've received, with name/address/references blanked out. This will help give the best advice.

Whatever happens, unless you have a history of evading fares or other criminal activity, it is very unlikely that you will be sent to prison.

They will go to court on the basis that you have a history of buying child tickets and have been caught using a child ticket for a journey.

The good news is that they can only go back 6 months from the current date for a prosecution.

Post the documentation!

Are you 100% sure it is only 6 months back? I'm of the understanding that they can look back at your ticket purchase history over the past few years, and in this case, they would probably look as far back at the passenger's tickets going forward from their 16th birthday to see what child tickets have been bought.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Are you 100% sure it is only 6 months back? I'm of the understanding that they can look back at your ticket purchase history over the past few years, and in this case, they would probably look as far back at the passenger's tickets going forward from their 16th birthday to see what child tickets have been bought.

It depends on what the railway wants to prosecute for.

The usual charges are under the railway byelaws or the Regulation of the Railways Act. These charges can only be heard at the magistrate’s court, and the rule there is that the court needs to be advised within six months of the alleged offence.

But it’s also open to the railway to prosecute under the Fraud Act. That’s heard at the Crown Court (so by a judge and jury rather than a panel of magistrates) which doesn’t have a time limit for starting action.

The received wisdom around here is that the railways are reluctant to charge for fraud: there’s an argument that they might struggle to show fraud within the meaning of the law, and even if they can clear that hurdle there’s the problem of gathering enough evidence to prove the facts for each use of a dodgy ticket - it’s easy enough to show that someone bought a ticket, but did they use it? It’s the use that is (arguably) fraudulent.

Hence @Puffing Devil ’s reference to a six month limit. In practice, they’re probably right. But there’s at least a theoretical chance of the railway coming back after six months: what currently seems to happen in some cases is that the threat of a fraud prosecution is used to encourage people who have been fare dodging for more than six months to settle out of court. It seems to me that it must be a decision for the person put in that position to decide whether to settle, or face the (possibly small) risk of a fraud trial, with everything that means in terms of time, cost, stress and at least the risk of going to prison.

 

[RPI]

The 3 Months imprisonment mentioned by the OP suggests the Regulation of Railways Act, which is summary only. Hence, the Magistrates’ Courts Act 1980 limitation of time applies.

I think they would present a history of child tickets purchased and used, coupled with the instance that the OP was caught using a child ticket. Given the history, they would suggest that it's beyond reasonable doubt that the OP used the tickets purchased in contravention of the act.

However, the clock is ticking on when they must bring this to court.

TOC's are now actively using the county courts to reclaim large sums of multi journey previous fares, so yes, you're right when you say that in terms of prosecution under RRA they only have 6 months, but that doesn't mean it gets written off.

I would say that there's nothing stopping a single RRA prosecution for the incident where a person is stopped, followed by a county court claim for anything previous.

 

[Puffing Devil]

Are you 100% sure it is only 6 months back? I'm of the understanding that they can look back at your ticket purchase history over the past few years, and in this case, they would probably look as far back at the passenger's tickets going forward from their 16th birthday to see what child tickets have been bought.

It depends on what the railway wants to prosecute for.

The usual charges are under the railway byelaws or the Regulation of the Railways Act. These charges can only be heard at the magistrate’s court, and the rule there is that the court needs to be advised within six months of the alleged offence.

But it’s also open to the railway to prosecute under the Fraud Act. That’s heard at the Crown Court (so by a judge and jury rather than a panel of magistrates) which doesn’t have a time limit for starting action.

The received wisdom around here is that the railways are reluctant to charge for fraud: there’s an argument that they might struggle to show fraud within the meaning of the law, and even if they can clear that hurdle there’s the problem of gathering enough evidence to prove the facts for each use of a dodgy ticket - it’s easy enough to show that someone bought a ticket, but did they use it? It’s the use that is (arguably) fraudulent.

Hence @Puffing Devil ’s reference to a six month limit. In practice, they’re probably right. But there’s at least a theoretical chance of the railway coming back after six months: what currently seems to happen in some cases is that the threat of a fraud prosecution is used to encourage people who have been fare dodging for more than six months to settle out of court. It seems to me that it must be a decision for the person put in that position to decide whether to settle, or face the (possibly small) risk of a fraud trial, with everything that means in terms of time, cost, stress and at least the risk of going to prison.

TOC's are now actively using the county courts to reclaim large sums of multi journey previous fares, so yes, you're right when you say that in terms of prosecution under RRA they only have 6 months, but that doesn't mean it gets written off.

I would say that there's nothing stopping a single RRA prosecution for the incident where a person is stopped, followed by a county court claim for anything previous.

Generally, the limit for any minor criminal prosecution to be brought in the Magistrates' Court is 6 months. Hence for a criminal conviction and a compensation order, the TOC needs to get the information to the court.

It's interesting to hear that TOCs are going to the county court for historical unpaid fares. It would be good to know more about those cases, though it does make sense for historic evasion over an extended period of time.

The increasing use of the Fraud Act is again something new—whether it could be used for simple evasion is an interesting question, as there is no fraud. However, Child Fares, Fake Tickets, and Altered Railcards are probably fair game. And also extends the prosecution time window, as it is triable either way.


I note that the OP hasn't returned and hasn't posted any emails or letters. Without those, we are working in the dark, the deep dusk.

 

[30907]

It's interesting to hear that TOCs are going to the county court for historical unpaid fares. It would be good to know more about those cases, though it does make sense for historic evasion over an extended period of time.

The increasing use of the Fraud Act is again something new—whether it could be used for simple evasion is an interesting question, as there is no fraud.

This is OT because it doesn't help the OP, but I don't think we've seen it used (as opposed to mentioned by TOCs.