SE & SWR don't want to sell me a 1st class return on their websites

[Metal_gee_man]

As the title states, both SE / SWR don't seem to offer 1st Class returns only singles (peak and off peak) am I being daft or am I right and this seems a stupid way to set their fares? Could this be the TOCs trying to remove 1st Class seats to add capacity?

Before anyone comments yes both the 1st Class offerings on the Class 375/377s and the Class 450s is dire and not really worth paying for, but I wanted to travel in slightly more comfortable surroundings for a change and thought I'd take look at the price.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Is the journey over two or more days? Typically there aren't First Class period returns in most of the former Network area.

 

[Metal_gee_man]

Yes, that'd be the reason! It's a daft abnormality then?

 

[JonathanH]

Yes, that'd be the reason! It's a daft abnormality then?

Not really, you are just expected to buy a single in each direction in the same way as peak fares work in London and the South East. Reduces the possibility of fraud that might exist if people have an open dated ticket.

 

[Starmill]

In lots of cases you are effectively expected to pay double. For example Southampton Central to London Terminals, on SWR on a weekday, a First Class single is £74.60, with a day return available at £77.50.

Southern, where there is even less point than on SWR in paying to upgrade, do offer First Off Peak Returns though on some routes.

If you really want to sit in First Class you could buy a Standard Off Peak Return and then go and ask the guard for a price to upgrade. If First Class is empty you may find they have some discretion to upgrade you for half the difference, or just £20 or something. Obviously only do this if you are prepared to sit in standard otherwise. There are even some SWR guards on this forum who, if asked politely, might respond by offering to let you sit there for free

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you really want to sit in First Class you could buy a Standard Off Peak Return and then go and ask the guard for a price to upgrade. If First Class is empty you may find they have some discretion to upgrade you for half the difference, or just £20 or something. Obviously only do this if you are prepared to sit in standard otherwise.

And approach the guard/OBS BEFORE taking a seat in 1st. If you don't, you could be liable to a PF or prosecution.

 

[swt_passenger]

In lots of cases you are effectively expected to pay double. For example Southampton Central to London Terminals, on SWR on a weekday, a First Class single is £74.60, with a day return available at £77.50.

For many years SWT didn’t offer any first offpeak Day Returns, it wasn’t that long ago they were introduced, maybe less than 10 years ago, and only on certain routes initially? I only started using them when I got a senior railcard, but IIRC they weren’t that well known. It’s possible a period version wasn’t considered for some reason.