Role of on board staff on Merseyrail trains and associated issues (e.g. ticket selling/checking)

[Bletchleyite]

Is this still the plan then?

I believe that was the agreement, yes.

 

[OL-3944]

From my contact. The brief from the RMT reps was accept the deal or be made redundant. The overall general consensus is that the role will be gone anyway in 18-24 months, and this gives enough time for current guards to escape the role and hopefully go driving.

 

[Moonshot]

From my contact. The brief from the RMT reps was accept the deal or be made redundant. The overall general consensus is that the role will be gone anyway in 18-24 months, and this gives enough time for current guards to escape the role and hopefully go driving.

What's the deal for ASLEF to accept this deal?

 

[jamesst]

What's the deal for ASLEF to accept this deal?

There is currently no deal with Aslef

 

[Moonshot]

There is currently no deal with Aslef

Drivers won't accept door operations without the appropriate salary increase

 

[Bletchleyite]

From my contact. The brief from the RMT reps was accept the deal or be made redundant. The overall general consensus is that the role will be gone anyway in 18-24 months, and this gives enough time for current guards to escape the role and hopefully go driving.

A lot of people (me, certainly) thought that of the Southern OBS, far easier to get rid of because it isn't considered safety critical, and yet it seems to have stayed. They have only been got rid of on a few routes and that only by changing them from Southern Electrostar services to Thameslink Desiro City ones - but no general attempt to get rid.

Interesting if the RMT thought it was "accept or DOO it is". I had expected them to have to retrofit guard panels and do driver release, guard close.

 

[OL-3944]

I’m not familiar with the Southern OBS role, do they sell tickets? The RMT offered for TMs to sell tickets but this was turned down. Merseytravel want a “buy” before you travel system heavily making use of the new platform validators and purchasing tickets on the internet.

In the long run booking office closures and Carlisle security becoming the only visible “staff” on the network.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I’m not familiar with the Southern OBS role, do they sell tickets? The RMT offered for TMs to sell tickets but this was turned down. Merseytravel want a “buy” before you travel system heavily making use of the new platform validators and purchasing tickets on the internet.

The agreement posted elsewhere on the forum said they would be checking tickets. What's the point in doing that if they can't take any action if they find someone without other than asking them if they wouldn't mind getting off please?

E-ticket acceptance on Merseyrail would be a fine thing!

In the long run station closures and Carlisle security becoming the only visible “staff” on the network.

Do you mean booking office closures? I would expect that, I'd be surprised if Merseyrail closed any stations entirely. They seem more minded to add more new ones.

 

[bramling]

In the long run station closures and Carlisle security becoming the only visible “staff” on the network.

Which isn't really a great outcome. Roving security staff simply doesn't give the same presence as properly trained railway staff, even someone in a booking office at least gives the feeling that the station is supervised. Compare Merseyrail to Tyne & Wear Metro, the latter is significantly more feral.

 

[OL-3944]

The agreement posted elsewhere on the forum said they would be checking tickets. What's the point in doing that if they can't take any action if they find someone without other than asking them if they wouldn't mind getting off please?

E-ticket acceptance on Merseyrail would be a fine thing!



Do you mean booking office closures? I would expect that, I'd be surprised if Merseyrail closed any stations entirely. They seem more minded to add more new ones.

Post edited. Not stations but booking offices. Past 1800 most of the smaller booking offices are closed now.

 

[74A]

Interesting if the RMT thought it was "accept or DOO it is". I had expected them to have to retrofit guard panels and do driver release, guard close.

That would tale too long. Quicker for driver close.

 

[Bletchleyite]

That would tale too long. Quicker for driver close.

Oh, I know DOO does speed things up a bit, particularly with the shorter trains operated on Merseyrail. I'm just surprised the RMT agreed it. ASLEF of course may not, and Merseyrail don't have the same "agree it or DOO it is" leverage with drivers, so this may not quite be over yet.

 

[D821]

The Liverpool Echo is reporting about the RMT deal today, doesn't say anything about ASLEF though.

 

[mrd269697]

First I’ve heard about that. Considering I voted in the referendum the other day

 

[DorkingMain]

A lot of people (me, certainly) thought that of the Southern OBS, far easier to get rid of because it isn't considered safety critical, and yet it seems to have stayed. They have only been got rid of on a few routes and that only by changing them from Southern Electrostar services to Thameslink Desiro City ones - but no general attempt to get rid.

Interesting if the RMT thought it was "accept or DOO it is". I had expected them to have to retrofit guard panels and do driver release, guard close.

I'm guessing the revenue element of it is why it's stayed more than anything. The amount of revenue they take from ticketless passengers *plus* the amount of passengers that buy a ticket knowing it's likely they get checked and potentially lumped with a more expensive fare than they would have done (NRCOT 9.2.1), probably makes the grade worthwhile for that alone.

 

[WatcherZero]

84% have voted in favour of the TM deal.

 

[Moonshot]

Has this got any further forward with ASLEF?

 

[jamesst]

Has this got any further forward with ASLEF?

Talks ongoing