Rishi Sunak and the Conservative Party.

[najaB]

Was it a question about DR Congo, or by an audience member from DR Congo? Both are mentioned but are not necessarily the same thing!

Both.

 

[Magdalia]

To compare that to population by age:

Thanks for these. Are they the ONS numbers from the 2021 census please?

Can you provide a link that shows the full data series also including years 0-64 please?

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Words [insert expletive] fail me:

Minister Chris Philp's Rwanda question raises eyebrows

The Question Time audience were surprised when Chris Philp answered an audience member's question about DR Congo.

www.bbc.co.uk

This is a case where it's worth watching the video linked to in the BBC story before you pass judgement based on a couple of lines of a BBC report. If you watch the video, it's pretty clear that the story is making a mountain out of nothing by apparently trying to make out that Chris Philip Jeremy Hunt doesn't know the DR Congo is a country. In fact, if you watch the video, it's very clear that Chris Philip is simply asking a rhetorical question as he clarifies what was actually a pretty complicated question one of the audience was asking. Indeed the final paragraph acknowledges this by stating

An ally of Mr Philp suggested the minister had been posing a rhetorical question, rather than a real one, as he tried to clarify what he had been asked.

(I would say it's misleading for the BBC to make out that is questionable: It's very clear from the video that is to a large extent what is going on).

There's also something else important: The guy asking the question refers simply to 'Congo'. In fact there is no country merely called 'Congo' but there are two different countries with 'Congo' in their name - the Republic of the Congo and the Democratic Republic of the Congo - so the question is already ambiguous and potentially confusing. Hardly surprising that the person answering it on the spot might want to think about it for a second and clarify it. The BBC have misleadingly hidden this by showing subtitles that say 'DR Congo' but of course that information wouldn't have been available to the Question Time panel.

All in all, whatever you think about the Rwanda legislation, the problem here is the BBC putting up a very misleading story. Incredibly poor journalism here.

 

[najaB]

This is a case where it's worth watching the video linked to in the BBC story before you pass judgement based on a couple of lines of a BBC report. If you watch the video, it's pretty clear that the story is making a mountain out of nothing by apparently trying to make out that Jeremy Hunt doesn't know the DR Congo is a country. In fact, if you watch the video, it's very clear that Jeremy Hunt is simply asking a rhetorical question as he clarifies what was actually a pretty complicated question one of the audience was asking.

I have watched the video and, unsurprisingly, I disagree with your characterisation of it. The fact that his initial answer was "There's an exclusion on people from Rwanda being sent to Rwanda" makes it clear that he had no idea what the questioner meant by "Congo". You can tell by the reaction of the audience that they weren't in any doubt that he was clueless, and both the host and the questioner had to repeat that DR Congo is a different country than Rwanda.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

You can tell by the reaction of the audience that they weren't in any doubt that he was clueless, and both the host and the questioner had to repeat that DR Congo is a different country than Rwanda.

How did they manage to do that when no-one had actually explicitly referred to the DR Congo? The DR bit is entirely in the BBC report and the subtitles - as far as I can see, it's nowhere in the actual recording. The questioner merely said, Congo, which by itself is completely ambiguous.

 

[SteveM70]

If you watch the video, it's pretty clear that the story is making a mountain out of nothing by apparently trying to make out that Jeremy Hunt doesn't know the DR Congo is a country. In fact, if you watch the video, it's very clear that Jeremy Hunt is simply asking a rhetorical question as he clarifies what was actually a pretty complicated question one of the audience was asking

Chris Philp, not Jeremy Hunt

 

[AM9]

This is a case where it's worth watching the video linked to in the BBC story before you pass judgement based on a couple of lines of a BBC report. If you watch the video, it's pretty clear that the story is making a mountain out of nothing by apparently trying to make out that Jeremy Hunt doesn't know the DR Congo is a country. In fact, if you watch the video, it's very clear that Jeremy Hunt is simply asking a rhetorical question as he clarifies what was actually a pretty complicated question one of the audience was asking. Indeed the final paragraph acknowledges this by stating



(I would say it's misleading for the BBC to make out that is questionable: It's very clear from the video that is to a large extent what is going on).

There's also something else important: The guy asking the question refers simply to 'Congo'. In fact there is no country merely called 'Congo' but there are two different countries with 'Congo' in their name - the Republic of the Congo and the Democratic Republic of the Congo - so the question is already ambiguous and potentially confusing. Hardly surprising that the person answering it on the spot might want to think about it for a second and clarify it. The BBC have misleadingly hidden this by showing subtitles that say 'DR Congo' but of course that information wouldn't have been available to the Question Time panel.

All in all, whatever you think about the Rwanda legislation, the problem here is the BBC putting up a very misleading story. Incredibly poor journalism here.

There was no 'very misleading story' put up be the BBC, I saw it live and it was quite obvious what was being asked. Cabinet collective responsibility requires that each minister supports each government decision. Philip, as Minister for Policing in UK may not be familiar with every aspect of the Rwanda policy, but rather than trying to immediately parry the question as 'fixed and not a problem' by rattling off a line from the recent legislation's headlines, should at least have ascertianed his understanding of the question by asking. Maybe his response was so dismissive because the questioner was just another person from an African nation about which he neither knew nor cared much.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Chris Philp, not Jeremy Hunt

Oops, yep, my mistake, thanks - fixed.

