Return to normality - a double edged sword?

How would you prefer the country to be once the crisis is entirely over?

  • Keep the lockdown regulations

    Votes: 1 0.7%
  • Return entirely to normality, as it was in 2019

    Votes: 66 45.5%
  • Return to normality, but keeping some of the elements such as work-from-home

    Votes: 70 48.3%
  • Keep many of the lockdown rules but remove some of the more restrictive aspects

    Votes: 2 1.4%
  • Remove all of the lockdown rules but societal changes in behavior which make life closer to lockdown

    Votes: 6 4.1%
  • Other

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    145

MontyMinerWA

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Doesn't mean they wouldn't have survived. We know business comes and goes but how can anyone say all recent events didn't damage economy. When did the economy last contract at the rate it is?
Bricks and mortar retail has been in decline terminal decline for a few years. The casual dining sector has been fighting for its life for some time. Airlines had been feeling the pinch prior to Covid 19. It's the worst economic slump since the 1920s but economic growth had been disappointing for some time before Covid 19 struck.
 
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Richard Scott

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Bricks and mortar retail has been in decline terminal decline for a few years. The casual dining sector has been fighting for its life for some time. Airlines had been feeling the pinch prior to Covid 19. It's the worst economic slump since the 1920s but economic growth had been disappointing for some time before Covid 19 struck.
That may all be the case but you cannot say current issue hasn't had an impact.
 

LAX54

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I must have imagined multiple companies going broke costing thousands of jobs this week then
and the Government estimating that close to 8 million will lose their jobs over this too ! that figure is far far higher than any C19 figure both 'with it and deaths' !
 

MontyMinerWA

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and the Government estimating that close to 8 million will lose their jobs over this too ! that figure is far far higher than any C19 figure both 'with it and deaths' !
Do you have a source for the eight million job losses? Just curious that's all.
 

MontyMinerWA

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That may all be the case but you cannot say current issue hasn't had an impact.
I concur that it's had an impact but to a large extent it's just a smokescreen. The thing that's really killing bricks and mortar retail / casual dining is high rents and increasing wage costs. Low consumer confidence is also not helping but that was evident before the Covid 19 pandemic.
 

PTR 444

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I would like a return to near pre-covid normailty as soon as possible, however there are a few societal changes that I would keep:

WFH - Businesses should give staff a work from home allowance for 1-3 days per week. If it is proven to give people a better work-life balance while maintaining productivity, then there should be a shift towards it. It will also help reduce morning and evening peak travel demand, relieving pressure on the railway.

Quieter shopping times - Capacity limitations have meant shops are much quieter than usual, and this has particularly benefited those with sensory conditions who cannot cope with noise or crowds. I would encourage shops to allocate 1-2 hours for a quieter shopping period, with anyone wishing to visit during that time required to book in advance.

A shift towards greener travel - The lockdown showed us that the effects of traffic pollution can be reversed rather swiftly, so we should aim to keep encouraging greener forms of travel. Pop-up cycle lanes should become more widespread with some being converted into proper cycle lanes. Also, more cities should have car free days and encourage people to travel in by bus or train.
 

SouthEastBuses

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For me: 2019 normal however with a minor change:

Banning domestic flights (except those to Northern Ireland and islands cut off from mainland UK such as Isles of Scilly), and short distance international flights (such as those to Paris, Amsterdam or Brussels, for example) and having more trains to replace them. That way, international (and long distance domestic) travel can be kept like before, but in a more ecologically and environmentally sustainable way. Instead of more unnecessary domestic / short distance international flights, we should have for example: more Cross Country trains (and electrification) for domestic travel, and more Eurostar trains to more destinations (maybe Bordeaux or Frankfurt, or even all the way as far as Spain or Italy?) on the European mainland for short distance international travel.

And, hopefully, in about 20-30 years time, having the Japenese Shinkansen L0 Series maglev supersonic speed trains (the one that reached the world speed record of 603 km/h) replacing long haul flights! They can apparently go 643-804 kmh - that's only 100 km/h less than a regular plane in flight! Although of course building the infrastucture can be very difficult and very expensive, costing billions, if not trillions of money. Especially if you want to build a route across the Atlantic Ocean...
Adding to that:

For example, if you want to travel from London to Paris and enjoy a weekend break there, how about you take the Eurostar high speed train instead of flying on an insanely cheap EasyJet / Ryanair flight?
 

