Routing Guide Help for stations between Stevenage and Finsbury Park only

[Aictos]

I'm not sure if I'm reading it correctly but is it valid for a passenger to be routed Potters Bar to Hertford North via Alexandra Palace/Finsbury Park or do they have to be routed via Stevenage?

Will be interesting to know what you guys make of the routing guide?

 

[RJ]

I'm not sure if I'm reading it correctly but is it valid for a passenger to be routed Potters Bar to Hertford North via Alexandra Palace/Finsbury Park or do they have to be routed via Stevenage?

Will be interesting to know what you guys make of the routing guide?

The two share routeing points. The shortest route is via Alexandra Palace, so it is valid by default.

Doubling back is generally forbidden. The availability of non stop services between Potters Bar and Finsbury Park probably make the journey time the same as changing at Alexandra Palace in some cases. It may be a popular choice of route, which is why a fare exists with that route.

 

[bb21]

There are three fares. One routed VIA FINSBURY PK, one VIA ALEXANDRA P, and the other VIA STEVENAGE.

Depends on the fare paid.

 

[Searle]

There are three fares, via Alexandra Palace (the cheapest), via Stevenage (a bit more expensive), and via Finsbury Park (generally the most expensive). So it's reasonable to go either way, just make sure you have the correct route!

 

[transmanche]

There are three fares. One routed VIA FINSBURY PK, one VIA ALEXANDRA P, and the other VIA STEVENAGE.

Depends on the fare paid.

I notice that in most cases (but not all) the via Alexandra Palace and via Stevenage fares are the same.

Would be good if FCC simplified it to via Finsbury Park and NOT via Finsbury Park.

 

[Eagle]

Would be good if FCC simplified it to via Finsbury Park and NOT via Finsbury Park.

That would only work if both via Ally Pally and via Stevenage are permitted routes.

In this case, as Potters Bar and Hertford North share a routeing point then the permitted routes are those that are the shortest or within three miles. Ally Pally is the shortest and Stevenage is two miles longer, so both are permitted. But for other combinations of origin and destination for similar journeys this may not be the case.

 

[yorkie]

Don't forget a routed ticket is also valid via routes that are cheaper, or the same price.

So yes, it would make more sense to do something like re-name via Finsbury Park to 'Any Permitted' and the others as 'Not via Finsbury Park', with an appropriate easement allowing travel via Finsbury Park (and obviously checks that both other routes were permitted), OR my preference would be to rename the cheaper fares to 'Any Permitted' with the more expensive 'via Finsbury Park' fare remaining as it is.
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That would only work if both via Ally Pally and via Stevenage are permitted routes.

In this case, as Potters Bar and Hertford North share a routeing point then the permitted routes are those that are the shortest or within three miles. Ally Pally is the shortest and Stevenage is two miles longer, so both are permitted. But for other combinations of origin and destination for similar journeys this may not be the case.

Agreed.

 

[jon0844]

Ideally, FCC would do something akin to the line2line offering from Hatfield to St Albans, and then let people go from WGC to Hertford North (perhaps even continuing on to Hertford East for other connections).

That would then be yet another option, and possibly the cheapest of all.

 

[Be3G]

Don't forget a routed ticket is also valid via routes that are cheaper, or the same price.

I'd like to see a FCC ticket inspector chew over that one! (Actually no I wouldn't, because it'd probably result in the poor passenger facing an attempted prosecution.)

 

[bb21]

That would only work if both via Ally Pally and via Stevenage are permitted routes.

In this case, as Potters Bar and Hertford North share a routeing point then the permitted routes are those that are the shortest or within three miles. Ally Pally is the shortest and Stevenage is two miles longer, so both are permitted. But for other combinations of origin and destination for similar journeys this may not be the case.

I am afraid that I do not agree entirely with the highlighted sentence.

Section F - The National Routeing Guide in Detail of the Routeing Guide clearly states on Page F7,

Finding a permitted route when the origin and destination stations have a routeing point in common.

If there is a common routeing point, the permitted route is the shortest route or a route which is longer by no more than 3 miles. Also permitted is the route followed by direct trains to and from the common routeing point if the journey is made on those trains.

This is reinforced by Example 1 on Page F12 which states,

Both stations have the Chatham Group as a routeing point. If there is a common routeing point, the permitted route is the shortest distance between them which has a regular scheduled train service whether or not it passes through that routeing point. It is also a permitted route if the journey can be made by direct trains from the origin to the common routeing point and from the common routeing point to the destination.

This is also reinforced by the example given on Page F7,

But the journey is valid on direct trains from Stratford-upon-Avon to Birmingham and from Birmingham to Solihull. Note, however, that if the same journey is made by trains which are not direct to and from Birmingham, this ceases to be a permitted route.

Stevenage is a common routeing point for both Potters Bar and Hertford North, hence via Stevenage would be a permitted route on direct trains to/from Potters Bar and Hertford North if an Any Permitted ticket existed, even if it happens to be more than 3 miles longer than the route via Alexandra Palace.

 

[Aictos]

So in short as long as the ticket is routed Any Permitted, you could travel Potters Bar to Hertford North via either Stevenage, Alexandra Palace or Finsbury Park?

 

[bb21]

Yes, that is my understanding, given that via Stevenage is no more than 3 miles longer than via Alexandra Palace.

The problem is that there is no Any Permitted fare. The most expensive of the three routed fares will be valid on all three routes.

 

[greatkingrat]

Any Stevenage commuters fancy trying a combination of a New Southgate-Bowes Park season and SDRs Alexandra Palace - London?