Settle and Carlisle availability for diversions nowadays

[TheBigD]

I doubt we'll see the S&C used for WCML diversions again. No AWC/TPE crews sign it anymore. The 20 AWC voyagers are soon to be replaced by 11 Hitachi Class 805s meaning AWC will have even less trains capable of using the route. The practise of bussing passengers up and down the M6 is well established and also around an hour quicker for through passengers. Unless the S&C gets (which I doubt it ever will) a route upgrade similar to what the Joint Line got, to take the freight off the WCML. You would probable need electrification as well as most of the container trains were* electric hauled.

Out of interest, how many diesel hauled freights are there on the northern section of the WCML that could be routed via the WCML?

* currently some are class 66 due to current elektrickery costs

 

[GRALISTAIR]

They reversed at Preston and took the Blackburn line.

Into Preston - electric detached at front (usually). Diesel attached to the rear and the proceed.

 

[dave59]

The WCML is not very reliable during the winter months - lots of flooding etc. Maybe HS2 never thought about that when they intend to run the entire fast Anglo-Scottish service that way. There would need to be some robust diversionary routes. Or maybe some very fast electric buses up the M6 by then? As for the S&C being slow it doesn't seem to bother LNER with their diversions via Carlisle - these are very slow compared to the A1.

 

[The Planner]

The WCML is not very reliable during the winter months - lots of flooding etc. Maybe HS2 never thought about that when they intend to run the entire fast Anglo-Scottish service that way. There would need to be some robust diversionary routes. Or maybe some very fast electric buses up the M6 by then? As for the S&C being slow it doesn't seem to bother LNER with their diversions via Carlisle - these are very slow compared to the A1.

HS2 will can the service at Preston as happens now. They won't divert anywhere.

 

[thenorthern]

When the diversions last happened the Birmingham to Scotland via Preston services were all operated by Class 220/221 Voyagers and there was the Class 57 Thunderbird locomotives to haul the Class 390 Pendolinos over unnelectrified sections. The Manchester to Scotland via Preston services were also operated by Virgin Trains and used Class 220/221s.

Today I think only one of the Birmingham to Scotland services is booked as a Class 221 the rest are booked as Class 390s. Also Avanti don't have Class 57s that Virgin Trains used to have. Transpennine Express of course now use the 397s which wouldn't be able to operate via the Settle and Carlisle line.

 

[Starmill]

Virgin Trains (and Avanti West Coast after them) ceased the practice of hauling class 390 sets completely, not only over the S&C, as a result of reliability issues - although it's still technically a possibility in an emergency.

 

[Tom B]

The WCML is not very reliable during the winter months - lots of flooding etc. Maybe HS2 never thought about that when they intend to run the entire fast Anglo-Scottish service that way. There would need to be some robust diversionary routes. Or maybe some very fast electric buses up the M6 by then? As for the S&C being slow it doesn't seem to bother LNER with their diversions via Carlisle - these are very slow compared to the A1.

I caveat this with the fact that I haven't been on an ECML diversion via Carlisle for 8 years now, but I regularly would end up on them 2007-2014. It was hypothetically possible to get a bus from Newcastle and arrive at a similar time I believe, but I never took the option. It would sometimes be advertised by guards when approaching Newcastle. Personally I didn't mind the slightly longer journey if it avoided having to hoik luggage around.