GRALISTAIR

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Dalton Georgia USA
For me: 2019 normal however with a minor change:

Banning domestic flights (except those to Northern Ireland and islands cut off from mainland UK such as Isles of Scilly), and short distance international flights (such as those to Paris, Amsterdam or Brussels, for example) and having more trains to replace them. That way, international (and long distance domestic) travel can be kept like before, but in a more ecologically and environmentally sustainable way. Instead of more unnecessary domestic / short distance international flights, we should have for example: more Cross Country trains (and electrification) for domestic travel, and more Eurostar trains to more destinations (maybe Bordeaux or Frankfurt, or even all the way as far as Spain or Italy?) on the European mainland for short distance international travel.

And, hopefully, in about 20-30 years time, having the Japenese Shinkansen L0 Series maglev supersonic speed trains (the one that reached the world speed record of 603 km/h) replacing long haul flights! They can apparently go 643-804 kmh - that's only 100 km/h less than a regular plane in flight! Although of course building the infrastucture can be very difficult and very expensive, costing billions, if not trillions of money. Especially if you want to build a route across the Atlantic Ocean...
On balance this would not be too bad.
 

Scrotnig

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5 Sep 2017
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513
I want the old normal, exactly as it was. Nothing much wrong with it, and you can make adjustments from that starting point, as opposed to this 'new normal' being pushed mostly by people with some sort of agenda.

I'll have my traffic jams, crappy office and late, overcrowded trains please. It may not sound brilliant but it's many magnitudes better than the depressing nonsense we have now.
 

NorthOxonian

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5 Jul 2018
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Adding to that:

For example, if you want to travel from London to Paris and enjoy a weekend break there, how about you take the Eurostar high speed train instead of flying on an insanely cheap EasyJet / Ryanair flight?
Have you seen how much more Eurostar fares are, especially if not booked months in advance? You'd significantly increase the price for most passengers, and possibly price them out of travel entirely.

I accept there's limited capacity, but the way to sort that is to promote alternatives - something like the current Calais daytripper ticket (which is really only a curiosity and probably used just a few times all year), but on a bigger scale. If we want to actually see modal shift, an extremely expensive high speed train won't be enough.
 
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For example, if you want to travel from London to Paris and enjoy a weekend break there, how about you take the Eurostar high speed train instead of flying on an insanely cheap EasyJet / Ryanair flight?
Eurostar is only really convenient if you're from London or in the immediate vicinity of. It'd be much more convenient for me to drive to Edinburgh Airport and take a flight from there.

Oh, and Eurostar is extortionate.
 

Alex C.

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7 Jan 2014
Messages
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The WFH debate will rumble on but I think the good thing is for companies to be more open to flexibility. A while ago it was proposed that workers have a right to request WFH where it's possible like the right to request flexible working hours. The ideal situation is that with many more companies offering WFH, this can be something to throw in the mix when looking for a new job. Anecdotally, 95% of people I know are happy working from home and as time has gone on, I've become much more comfortable with it. My organisation is massively geographically spread out so outside of my immediate team, I'm always having to communicate remotely anyway.

I wouldn't be surprised if places like Pret take a long time to recover, many London WFHers commuting from the Home Counties and further will have got used to having an extra £400-500 in their pocket every month in commuting costs, without considering the savings on food and social events. I'll certainly not be returning quickly to buying a sandwich every day from the shop near work - although over time I'm sure things might change.

It's probably a good thing for people to realise how much they're spending unnecessarily. As lockdown restrictions have eased, we've done lots more socialising in public spaces and at home - which is generally much cheaper. On my first night 'out out' since lockdown last week I spent a small fortune and realised how wasteful I was with cash previously.

I like that many more places do table reservations now - it's nice, especially if you're going somewhere new, and don't know how busy places will be to be able to book a table. I also don't mind table service and can see that sticking around - less so in 'local' pubs.

There is inevitably going to be casualties economically, and I sincerely hope that the Government is planning on supporting people longer term - with retraining, more apprenticeships, job support etc - rather than just sticking them on universal credit. There are a lot of positives that could come out of a terrible situation.
 

bramling

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The WFH debate will rumble on but I think the good thing is for companies to be more open to flexibility. A while ago it was proposed that workers have a right to request WFH where it's possible like the right to request flexible working hours. The ideal situation is that with many more companies offering WFH, this can be something to throw in the mix when looking for a new job. Anecdotally, 95% of people I know are happy working from home and as time has gone on, I've become much more comfortable with it. My organisation is massively geographically spread out so outside of my immediate team, I'm always having to communicate remotely anyway.

I wouldn't be surprised if places like Pret take a long time to recover, many London WFHers commuting from the Home Counties and further will have got used to having an extra £400-500 in their pocket every month in commuting costs, without considering the savings on food and social events. I'll certainly not be returning quickly to buying a sandwich every day from the shop near work - although over time I'm sure things might change.

It's probably a good thing for people to realise how much they're spending unnecessarily. As lockdown restrictions have eased, we've done lots more socialising in public spaces and at home - which is generally much cheaper. On my first night 'out out' since lockdown last week I spent a small fortune and realised how wasteful I was with cash previously.