(Rewatching the video, Chris Philip and Jeremy Hunt do look very alike - at least to my eyes)

 

[gg1]

How did they manage to do that when no-one had actually explicitly referred to the DR Congo? The DR bit is entirely in the BBC report and the subtitles - as far as I can see, it's nowhere in the actual recording. The questioner merely said, Congo, which by itself is completely ambiguous.

As you mentioned yourself a few posts earlier, the only ambiguity is around which of the two similarly named nations the questioner was referring to. This is completely irrelevant to Philp's gaff of seemingly not being aware that Rwanda and Congo (either of them) are seperate nations.

 

[D6130]

As you mentioned yourself a few posts earlier, the only ambiguity is around which of the two similarly named nations the questioner was referring to. This is completely irrelevant to Philp's gaff of seemingly not being aware that Rwanda and Congo (either of them) are seperate nations.

Ah well....that's another - very public - nail in the Tories' coffin come the general election. It can't come soon enough!

 

[najaB]

The questioner merely said, Congo, which by itself is completely ambiguous.

Neither the Republic of the Congo nor the Democratic Republic of the Congo are, in fact, Rwanda.

Edit: The questioner also said that his family were in Goma, which would eliminate any ambiguity.

 

[SteveM70]

Oops, yep, my mistake, thanks - fixed.

(Rewatching the video, Chris Philip and Jeremy Hunt do look very alike - at least to my eyes)

Yes, he does, I'll give you that

 

[jfollows]

Yes, he does, I'll give you that

The difference is that Jeremy Hunt has more functioning brain cells, Chris Philp is an enormous self-publicist who misses no opportunity to say something but isn’t backed up with a functioning mind.

 

[Ediswan]

As you mentioned yourself a few posts earlier, the only ambiguity is around which of the two similarly named nations the questioner was referring to.

I was watching 'live' on iPlayer. The context was activity on the border between Rwanda and 'Congo'. Of the two, only DR Congo borders Rwanda.

 

[brad465]

This is a case where it's worth watching the video linked to in the BBC story before you pass judgement based on a couple of lines of a BBC report. If you watch the video, it's pretty clear that the story is making a mountain out of nothing by apparently trying to make out that Chris Philip Jeremy Hunt doesn't know the DR Congo is a country. In fact, if you watch the video, it's very clear that Chris Philip is simply asking a rhetorical question as he clarifies what was actually a pretty complicated question one of the audience was asking. Indeed the final paragraph acknowledges this by stating



(I would say it's misleading for the BBC to make out that is questionable: It's very clear from the video that is to a large extent what is going on).

There's also something else important: The guy asking the question refers simply to 'Congo'. In fact there is no country merely called 'Congo' but there are two different countries with 'Congo' in their name - the Republic of the Congo and the Democratic Republic of the Congo - so the question is already ambiguous and potentially confusing. Hardly surprising that the person answering it on the spot might want to think about it for a second and clarify it. The BBC have misleadingly hidden this by showing subtitles that say 'DR Congo' but of course that information wouldn't have been available to the Question Time panel.

All in all, whatever you think about the Rwanda legislation, the problem here is the BBC putting up a very misleading story. Incredibly poor journalism here.

Politics is a cruel opportunistic game, anyone who goes into it has to learn this and know how to play it. Philp should have not taken that risk; the natural reactions of the audience and the panel are testament to that (had they not reacted like that, the BBC probably wouldn't have done this standout video/article). Perception matters a lot in politics, even if what is perceived is not true, and now many will look at Philp and know him for this gaffe, even if he did genuinely know about the different countries.

To take another example that this reminds me of: back in the Global Financial Crisis, there was a PMQs where Brown was defending the bank bailouts. He infamously said "We not only saved the world...uh saved the banks", and instantly the entire opposition benches erupted in laughter. Once the hapless speaker finally gained order, Brown resumed and said "We not only worked with other countries to save the world's banking system..." and continued as planned. The actual answer made sense, but one slip-up and his opponents seized the moment, and that's all anyone remembers.

In short, Philp only has himself to blame for not thinking twice about his approach here. You want to be a politician, in particular a minister, you have to learn the rules of the game, be able to handle the pressure of the role and be on top of your brief before going out in public.

 

[Gigabit]

How did they manage to do that when no-one had actually explicitly referred to the DR Congo? The DR bit is entirely in the BBC report and the subtitles - as far as I can see, it's nowhere in the actual recording. The questioner merely said, Congo, which by itself is completely ambiguous.

But isn't the point that the Tory MP believed Congo and Rwanda were the same country? It doesn't matter what country he was referring to, neither Congo is or ever has been? He also said Congo was fighting with Rwanda so it was quite heavily implied which he meant.

 

[najaB]

But isn't the point that the Tory MP believed Congo and Rwanda were the same country?

Whether he actually believed that or not only he can answer, but that is definitely the impression that anyone watching the clip with an unbiased eye would come to.

 

[nw1]

Chris Philp... heard the name before somewhere. He's the MP for Croydon North isn't he? Or is it Croydon Central? Well they're the same, who cares.