I like that many more places do table reservations now - it's nice, especially if you're going somewhere new, and don't know how busy places will be to be able to book a table. I also don't mind table service and can see that sticking around - less so in 'local' pubs.

There is inevitably going to be casualties economically, and I sincerely hope that the Government is planning on supporting people longer term - with retraining, more apprenticeships, job support etc - rather than just sticking them on universal credit. There are a lot of positives that could come out of a terrible situation.
My local Facebook has some wonderful stuff about working from home, such as “it’s brilliant the town centre will thrive as all the people working at home will be in the town all day supporting cafes and eateries”.

There really is some mass delusion going on.
 

DavidB

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My local Facebook has some wonderful stuff about working from home, such as “it’s brilliant the town centre will thrive as all the people working at home will be in the town all day supporting cafes and eateries”.

There really is some mass delusion going on.
Indeed.

The one about people wanting to work at home all the time appears to be another delusion - many would like to work at home for part of the week, but few want to do it all the time every week.
 

Mitchell Hurd

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Return to normality as it was in 2019, as soon as possible! As these "social distancing" and "COVID-Secure" measures dragging on for months on end are absolutely wrecking the economy! We can't go on much longer like this.
Agreed. I can imagine peoples reaction as TfW and the BTP have reinforced the travel message.

I'm getting beyond desperate for a return - I won't say too much but lets say I can't find any energy to get me through however long we may have and I'll be soon having to resort to Talking Space. Space for extra energy is exactly what I need.

Boris twice using the 'squeeze that brake pedal, squeeze the pedal' phrase last Friday really fired up my irritation. It's bad enough him deciding to scrap people's wedding celebrations, and opening of buildings which people will have spent time, money and energy. I mean how can he give just hours notice? If I was one of those wedding guests, I'd be pretty angry - no way would I return half way during a flight, public transport journey or car journey. Not after all that planning I would have done.

Even a short trip into Oxford from my hometown of Abingdon (Oxfordshire) without social distancing and face mask wearing would be a big bonus - everything else almost feels like a dream!

I clicked the 'how it was before 2019' because yes public transport in many areas were busy but at least we'll not have evidence of what Covid-19 was like. If I was working from home then I'd be tempted to go back to actual work rather than stay at home.

So apologies for going off (and then back to the) topic plus sounding stressed here but the rules are like the first generation DMU's on their last legs - not really working that well.
 

LAX54

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It seems Kirstie Allsopp has been berated by a few on the internet, she was saying that people working at home should get back as soon as they can, based on the fact if you can work at home with no issues, then you / or someone can work at home overseas and for a lot less money, and that she would be concerned for her job long term, by working from home instead of an Office
 

LAX54

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I want the old normal, exactly as it was. Nothing much wrong with it, and you can make adjustments from that starting point, as opposed to this 'new normal' being pushed mostly by people with some sort of agenda.

I'll have my traffic jams, crappy office and late, overcrowded trains please. It may not sound brilliant but it's many magnitudes better than the depressing nonsense we have now.
Don't think you are alone in that :)
 

Chester1

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One negative aspect of working from home seems to be dawning on people now - if someone can work at home, what's to stop their work being outsourced to locations offshore where labour is cheaper?
This is only a problem for jobs that can be done at very efficiently with full time home working. There are other issues around quality and data protection. The vast majority of people currently working from home full time will be back in the office part of the week at some point. My guess would be an average of 3 days in the office and 2 days WFH. That would save employers tremendous amounts on property and give employees more flexibility. Both full time office and full time home working are sub optimal for many jobs.

I voted for normality but with some changes. I understand why people would want a return to 2019 situation but its extremely unlikely. After massive upheaval things rarely return to how they were.
 

westv

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It seems Kirstie Allsopp has been berated by a few on the internet, she was saying that people working at home should get back as soon as they can, based on the fact if you can work at home with no issues, then you / or someone can work at home overseas and for a lot less money, and that she would be concerned for her job long term, by working from home instead of an Office
Anybody who claims you can make yourself indispensable by just turning up is living in cloud cuckoo land.
 

DavidB

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My guess would be an average of 3 days in the office and 2 days WFH. That would save employers tremendous amounts on property and give employees more flexibility.
I would agree with the first bit (where I work, staff seem to want 2 or 3 days at home ideally). The second bit is going to vary though depending on the organisation - in our case (we have looked at it), it'll make little to no difference as one of the main purposes of being in the office will be to see other colleagues, so they'll need to be in on those days as well. We aleady use hotdesking as we have more staff than desks, but that isn't a problem as many of them are out working on site for a lot of the time normally.
 

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